<p>I would like to make something clear that my original post did not effectively communicate.</p>
<p>While I am happy socially, I am not happy academically or intellectually at UR.</p>
<p>That being said, I will likely take the advice of PuzzledParent.</p>
<p>Okay, try this. You’re going. Transfer to Vanderbilt. Really imagine leaving UR. No more UR people. Step over the line and plan moving. See how that feels. </p>
<p>To be honest. If you were at your state U and said that you were not happy academically or intellectually I might nod. I could see how that would be so though lots and lots of really smart kids do seem to manage at their state U. </p>
<p>However, the average admitting GPA at UR is high and there are a number of Ivy accepted kids there who financially couldn’t afford to go to them, so are at UR. There is no honors program at UR because most of the kids were honors kids. There are only honors classes.</p>
<p>I hate to tell you but those more academic/intellectual kids may only be in your imagination.</p>
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<p>I honestly don’t think you’d find a difference in this at Vandy. The social fit is different, but not the academic caliber of student based upon those I know who chose each place. (They both get good students.)</p>
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<p>My older D had the same reaction as you when we visited. She thought that it was going to be her safety, but she saw someone she knew from one of her classes who she knew wasn’t academically strong and it turned her off. She’s at an elite school now and really thrives in the intellectual environment of like-minded peers. My younger D loved Rochester, but it was her clear 2nd choice, and she’s was accepted somewhere not too different ED. </p>
<p>This is a Rochester board, so you’ll get a pro-Rochester bias. I think I’m more neutral. I don’t think you are dumb at all. I understand what you are looking for.</p>
<p>I would say that it’s worth transferring and trying to find the academic community that you seek. You already know that it’s not quite there at Rochester, so I don’t see the downside other than your relationships with people. I can’t assess what these mean to you - that’s really personal. If you really end up hating Vanderbilt, you can probably transfer back to Rochester pretty easily. I do think that you will find more competition at Vanderbilt - it’s much more selective. </p>
<p>Good luck either way.</p>
<p>Well, I see someone didn’t read the thread. This is what bothers me: you take the time to post something with actual thinking in it - and even some actual research behind it - and it comes to nothing because people can’t be bothered to read.</p>
<p>Lergnom, what’s your point</p>
<p>You told her that the reasons she cited were dumb. I disagree.</p>
<p>I go to University of Chicago, reputed to be one of the most intellectual, academic, and rigorous schools. In many ways it has been this, but I still have easy intro courses, meet very unintellectual people, and can manage a full courseload (12 hours of class) well with 10 hours of work per week and 6 hours of lab each week, plus schoolwork. I’ve been often dissatisfied with fellow students and courses for not challenging me, but I know in latter years is when I’ll be pushed academically and mentally challenged. One thing that is lacking for me is my social life, which is really helpful and I don’t think you should give it up since you have it at UR. </p>
<p>I was admitted to UR, though never visited. I applied because of UR’s curriculum and how I could find ways to challenge myself. The average admit is no slack at UR, there are brilliant people and professors there. You have to find them, find a way to push yourself, and don’t take for granted how happy you are. I wish I had less work and could do more fun things, and its not like the schoolwork I’m doing is challenging it just takes alot of time. </p>
<p>I think upper level courses will be more challenging for you, and if you graduate with a great GPA, having had a great time as well, that’s the most you can ask for.</p>
<p>URHopeful, can you describe in more detail what you mean by not academically and intellectually happy?</p>
<p>Maybe it’s possible neither school is just right. Kids at Vandy are certainly smart (just as they are at UR), and maybe they will be very academic (maybe) but I’m not at all confident that it is intellectual or more intellectual. The kid above ironically is telling you about Chicago. In my mind, that would be more intellectual…or Swarthmore…or Wesleyan. You can’t completely separate the social from the intellectual. At Vandy kids are going to be getting dressed for their dates to the football games and very focused on getting to the frat parties. I honestly don’t know how many are going to sitting around talking about Nietzsche or in the lab all weekend making new discoveries.</p>
<p>I’m basically looking for a brighter, less apathetic student body.</p>
<p>Regarding Vanderbilt’s stereotypes: I have heard that when comparing the most recent classes to upperclassman, a stark contrast can be seen. Vanderbilt’s dramatic increase in selectivity seems to have led to more academically motivated incoming classes.</p>
