Should you pass on college because of the debt?

Parents Forum
81

<p>If I could go back in time, I would not have gone straight to college after high school. I would have gotten a job, traveled, pursued my dream of acting, really done ANYTHING but start college with taking out $3500 in student loans. That’s not a huge amount, but it ended up increasing every year and now I’m going to be a senior with a substantial amount of debt with a degree in a subject I do not care to pursue. (My major is French and I don’t want to do a job that involves French.)</p>

<p>You also don’t want to feel like you’re a “drop-out”. So for me, even though I don’t think I’ll be using my degree any time soon (or actually want to pursue a field that involves having a degree), I also feel like I can’t not finish because I need to finish something that I started.</p>

<p>I’ve done well in college. I have a 3.9 GPA. I got to spend a year in France. I lived in the dorms. I’ve been to all of the football games. I am immensely proud of my college. Even after all of that, I still wouldn’t go back and do it again. Simply because I spent four years and thousands of dollars on a degree that I actually don’t want anything to do with. If I started my freshman year over again, I would not have chosen French as a major.</p>

<p>I think a LOT of people would be better served taking a year or two off of school before making a huge commitment like a university-level education. Some kids have their parents forking over all four years. That’s fine. They can have fun. I, personally, am not that lucky and wish that instead of being pushed into college that someone would have said “AUGirl. It’s okay. You want to move to Hollywood and pursue your dream of acting? You know what. You’re young. You can do that. If it doesn’t work out, college will still be there in ten years and by then, you may <em>actually</em> know what you want to do in the world.”</p>

<p>I really don’t think that DEBT is properly explained to 18-year-olds. You wouldn’t give someone a loan on a house if they were unemployed (or under-employed). Then WHY IN THE HECK do we trust 18-year-olds with potentially $150,000 in debt without PROPERLY warning them?</p>

<p>I say this all as a girl who chose to go to her in-state school because it was the “affordable” option. I’ve kept all of my scholarships (even gained more than $10,000 extra in the run), chosen the cheapest living situations I could, not had a car, and I’ve still managed to rack up a debt of more than $15,000. Luckily, I’m graduating this year (on time). Unfortunately, my degree doesn’t really guarantee much more than a minimum wage job, so paying off that debt won’t be easy.</p>

82

<p>" he could finish his general education at a local CC and STILL not afford to finish his degree somewhere else. How the heck is he supposed to pay for 22k+ yearly COA (junior and senior years) if all he is offered are the Pell Grant and Direct Loans? "</p>

<p>And that is the dilemma we are facing. I realize that DS can’t take large amounts of loans out in his own name, so that is going to mean WE are going to have to do it for him. </p>

<p>DH is balking at this, as his job is iffy from one year to the next, plus we have a younger DD just entering HS. </p>

<p>There have been a number of suggestions here about ways to possibly save $$, but they are the exceptions in many cases.</p>

<p>What it ultimately comes down to is taking out large loans, or not having your kid attend college. For the poster above, I would never have taken out loans for her, not for that major and not w/ that attitude. </p>

<p>BUT, when you have a kid who has the potential to do really well, and is committed to it, then I think the answer to the OP’s question, for us, would be NO, we are not passing on college for our son. </p>

<p>I don’t think too many posters here actually answered that question. </p>

<p>I would be curious what the answer is for those who, like us, are also finding a college education as not really affordable. </p>

<p>Do you pass or college or take on the debt?</p>

83

<p>@laralei‌
It is unfortunate that your family is going through the situation I explained. I, too, would face the same if I went to my local CC <em>now</em> and then transferred any four-year university two years from now.
The solution would require much effort both from community colleges and state-funded universities (including programs that lead from branch campuses to flagships): if, and only if if the transfer student’s major is not offered by any state-funded universities within a 100-mile radius from the student’s residence, then the student in question should be eligible for additional, state-subsidized loans to offset the need for Parent PLUS loans.</p>

84

<p>@oldmom4896‌ I see. We must have maxed it out or something. My son just got word about a scholarship we didn’t expect so he’s down to less than $1000 in a Perkins loan. He’s getting off super easy this year, which is great. </p>

85

<p>@2016BarnardMom, Perkins loans are funded by federal money and have uniform rates, but colleges control how they give them out. I am sure the colleges are given guidelines but they have a lot of discretion. No transparency or predictability!</p>

86

<p>

</p>

<p>If this is directed to me:</p>

<p>I’m not sure what attitude you think I may have. I’m just being realistic and wish someone would have told me that it’s okay <em>not</em> to go to college. Way too many people think that you either go to college or you’re worth nothing. That isn’t the case. There’s also not a ticking time bomb on getting a degree. The people who I know who chose to wait and did something else first (whether it be traveling, working, join the military, etc.) ended up being much happier and confident in their decisions when it came down to college and a lot of the time had actually been able to stay out of debt because they were able to save up money from working and/or get extra money for being a “non-traditional” student.</p>

