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as one previous poster wrote, hopefully you will never have a child of your own that you will need to obtain accomodations for.
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<p>Can you stop arguing this way? It's a logical fallacy, appeal to emotion (Fallacy:</a> Appeal to Emotion) to make a point like that:</p>
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This sort of "reasoning" is quite evidently fallacious. It is fallacious because using various tactics to incite emotions in people does not serve as evidence for a claim.
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<p>You're reading my post way too literally amb3r........</p>
<p>Maybe your reading comp isn't so good after all.</p>
<p>BTW, of course influencing people's emotions work. It's called "making people realize what it's like to be _________." It's a completely fair question. Someone makes an argument and you say the statement is unfair in debate? Are you desperate?</p>
<p>All right, so tell me how to read your post. Go ahead, I'll give you another try to come up with something that makes half a bit of sense (unlike your previous claims that you need more processing skills on the SAT than in a job).</p>
<p>There is no need for me to explain what is wrong with using a LOGICAL FALLACY in an argument. Do you not agree that appeal to emotion is truly a logical fallacy? Look it up on the 'net. It is one of the most commonly seen logical fallacies. </p>
<p>I am not threatened by logical fallacies (nor am I desperate in any way), but rather irritated by them, as they serve no purpose but to distort and manipulate the truth. If you don't understand why, perhaps you should take a basic psychology course. Make a point without resorting to logical fallacy, and I'll happily give you a serious reply.</p>
<p>Someone with a 36 is asking how to interpret a plain-language statement? Fine.</p>
<p>A learning disability impedes the ability to learn, but we covered that already. How does it impede the ability to learn? Well, in many different ways; it depends on the disability. In my case, verbal or sensory signals take longer to comprehend, especially in large bursts. (This means putting your hand on the stove gives you the same response, and not a 5 second delay, thankfully.) For example, I usually have to read a question three or four times before I understand it. The same goes for some parts of books. In fact, in that case I may even reach my 10th read before I even get the gist of what's going on.</p>
<p>The same applies to an SAT/ACT problem. The question being asked must typically go through multiple read-throughs before it is understood.</p>
<p>You tried to make some desperate point that I was somehow "learning" during the test, but if you read my post carefully at all you would have known otherwise.</p>
<p>You really have no idea how to sound coherent, do you? Every post you make contradicts the last. </p>
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You tried to make some desperate point that I was somehow "learning" during the test, but if you read my post carefully at all you would have known otherwise.
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<p>VS. previously:</p>
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Remember you also have to "learn" the question. In other words, a processing issue!
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<p>LOL. 'NUFF SAID!</p>
<p>BTW let us remember WHY we are talking about this. Your very first point was that LD kids are not disadvantaged by their disabilities the workplace: </p>
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It is called a LEARNING disability for a reason. If it were otherwise, it would be classified as a NEUROLOGICAL disorder!
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<p>Your next was that LD kids are disadvantaged on a four hour standardized test, aka the ACT/SAT.</p>
<p>Your final is that I have desperately been trying to convince you that the ACT/SAT require learning. So I suppose you don't believe me. All right, then let's say the ACT/SAT don't require learning. In that case, LD kids should not be disadvantaged by their disabilities. No accomodations necessary.</p>
<p>My g-d........did you cheat on the SAT/ACT critical reading? Seriously.</p>
<p>BTW, Learning = Understanding, in case you couldn't draw that connection.</p>
<p>Nuff said.</p>
<p>check off 1/3 of this as a test on LD and tell me any kid that would have 1/3 of these issues would do well on any standardized test with no accomodation. </p>
<p>Think Im using logical fallacy to debate with you? read the IDEA statistics on disabilities that has been collected this year </p>
<p>dvm:</p>
<p>Haha. Hey buddy, using ad hominem attacks against my CR/W/E/R scores is irrelevant to the matter at hand. And my scores speak for themselves, so let's not dwell on them. Besides, there are much better measures of reading comprehension and logic than some silly standardized testing.</p>
<p>After reading through this whole thread (yea the whole thing) I think you should all stop trying to reason with this amb3r person because it's obvious he/she has a one track mind. Like a brickwall, I might add. Very petty to worry about a kid with a learning disorder getting extra time on a test.</p>
<p>Both side are pretty sad in this case; </p>
<p>amb3r seems to be making a big deal out of all this, despite the fact that I agree 100% with his views, let this rest.</p>
<p>pro-extension people; you guys call for "equality" via the creation of "inequality";
We might as well pass out M.D. to everyone. Being a doctor is rather simple and monotonous; getting there is the hard part. Of course, everyone has the mental ability to be one. Getting ahead on one test wouldn't do you any good on the MACT, LSAT, GMAT, PCAT, etc...</p>
