<p>Its a criminal offense, though its hard to pinpoint it exactly</p>
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<p>Qatar Airways Flight 84. :)</p>
<p>Apparently he was surprised by the verdict. Deported? Hard to know if that would be too harsh or if that would make his life easier. He wouldn’t be notorious in India and could easily resume a normal life. Has he expressed any remorse over his actions? What a shame 2+ lives destroyed needlessly! (I say + because I doubt the girl whose computer was used/star witness is doing too well either and this will follow her for rest of her life as well unless she assumes a new identity).</p>
<p>Do colleges bear any responsibility in this, and other “roommate from hell” situations? In many ways dorms are like mini Lord of the flies situations since the dorms are pretty much a free for all, no rules re living arrangements these days. They randomly assign roommates and throw many freshmen into difficult/unusual roommate situations and just expect these kids to deal with it all in a mature manner and “work it out” between themselves… not just talking about bias issue here. Being constantly sexiled (gay or straight ) is a bummer for any student. Noise/incompatible schedule issues can play havoc on kids lives. in many ways these situations boil down to power issues and room rights – Most students rise to the occasion and have a good experience but it seems like a good 10-15% of students end up in “roommate from hell/major selfish uncompromising idiot” for a year and schools don’t seem to do alot to help. Is too much expected of freshman?</p>
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<p>He may not have taken the plea because it might lead to his deportation. If you are found not guilty, you don’t have to sweat the INS. He may not have wanted to take the chance.</p>
<p>Guilty! Yay! This won’t bring Tyler back, but it may stop Dharuns of the future from creating environments in which future Tylers feel alienated and do something drastic about it. Hope he gets a lot of time behind bars.</p>
<p>Well…should have taken the community service/probation deal…</p>
<p>He was dumb to have not taken the plea bargain, but who knows what advice his attorneys gave him?
He was dumb to have done this mean and invasive recording and then broadcasting it, but I see him as more of a thoughtless idiotic fool, than a bully. However in NJ it is a crime…</p>
<p>Interestingly enough, poor Clementi knew of the earlier recording and still went ahead with the second encounter. Say what?</p>
<p>Clementi actually posted this on a Gay message board, so what on earth was he thinking? </p>
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<p>This is so tragic, 2 wasted lives.
I would advise all students to refuse if their roommates want to borrow the room for sexual purposes. Tell them to go elsewhere.</p>
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<p>What’s the difference between a thoughtless idiotic fool and a bully? Seems to me, if it looks like a duck and it walks like a duck and it quacks like a duck, it’s a duck.</p>
<p>To answer a previous question, I’d bet the guy didn’t take the plea agreement because he would have a felony conviction on his record. This would be on his record his entire life, and would come up every time he applied for a job. The deportation threat may have also dissuaded him.</p>
<p>The ruling was controversial, but what is not in question is that the defendant broke privacy laws. The only controversy is that this is the first time hate crime laws have been used in a crime that did not involve direct physical harm to the victim.</p>
<p>I’m stepping into a minefield, but . . .
I don’t believe he should be deported. The portrayal in The New Yorker (Feb. 6, 2012) could be wrong, but based on that story the pop media narrative is very different from how things really unfolded. What Ravi did was wrong. However, on the flip side, his roommate went away to college and immediately (first 3 weeks of school) started acting out on things that he had previously been exploring online. He brought an adult man, not a Rutgers student, into the room on several occasions. That was also wrong. Can you imagine if it were 2 girls and one was bringing adult men met on the internet into the dorm room? Ravi was immature and should not have watched the encounter of shared with friends once he knew what he would see, but I don’t see the long term harassment, hate crime, intent in that. Clementi was, by the New Yorker account, depressed, questioning and acting out when he arrived at school. It is tragic that he carried that to the extreme end, but I believe that he was troubled and on the edge before he got to school. What Ravi did was wrong, but he did not kill his roommate or perpetrate a hate crime.
I may be over-sharing here, but a million years ago my roommate and I weren’t making those kinds of “can I use the room” agreements until well into the school year and when we had actual boyfriends who were students.
Remember, this was not some year long premeditated vendetta - it was the first 3 weeks of school.</p>
<p>A sad story all around. The New Yorker had a nice article on the story.</p>
<p>[Tyler</a> Clementi’s Suicide and Dharun Ravi’s Trial | The New Yorker](<a href=“The Story of a Suicide | The New Yorker”>The Story of a Suicide | The New Yorker)</p>
<p>Edit: Crosspost with saintfan.</p>
<p>This ties into our discussion on “zero tolerance”</p>
<p>If we accept for a moment that Clementi was troubled in his own life, roommate aside, should Ravi not be able to learn from his mistake? I believe that his actions were wrong but I also believe that he was, to an extent, made a scapegoat to emphasize a zero tolerance policy. I think he should have some opportunity for learning and redemption. Based on all his online posts, Clementi certainly bears some responsibility for how the circumstances unfolded. This is not someone being offended because 2 men kissed in public. If the genders were different, I think most people would find Clementi’s behavior just as objectionable as Ravi’s.</p>
<p>There is a new film coming out called Bully. I heard an excerpt yesterday in the Diane Rhems show. It knocked me flat. Bullying ruins kids’ lives.</p>
<p>There are two things about this verdict which concern me. One is that the jurors said they wanted to “send a message.” Well, the point of justice is not to send a message but to determine, dispassionately, whether a crime was committed. While Ravi’s actions were stupid and cruel, I question whether he ought to go to jail for 5-10 years for them. There are people who do things equally bad who get probation and community service. We should not be making examples of 18-year-olds to appease our moral outrage. That is cowardly.</p>
<p>Secondly, I am troubled by the assumption that Ravi “caused” Tyler Clementi’s suicide. We can never know the reason why someone decides to take his life. Clementi was, by some accounts, already “out” and it was not a secret or a mystery to many of his acquaintances. I do not believe that Ravi ought to be held legally culpable for the death of Tyler Clementi. I think he is, in reality, being held responsible for this and that is why the book was thrown at him.</p>
<p>^^ agree on premise, but I’m not sure this case is the clear demonstration of that. We can be opposed to bullying and all those tragic cases in schools and agree that administrators need to stop turning a blind eye without glossing over to the nuances of this particular case.</p>
<p>Really agree with NJSue, my “agree, but . . .” was in response to Snowdog.</p>
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<p>I agree. I think a significant part of the verdict is because Clementi killed himself. If Ravi did the same actions, but Clementi simply reported Ravi to the police or college authorities, the punishment would not nearly be severe (correct me if i’m wrong).</p>
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<p>I don’t think you’re wrong. But the prosecutor apparently does. From [new</a> york times](<a href=“https://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/17/nyregion/defendant-guilty-in-rutgers-case.html?pagewanted=2&_r=1]new”>https://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/17/nyregion/defendant-guilty-in-rutgers-case.html?pagewanted=2&_r=1):
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<p>The defendant was not found guilty of “bullying,” he was found guilty of a hate crime. If the victim had not taken his own life, the punishment might not have been as severe. Unfortunately for the person convicted of 15 counts, he did.</p>
<p>Edited to add: Jumping off the George Washington bridge is one of the scariest things I can imagine.</p>