<p>Also, my major may be seen useless as many, but my initial intentions were to become a French teacher. It’s pretty much all I wanted to do in high school and I was very confident when I entered college that I was going to leave with a degree to teach French. However, my 17-year-old self is not the same as my 21-year-old self. After trying teaching, I realized it was not a field that I wanted to go into and frankly I’m burned out of school.</p>

<p>My Two Cents: Not going to college immediately is <em>not</em> the end of the world. It can actually be a good thing. That isn’t to say college isn’t worth it. But I also think not every single person who is qualified for a university-level education should go immediately.</p>

<p>I’ve become very debt averse since starting college. I remember in high school when I was looking over my financial aid, I thought “$3500 a year in loans isn’t too bad. That’s only $14000 after I graduate and a normal student graduates with like $20k, so it’s actually pretty good.” I now see those numbers in a totally different light and also realize that the cost of everything has gone up substantially since I’ve been in college, yet my financial aid (in non-loan terms) has gone up only minimally. My state scholarship never changes and I believe it’s been the same amount since they introduced it which was quite some time ago.</p>

87

<p>I don’t agree that AUGirl’s post shows a (negative) attitude of some sort.</p>

88

<p>I didn’t say it was negative, to me, it just sounds immature. I have one of them myself. And other than a used car to attend branch campus, we are not helping her with her college costs, at this time. She needs to do a lot more growing up first. </p>

<p>That is not an insult to AUGirl, but rather a confirmation that not everyone is ready for college upon graduation, some need to really do some soul searching first. . </p>

<p>BUT, when you do have a kid who is committed, knows what they want to pursue, a degree worth pursuing, then it goes back to the OP. Bypass college or take on debt. We will take on debt we really can’t afford to help him achieve it. </p>

89

<p>Most places in the US has some community college program within commutable distance and at affordable prices. Not always so to get that Bachelor’s degree, so yes, it can be a problem when there are NO four year state schools within commutable distance, and the cost of going away to college is about $25K minimum per year For those students and parents who have not a dime to put towards that cost, all that is guaranteed available is the Direct Loan for $7500 a year, and PELL if eligible for that. For transfers, funds are scarce, and the reality is that many schools only give the federal entitlements out for financial aid. </p>

<p>IMO, for cases like this, some sort of solution should be available from the state/federal governments, but there often is not. My advice in such cases is for the student to work and save, like a fiend for the summer and spring semester. Look into finding cheap off campus housing at one of the least expensive state schools, with social media, the internet the way it is, this is easier than ever. Go to school the spring term only or spring and summer if PELL money can work You can take the full Direct Loan for the spring term only, and summer rates are usually lower than the year. Careful planning is essential in such cases If a student has done well getting to junior status, then as a parent, I’d be more amenable about taking out a parent loan ( if denied for PLUS, student will get to borrow an additional $5K) since there is a chance that the Bachelor’s can be gotten in two years or so, and we are not dealing with a teenager fresh out of high school at this point. </p>

<p>The way it works for the vast majority of the population, is that they find jobs and eke out that degree, little at a time as they can afford to take the courses, maybe some online and can take a very long time. I’ve known many, many folks who have done this and are doing it. Some bombed out at the first or multiple college attempts. Some finally have decided to make a go at it, or maybe their jobs require a degree to move up. Many that I know have done well taking this route, though it is much slower and painstaking.</p>

90

<p>We do have universities within a 100 mile radius, but I would not think it possible to drive 2 hours twice daily back and forth to school, let a lone in the winter and the expense for gas would be $1,000 or more a month and then you’d be close to the room and board charge. </p>

<p>Or did you mean by 100 mile commuting distance, 50 miles one way, fredjan?</p>

91

<p>AUGirl, I’m sorry that your college education and student loan debt didn’t result in a degree/profession you enjoy doing. But could you imagine using your French degree in a different way? Maybe to teach English in a french speaking country or be an au pair in France? </p>

92

<p>@mommdc‌
100 miles was just the first thing that came into my mind, but that’s true - one hour of driving (50-60 miles) would be the ideal radius.</p>

93

<p>AUGirl, for some reason I know a lot of French majors, and while 3 of the 4 used their French as a first shoe in the door (all, ironically, answering the phones at different companies and needing to speak French if the speaker did), none of them stayed working in “French” for long. They learned the business and moved up. Two became lawyers, although one of those now teaches 4th grade after a top legal career (partner at a Wall Street firm), one became involved in telecommunications and is very high up in Qwest, and the final one (the only one with a fancy LAC degree) works in a NYC law firm but not as a lawyer, and she also teaches English as a second language. All are very good writers in English as you learn a lot of English grammar taking a foreign language. Yep, they were all quite poor after undergrad school, and they had to take jobs they hadn’t ‘dreamed’ of, but they did it.</p>