<p>A immigrant can ace the ACT verbal if he/she knows every word; He/she DESERVES the the opportunity and has the ability to do well. oh snap, disadvantage! How about some time and a lil dictionary?</p>
<p>amb3r,
It, they, do cross over into neurological disorders. Nonverbal learning disorder (left hemisphere dysfunction) is classified in the DSM III-R as a neurological disorder, and isn't even referred to as a learning disability. Variances in processing information involve different parts of the brain, right/left hemisphere efficiency, areas of grey matter, and other neurological alterations. However, you demonstrate greatest interest in the sport of systematically picking apart other's views, as opposed to an even handed exchange of information and opinions. Bravo to those of you who are doing double or triple duty, regardless of accomodations, simply because you want to learn.</p>
<p>Immigrants/Foreign language students have the TOEFL to prove their ability and accomodations are provided for Graduate exams, as long as the learning disability is clearly documented.</p>
<p>Now you're saying we're in the same situation as immigrants? Are immigrants protected by the Americans with Disabilities Act too? They're not disabled! Stop taking learning disorders out of perspective!</p>
<p>Just to make a quick point, if there was a serious problem with LD people succeeding in their careers, specifically medical professions, they wouldn't be licensed to practice. Heck, can you say "lawsuit?" If LD people who get accommodations were a serious problem and a threat to our work force, not only would the government have done something about it, but surely all the testing agencies, not just SAT and ACT, would take action as well.</p>
<p>Because you appear to completely misunderstand the plight of the LD population, spend at least 15 minutes browsing this area of CC. Enjoy the experience.</p>
<p>"Americans with Disabilities" deserve more rights than "Immigrants"?</p>
<p>If you have a disability; learn to overcome it. If you can't then obviously you should take a different path in life.</p>
<p>If a 40 year old immigrant comes here and is unable to learn English efficiently and becomes an American citizen, should we treat him/her differently by giving them advantages in job application/etc?</p>
<p>Helping LD is as justified as Affirmative Action for 300k income URM families.</p>
<p>Do you also supporting adding 2000 score to someone with Downs syndrome? If not, what will make LD sufferers more eligible than people with much worse disabilities?</p>
<p>noobcake is making a LOT of sense. It's refreshing to hear this side of the argument after going to an uber-liberal high school which caters to everyone's special "needs" with extended time.</p>
<p>They should have extended my time, shoot! English is neither my best nor my first language.</p>
<p>The lack of understanding of people with ADD and LD shown by these posts is beyond trying to respond to. These students are not going to be threatening your admission to Ivies because they receive extra time on a test. If you don't have anything better to do than worry about them "bragging " then you are too immature for an elite college. In most cases these students need the accommodations to be admitted to colleges to challenge their level of intelligence in the areas where they may excel. People with these problems are well aware of what their limitations may be in the workplace and will seek out careers that allow them to use their abilities and talents. It is not easy to deal with these limitations when you may have a mind full of knowledge and creative ideas but struggle in many ways in our school environment. Any student with ADD or LD would gladly exchange their extra time in order to be "normal". As a society we need to help people to reach their potential, not worry that someone may get a slight advantage in the college admissions game.</p>
<p>Cad,</p>
<p>You've said it all, and said it well.</p>
<p>Well said cad.</p>
<p>So many LD children are extremely intelligent but struggle in certain environments. Are you going to banish them from college simply because they're not "normal." Heck, are you guys suggesting another "final solution," education style? This is how it would play out:</p>
<p>LD Kid: I'm in the 5th grade but struggling with my homework, so these friendly school psychologists gave me some sweet meds. I was also demoted into a remedial class that they said would be "more at my level." I don't like this. I'm moving out!</p>
<p>Amb3r or noobcake as a school administrator. Take your pick: Not so fast!</p>
<p>LD Kid: Amb3r/noobcake!</p>
<p>Amb3r/noobcake: Though you have an intelligent mind, you are not succeeding in the regular environment. This remedial class is the only alternative after I helped push the legislation to abolish accommodations. Sure, this is too easy for you, but it is the only place you can get good grades. (And the only way we don't get screwed over by NCLB)</p>
<p>LD Kid: Will I still get a good education in the end?</p>
<p>Amb3r/noobcake: Of course! That community college down the road will be a perfect fit for your current placement. Since we're not letting you out of these remedial classes because accommodations are illegal, that is your goal.</p>
<p>LD Kid: I'm going to commit suicide now because I'm not being allowed to demonstrate my potential.</p>
<p>Amb3r/noobcake: You go do that. You won't be useful in the workforce in your adult life anyway.</p>
<p>Please remember this is partially comical, and not meant to be a direct interpretation of their position.</p>