So you want an MA in IR?

Graduate School
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<p>I will likely be applying for an IR-related field masters program in 3-4 years. Currently I am a senior undergrad at Cornell. I know my weakness will be GPA, which will probably end up between 3.4 and 3.5. I haven’t done GRE’s yet, but I feel confident I’ll be able to do well on those. Here’s what I think I’ll have going for me though: 1) While GPA is low, it partly because of a decent workload at school, doing a double major in Economics and Government and two minors in International Relations and German Studies. 2) Fair amount of leadership/extra-extracurriculars. (President of an organization 2-years, Treasurer of International Affairs Society 2-years, officer role in another org. for 2-years, and this year running a 600 student high school Model UN conference). 3) What I think/hope would benefit me most is that I’ll be working at a policy think-tank for 1-year at the Manhattan Institute and after will serve 2 years in the Peace Corps (already received nomination). </p>

<p>So, despite low GPA, would that work experience make me competitive for a top-IR program? I’m hoping so, but I always have huge issues being able to judge my own resume.</p>

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<p>Hi Mikey,</p>

<p>If you end up with a 3.5 GPA from Cornell that’s not a weakness, that’s right about where you should be. Of course all of that experience you have will make you very competitive and give you a very fair shot at a top school. Serving in the Peace Corps will give you a major edge. I’m relying on it myself. I got back from Ukraine a year ago…what region is your nomination for? The more you do as a volunteer the better. I would suggest writing a grant. I feel that the grant writing experience will give me an edge in the application process. I’m applying for International Development programs right now and having something so relevant to what I want to do to talk about in my purpose statement is helpful. I know plenty of volunteers who because of Peace Corps are currently students at the top schools, George Washington University and Georgetown. So you have a lot going for you for sure. If you’d like any inside info on the Peace Corps, just ask. Of course if you’re going somewhere other than Eastern Europe my input will be limited, but there’s lots of groups on Facebook for questions.</p>

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<p>Hey Bigcountry,
Thanks for the info. I’m actually looking at programs like American and maybe GW. I don’t have any substantial work experience besides my internships, so I’m a little worried about that. From what I have seen on the admissions pages on these programs, my gpa is quite a bit below their average/median, but I’m confident that I can score higher on the GRE, which I’m hoping can offset my gpa a little bit. I figure it’s worth a shot to apply to programs in D.C. anyway, since the worst that can happen is losing the $50 application fee. </p>

<pre><code> I’m also considering Boston University’s program. The specializations and the courses the program offers are what I am interested in. However, I’ve read on here that going to school close to D.C. is better for connections. Has anyone heard anything about Boston University’s program? I haven’t seen much on here about it. I think I’d rather go to Boston University’s program than George Mason’s, even though Mason’s is right outside D.C. Boston seems to have a better program, and the school has a better reputation than Mason. But I’m sure everyone in D.C. has heard of Mason; whether or not that’s a good thing, I’m not sure.
</code></pre>

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<p>Hi,</p>

<p>I’ve been going through a lot of pages on this forum, and I guess I’m in the same boat as everybody! Except I only applied to 2 ‘upper-tier’ schools (Tufts and Columbia). I’m Canadian, so the prices are astronomical for me. My question is … how come nobody talks about the, uh, lowest tier schools? City College New York as a 17k a year (for foreigners) Masters program. Does anybody know anything about these programs? Obviously, going to a “famous” school has it’s perks but some of us really can’t afford it and cant’ deal with the poverty factor! Does anybody have any advice as to how my International Relations future could fare with a no-name-school?</p>

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<p>I’ll let you in on a little secret, echua: the supposed prestige of these schools ain’t all it’s cracked up to be.</p>

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<p>Waiting on early notification and getting antsy…has anyone heard yet?</p>

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<p>A few people on gradcafe said that they heard from Fletcher. Good news, hchambers?</p>

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<p>“I’ll let you in on a little secret, echua: the supposed prestige of these schools ain’t all it’s cracked up to be.”</p>

<p>Another little secret: the degree ain’t all it’s cracked up to be. Having said that, the better the school and brand name, the more valuable the degree. I think you’re essentially buying the brand name, as a lot of people in MPP/MIA/MPA programs think they didn’t learn much after graduating. So, Harvard > City College, no question.</p>

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<p>Atican: My point was that the ceiling for an entry-level career is pretty similar regardless of school in this field. If you work for the government, they don’t care where you got your degree. I don’t think you’re going to find a lot of people with BAs from Harvard going to work at a smallish non-profit for $30k per year, but you might find that from people who have MAs from the prestigious IR schools (and you’ll probably find people who went to the less prestigious ones as well). Point is, there is a lot more parity here than in some other fields where name can mean everything.</p>

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<p>This forum looks really helpful. Can anyone tell me their opinion on if they think I have a chance at grad school for an MAIR program? Possibly GWU or UCSD?</p>