<p>Absolutely agree that 18 year olds have no idea about loans. But you know what? Many 35 year olds don’t either and they take out mortgages and car loans that are above their salaries too. </p>

94

<p>The irony of the situation that we are in - college is less affordable for many, yet high quality lectures for college level courses are more available than ever … and free (or very inexpensive) online. A student who really wanted to learn but can’t afford it for a year or two - having to work before starting college - is in a better position than ever before and doesn’t have to think about those years as wasted. Worried about getting rusty in Math? Calculus 1 is offered by Ohio State via coursera to keep up the math skills. Want to learn enough about programming to be more computer literate - there are a dozen good choices or more out there. So putting off college is risky, but not as risky as before since you can keep learning now in spare time - and MUCH easier than ever before. Some will choose to use ROTC or Americorps or other ways to pay for college, but for those who have to work for a year or two before starting at least are in a better position than before - and can get a head start preparing for the hard core classes. Coursera and similar online mechanisms are going to turn the college market upside down over the next 10 years (not replace it - but make some things much cheaper).</p>

95

<p>@Augirl, I recently came across this website announcing that the United Nations is offering its admission exam for young professionals for the first time since 2010. Perhaps that is something you might want to consider, for which your French language skills could be extremely useful.
<a href=“UN Careers”>UN Careers;

96

<p>Agree with @2018RiceParent‌. Many publics take a ton of AP & CLEP & transfer credit. You do still need to satisfy your school’s major and other requirements, but someone motivated can learn a lot and graduate from a good college.</p>

<p>Also, there’s Harvard Extension School.</p>

97

<p>Oh yeah, and if you are inclined to serve, NJ publics are tuition-free for NJ Guardsmen while IL publics are tuition free after one year in the IL National Guard. Meanwhile, Guard pay should cover room and board.</p>

98

<p>" Oh yeah, and if you are inclined to serve, NJ publics are tuition-free for NJ Guardsmen while IL publics are tuition free after one year in the IL National Guard. Meanwhile, Guard pay should cover room and board. "</p>

<p>Make sure you are “inclined to serve” and be willing to go to war. My friend was really planning on her DS accomplishing college this way. She did not realize how many guardsmen went to war and died in Iraq & .Afghanistan. </p>

<p>That is NOT a price I would be willing to pay to have my kid get a college education. </p>

99

<p>Between my 2 kids in college and us, we will have about $200,000 in debt.</p>

<p>I hate it but I feel it was of a necessity. I see it as an investment albeit an investment that is not without risk.</p>

<p>One child had Ivy League aspirations from the 7th grade. I encouraged her to go for it but honestly thought it was pipe dream. Oops! She did it. I told her if she wants to be a teacher or nurse or social worker that she was going to one of the schools offering her a free ride. She chose Wharton School. Ok, I think an investment in a Wharton UG degree is worth it.</p>

<p>The other child was a much harder case. He has Asperger’s Syndrome and dyscalculia (dyslexia for math). He also has tremendous artistic talent. He got a half scholarship to an art school which is still expensive but there were very little math requirements and it was close to home. The school is also one of the top 5-10 colleges in the country for his style of art, too. We chose to take on the debt to do what was best for him. We may still send him to welding school or plumbing or electrical so he can know a trade as well after graduation.</p>

<p>We can probably absorb more debt than most but it has been proven over and over again that most college degrees will pay for themselves and more over the long term. There are plenty of degrees that won’t though.</p>

<p>Often, I see kids choose to forgo college for financial reasons. I’ve never seen it work out for unskilled kids who stay local. Kids that join the military or learn a trade or, as one kid I know did, go to South Dakota or Texas to work the oil fields (the kid I know makes $80,0000/yr and has been on the job 6 months. He’ll get more hours and more money after a year on the job.</p>

<p>The rest of the kids are working several part-time retail jobs and often barely get 40 hours between 2-3 jobs. One kid said she skipped college to work to help her parents. Her parents situation has not been enriched by their daughters sacrifice. If whe went to school for engineering and got a job paying $65,000 at graduation and lived at home, she could really help her low skilled, low paid parents if her parents could hold out for 4-5 years. They’ve been broke for 25 years, a little longer wouldn’t hurt. I have another young family member that believes if she gets pregnant, she can get free assistance to go to college - not a strategy I approve of but that is her thinking right now. There are many more stories of kids who skip college for myriad reasons that are failing to launch than there are successes that I see. </p>

<p>The differences is a plan. The kid who plans to learn a trade or join the military or go to an oil field and takes whatever steps are necessary to do it without letting anyhing slow them down or stop them all succeed. Just like not all college kids succeed at college because they went without a plan.</p>

100

<p>@laralei:</p>

<p>Yep, serving in the military entails the risk of fighting and dying (or getting maimed or suffering from PSD). Definitely something kids should know before signing up.</p>