<p>Saint fan… Are you serious.? Kind of arrogant to think your knowledge of the case is better than the actual jurors. The bully is a punk, enough said. It is sad that his parents didn’t bring him up better. He should have been able to figure out a better way to deal with the problem. It is sad that you blame the victim for the incredibly mean and immature actions of a bully. </p>
<p>Glad to see that the tide is turning…parents listen up…you can no longer get away with teaching your kids that they are “better” than others and that their actions will always be justified.</p>
<p>It is sad that Ravi made those choices. What I said is that Clementi also made poor choices which have been downplayed in the coverage in favor of the “clean” bullying story.</p>
<p>Still don’t understand why single rooms aren’t more common even if you’re willing to pay for it - you have kids getting independence for the first time and there’s bound to be friction.</p>
<p>Any suicide is a tragedy. And the pain will never go away for the Clementis.
However.
Because Clementi committed suicide (for reasons that we don’t even know) his own decision to keep hooking up in the dorm room in spite of knowing about the webcam will never be questioned.</p>
<p>This was a complete invasion of privacy on the part of Ravi, yet strangely enough, there seemed to have been some knowledge of it on the other side. It is twisted.</p>
<p>This is probably true. And, I think, wrong. There is no way that anyone can prove that Clementi took his life as a direct result of Ravi’s actions. The prosecution did not even try. They focused on Ravi’s motives and tried to establish that he was a homophobe.</p>
<p>I do not think that motives are as important as actions. Personally, I have a big problem with the whole notion of “hate crimes” because they criminalize thought. It’s too bad if Ravi is a homophobe, but what really matters is what he did, not what he thought. I think we are going down a very dangerous road if we start criminalizing people’s thoughts. I am very uncomfortable with the precedent set by this trial.</p>
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<p>Do you really know anyone who actually teaches their children this? Because I don’t. I doubt that Ravi thought at all about whether his actions were “justified.” He was just a stupid kid with a roommate problem that he dealt with very poorly.</p>
<p>Yuk, I’m reminded of the argument that girls that dress provocatively deserved to be raped. And yes, people that act in socially inappropriate ways were most likely taught at home that their behavior is somehow justified. The new generation of college students has no tolerance for bullying. If you can’t figure out what it is and when you’re doing it, well you’re just plain stupid.</p>
<p>More single rooms— good idea! Students should not have to deal with the riff raff. What if your roommate believed in a different “God”? Oh the horror! I didn’t send my child to college to learn how to get along and understand others. Haha, the jokes on you!</p>
<p>Do you see a difference between social inappropriateness and a crime? Should we prosecute people and put them in jail for a decade for being jerks and having bad manners? Where is the line that separates being a jerk from being a criminal? Is it simply based on public sentiment at any given time? Because if so, it’s a miscarriage of justice.</p>
<p>Rape is a physical assault, a clear crime. No one was physically assaulted in this case.</p>
<p>Can a judge in the case decide whether to deport? Whatever we think, he is now convicted of multiple felonies. I thought that deportation is up to the Immigration and Naturalization Service (and an immigration judge).</p>
<p>according to the article, he will face deportation after he serves time in prison.</p>
<p>I think the only reason they are bringing that up is because he was offered a plea deal in which he would serve community service hours only and they would “help” him not get deported, but he turned it down.</p>
<p>I wonder if his attorneys advised him to turn that down?</p>
<p>Ah…so much for “actus non facit reum nisi mens sit rea” (“the act does not make a person guilty unless the mind is also guilty”) since mens rea - intent - has always been a necessary element of “criminal” acts. And is why we have so many degrees of different crime (yes eve rape). And why proving guilt of many crimes is often NOT so clear cut.</p>
<p>I read somewhere that he would have had to admit a bias crime as part of that plea bargain, and he was very adamant about having no malice, hate or bias towards his roommate nor any gay people. And many witnesses testified to that also. </p>
<p>If you read the the entire 15-count charges, and the manner in which the jury returned each item, it seems that he was acquitted on many of the bias intimidation but not on others. It’s complicated.</p>
<p>I’m appalled by the verdict and the possible sentence. Had Tyler not committed suicide, this case would never have made it to the prosecutor, so what the prosecutor says he would have done is irrelevant. Clemente had made a complaint to the RA and was seeking a new room. In the ordinary course of things, Ravi would have been admonished for being a little ****, Clemente would have been admonished for bringing a stranger into his shared room and sexiling his roommate, a new room assignment would have been made, and that would have been the end of it. So even though no one has been able to make any connection between the incident and Clementi’s suicide, his death means that a young man may go to prison and will certainly will have a criminal record that will affect the rest of his life, and all because he was a jerky 18-year old who never in a million years would have guessed that what he did constituted a felony. He shouldn’t have been prosecuted in the first place, and, it goes without saying, he should have swallowed his pride and accepted the modest plea deal. This is a tragedy all around.</p>
<p>This is an excellent point that there is precedence for criminalizing thought. However, up to know, the law has never distinguished beyond intent. That is, it doesn’t say that beating someone because you are jealous of them is better/worse than beating someone because they stole something from you. In general, motive only exists to prove the act happened and that there was intent.</p>
<p>After reading the New Yorker article, I didn’t get the impression that it was a hate crime motivated by Clementi’s sexual orientation, despicable as Ravi’s actions were and as tragic as Clementi’s death was. Rather, I got the impression that Ravi was an immature jerk who was an incredible ***hole to pretty much everyone (or at least a considerable number of people) he came across, regardless of sexual orientation. It does sound like invasion of privacy for sure but not necessarily a hate crime, IMO. It’s obviously pure speculation, but I think Ravi might have done the same thing to a heterosexual roommate,.</p>
<p>There are many things I dont understand - as a parent, as an immigrant, interested-in-law type,</p>
<p>we all know that youngsters these days- highschoolers - are away of the gay scene. They also know what homophobia means and that they need to be careful of how their actions can be perceived. so this begs the question, Was Dharun not thinking about how it would play out? did the lawyers bring in character witnesses? </p>
<p>all 18 year olds want to fit in - so to know that your escapades have been filmed and distributed, will tip anyone over the edge. </p>
<p>Dharun was brought to the US as a young child by his parents. So he would be a citizen (99% i would think). So where does the deportation come in?</p>
<p>How did the lawyers not convince him to take the plea? I have not heard of any jurist weighing in on this. </p>
<p>as a parent, I was apalled to know that overnight visitors were permitted into the dorms. My daughter had classmate from back home come to visit. She has visited him at Johns Hopkins. Her roommate has had friends over and they are both okay. I am not, still I think even though the visiting friend is my godson!!</p>
<p>we send them off to college, give them adult responsibilities, but it is clear that they do not know how to carry themselves and are unable to grasp the full extent of their actions. </p>
<p>My heart cries for the Clementis, the Ravis - all those involved. what a heartbreaking situation.</p>