<p>-graduated from UC Davis (top 10 public university)
-3.2 cumulative GPA, 3.4 major GPA
-double major: International Relations/Middle East South Asia Studies
-fluent in Farsi, proficient in Italian, Spanish, French
-President Model UN Conference, multiple leadership roles in Student Government
-two research internships with prof., will get letter of rec. from head of IR dept.
-started organization for underprivileged kids in Morocco
-volunteer abroad in Beijing for 1 month
-UN internship for 3 months in Washington, DC</p>

<p>-not sure of GRE scores yet</p>

<p>Any feedback would be appreciated…thanks all!</p>

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<p>hey hchambers86, i heard back from fletcher via early notification around christmas time, i got accepted :slight_smile: now just waiting on scholarship info, but that wont come for a couple months yet. did you get in?</p>

<p>In case other people are wondering about being accepted at Fletcher, here are my stats:
-3.88 Gpa, SUNY Geneseo grad in International Relations and Economics
-670V (95th percentile), 760Q (82nd percentilie), 5.5W (94th percentile) on GREs
-Summer internship at Dept of Commerce, two summers studying abroad in Moscow
-Current Peace Corps Volunteer
-Proficient in Armenian, Intermediate in Russian</p>

<p>I also got accepted at SAIS before joining the Peace Corps, but they won’t accept Armenian to pass the proficiency test so I probably won’t go there. Am waiting to hear from GT MSFS</p>

<p>Would anyone like to comment on Fletcher vs GT?</p>

<p>Good luck to everyone else</p>

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<p>Bigcountry83: “To be honest I can’t really find out if it’s [American] considered “better” or “worse” than GW” </p>

<p>American is inferior to GW by a significant margin. American is fine for IR, but compared to the internships garnered by average Gtown and GW students / grads, American is a distant 3rd among the three.</p>

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<p>"American is inferior to GW by a significant margin. "</p>

<p>In terms of street cred, and students perceptions, yes, this is true.</p>

<p>In terms of quality of faculty, <em>actual</em> academics, and job placement, that statement is completely untrue. SIS’s Development or Communication programs are inferior to GW by a “significant margin”? By what measure?</p>

<p>If one is going to the Ivy League schools, the DC Schools (GW-SAIS-AU-G’town), or the New York Schools (Maxwell, SIPA, Whitehead) it’s basically a wash. It really is, outside of the popularity contests of who is #2 and who is #9. They are all top schools with diverse students and outstanding professors. </p>

<p>It comes down to your academic interest, if the location of the school is condusive to potential future employers (i.e. go to New York if you’re hung up on UN, go to a DC school if you’re hung up on the WB). </p>

<p>Thing is in all of these schools, either professors or alumni know lots of people in top international organizations, or influential private companies.</p>

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<p>Job placement is most assuredly not the same between AU-GW-GTown, GW and GTown place far better, if you actually worked in the top places IE the WB, the IC, FP, or even major think tanks Heritage, CFR, etc you would see that GW & GTown are much greater represented proportionally and numerically speaking than AU. Do a few AU grads get into great placements? Of course. But one’s chances are significantly improved by attended GW - GTown. </p>

<p>As for Maxwell, etc…they are not remotely on par with SIPA or GW-GTown or the MPP / MPA programmes in the Ivies. Rankings do not matter nearly as much as prestige / where alumni have ended up.</p>

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<p>I do work at a major international organization in the DC Area. </p>

<p>I just don’t see it as you do. I’d say there’s a few schools you see regularly. The DC schools, and also international schools are a lot of them. </p>

<p>The most important thing is getting into an above average (doesn’t have to be the best). Is City U above avg? no. Is AU, just like GW, above average? YES. Is it <em>THE</em> best? No. Doesn’t have to be.</p>

<p>If one can get into an above average school i.e. one of the IR schools known within the field, AND they know what <em>they</em> want to do with their career, they absolutely will be fine.</p>

<p>I truly beleive that.</p>

<p>The level/grouping/recognition fo the school is important. </p>

<p>The <em>name</em> and <em>prestige</em> of a school though is vastly overrated. It impresses fellow message board posters, and other students more than it does actual employers and clients in the workplace.</p>

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<p>flyer: “Atican: My point was that the ceiling for an entry-level career is pretty similar regardless of school in this field…”</p>

<p>Well, I think that very statement is a bit off. The assumption for 80%+ of incoming students at IR/MPP/MPA programs is that they are exiting entry-level positions and ready to advance their careers beyond that. I work at a think tank, and the only MAs in entry-level positions I know of are from GW and Whitehead. One of the most basic assumptions working where I do in an entry-level position is that you’re leaving in 2-3 years to go to grad school (whether MBA, JD, or MIA/MPP/MPA). </p>

<p>superseiyan: “The level/grouping/recognition fo the school is important. The <em>name</em> and <em>prestige</em> of a school though is vastly overrated. It impresses fellow message board posters, and other students more than it does actual employers and clients in the workplace.”</p>