<p>I agree that neither school is really for me. Knowing what I know now, U Chicago would probably be a what i’m looking for. Unfortunately, transfer admissions there is out of my reach.</p>
<p>I actually did apply to Wesleyan, and should hear back in two weeks or so. Two concerns about it: I don’t drink/smoke, and their tiny endowment.</p>
<p>I get the drinking/smoking, but I don’t get the endowment concern. Wesleyan isn’t going anywhere. </p>
<p>Selectivity correlates with very smart, but not necessarily with intellectual. Reed accepts almost 50% of it applicants and I can promise you it is significantly more intellectual than Vandy.</p>
<p>You actually sound like you should leave UR. 3 more years is a long time to feel that down about your school. I doubt you’re going to like somewhere else more, but you never know. I mean, UR actually, comparatively, is considered very academic. If it was weak, most would think that would be in the social area, where you say you are happy, although it isn’t completely clear why you would be happy socially if you are an environment you think is inadequate.</p>
<p>Maybe you should utilize the counseling services. Seriously. Would probably be very helpful.</p>
<p>You should post on the Vanderbilt board also with the same title. When is your decision date.</p>
<p>I, too, am wondering what, exactly, you mean. Are you looking for a school full of introverts who do nothing but study? If so, that may be difficult to find.</p>
<p>My guy had incoming stats that would put him at or above the top 25% of pretty much any school including tippy top. He loves intellectual conversations and has them often with other students. He knows his profs and they know him. He had a choice of two lab/research jobs (and chose one). He has a 4.0 taking traditionally tough classes that the pre-med advisers don’t suggest taking all at once (he studies quite a bit for his grades). He chooses not to drink or go to drinking parties and doesn’t smoke. He has plenty of intellectual peers he enjoys talking with, but he also fills his life doing other things he enjoys like American Sign Language, Improv, Dance, a work study job, and generally going out and doing things on or off campus, so I suppose it could look like he’s having “too much fun” and “isn’t serious.”</p>
<p>OR, perhaps you haven’t found your crowd for peers? He’ll fully admit there are some students there who he’s surprised even made it in the school. While he likes and gets along with pretty much anyone (one exception), those aren’t the students he chooses to spend time with. There are plenty of others like my guy around. Have you gotten involved in research yet? Have you made an effort to contact your profs? Are you in study groups with those striving for As? I assume you have a 4.0. If you’re one who doesn’t need to study for the grades, I’m sure study groups would love to have you and you’d likely find some peers there.</p>
<p>From Ivy schools to Honors Colleges in (most) state schools, there’s a peer group for high achievers, but you do have to find it. </p>
<p>From Ivy schools to anywhere there are those who are in school for the socialization and I suppose it could seem like ALL are that way if you aren’t selective with your peer group.</p>
<p>I can’t think of any college where ALL the students are 100% academic/intellectual. It’s far more like the U Chicago student reported…</p>
<p>As is real life…</p>
<p>BTW, anyone interested in misunderstood metrics like “selectivity” should check out Simpson’s Paradox. The [wiki</a> entry](<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simpson’s_paradox]wiki">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simpson’s_paradox) for it is pretty good.</p>
<p>The people who push college rankings rely on the innumeracy of people. Taking apart this process - of creating lousy metrics and cloaking what they actually contain - would make an interesting and provocative lecture. I can think of many examples beyond college rankings. It’s more than “lying with statistics” but the process by which they use human tendencies to do that.</p>
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<p>I stand corrected. My guy is going to do both research jobs over the summer - and is looking forward to both of them. At least one of them is working in coordination with other such “lower reputation” schools as Johns Hopkins and Berkeley, etc. - his research part still happening at URoc.</p>
<p>Quite honestly, any college experience is what you make of it. Once you get to higher levels (or larger schools with Honors Colleges), opportunities are there - IF you go for them. My oldest’s LAC would never have such opportunities, but then again, research wasn’t one of his goals for his education, so he has no regrets. It was one of the primary goals for middle son. His work and his attitude got him the opportunities. No one knocked on his door and asked him to “come play” and we certainly don’t know anyone in those fields to network with - plus our donation level speaks nothing - or less. It was all him. I’m excited for him.</p>
<p>If you opted to go elsewhere, I hope you do like your new school, but the best advice I can give is to get out there and be active with profs and like-minded students.</p>