<p>The “level/grouping/recognition”, as you put it, is just another way of making generalizations about a school’s name and prestige. You’re saying Harvard won’t impress more than AU? You’re deluding yourself.</p>

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<p>Atican: "The “level/grouping/recognition”, as you put it, is just another way of making generalizations about a school’s name and prestige. You’re saying Harvard won’t impress more than AU? You’re deluding yourself. "</p>

<p>No doubt it impresses YOU. And yes, Harvard has a highly selective admission criteria, and yes Obama taught there, etc. Ivy League schools impress a lot of students. </p>

<p>Like I said I work in a major International Organization. You’d be shocked how diverse the schools are. I’m NOT saying state U = Harvard. I’m not saying GWs “name” is equal to Harvards. </p>

<p>What I’m saying is: If you get into one of the DC schools, and the other recognized IR top programs, AND you are going to school with a career path in mind you’ll be ok. Given that reality, I feel people stress too much IMO about the “name”. Once you’re among the top schools, the retruns on the “name” diminish. The fit is more important. The culture of the university. Intagibles like location. </p>

<p>Once you’re in one of those schools, if you’re not a total eff up, and reasonable but flexible standards (for example, I want to work in an internatioanl organization > I will work at the UN and nowhere else) you’ll be fine. Case in point: AU, GW and Georgetown students can take courses within their MA at the other three schools anyway. Case in point 2: Students from all these schools intern at the World Bank. </p>

<p>I don’t think graduates from AU or GW are lining up on unemployment lines, or that they can’t break the entry-level ceiling. They can and they do.</p>

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<p>I must wholeheartedly agree with Atican on this occasion.
GW is superior to AU, one need only notice that many if not most AU master’s students get rejected from GTown and / or GW as their first choice. Also in my experience AU has far more people direct from undergrad or with irrelevant work experience (if you doubt this look at a couple of the other IR threads here, of people getting roundly rejected from GW & GTown but accepted at AU). GW & GTown generally require more relevant experience. As Atican quite rightly pointed out, at these programmes vs AU, people come from 2 - 3 years in roles and when they come out, they expect mid-level roles, whereas you find many AU grads applying for entry-level positions.</p>

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<p>“No doubt it impresses YOU. And yes, Harvard has a highly selective admission criteria, and yes Obama taught there, etc. Ivy League schools impress a lot of students.”</p>

<p>Um, I’m pretty sure it impresses other people more than it impresses me, but here’s why it would impress employers: Harvard already went through a selection/filtration process more rigorous than schools like AU that tells me the likelihood of this person being outstanding is higher than if he went to AU. It’s not a for sure thing, but again, it’s a good (and frankly reliable) indicator. It makes the job of an employer easier. And no, Obama taught at UChicago, not Harvard. He graduated from Harvard Law.</p>

<p>"Once you’re in one of those schools, if you’re not a total eff up, and reasonable but flexible standards (for example, I want to work in an internatioanl organization > I will work at the UN and nowhere else) you’ll be fine… </p>

<p>Case in point 2: Students from all these schools intern at the World Bank…</p>

<p>I don’t think graduates from AU or GW are lining up on unemployment lines, or that they can’t break the entry-level ceiling. They can and they do…"</p>

<p>I think you might be remarkably ignorant of the employment prospects in this recession for the vast majority of MPP/MPA/MIA graduates. Even people who graduated from the Elliot School are being forced to take entry-level positions. I know, because I work with them. In your case (just based on your somewhat wacky opinions/knowledge), I think you’re actually one of those interns at the World Bank and not someone “working” for some mysterious “major international organization.” And last time I checked, people weren’t scrambling to intern/work at the World Bank. It’s a massive organization, very diverse, etc.</p>

<p>The point is simply that in this recession, even people from good programs are taking entry-level positions. I think the Elliot school straddles the line the most, but it’s probably just because I’m in DC that I see more of them in entry-level positions. I honestly think AU is below that line where you would almost unconditionally think “everything above this is an outstanding program.” I think AU suffers from being in the same city as GTown and GWU.</p>

<p>If you don’t think an employer has a school’s reputation in mind, you’re just insane. We have that in mind even in hiring interns, although it goes without saying that once you get beyond the initial stages, you care more about the person’s personality, work experience, etc. You’re just an ******* (and shouldn’t be hiring people) if you prioritize someone’s school over their experience. But the fact is, at a lot of prestigious organizations in int’l affairs, you get more applications than you can possibly process with the attention they deserve. You have to take shortcuts, and the reputation of the school is an easy way to do that. What matters even more is personal connections, and frankly if you want to be a research associate for a fellow/scholar and you both went to Harvard and may even have some connections in common, well… welcome aboard! That applies to any school, but guess where most of the fellows/scholars come from…</p>

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<p>When you talk about poor job placement or you talking about job placement for people who get MAs in IR from low-ranking programs?
I really want to get into SAIS–I am attending JHU undergrad and I hope I can get into the 5-year BA/MA thingy with SAIS.
I was looking at the success rate of SAIS grads…they get good jobs…</p>