<p>I am a rising senior who is seriously considering applying early to MIT. I am in love with MIT's academics and the city of Boston/Cambridge but I have my doubts about one important thing: the social life. I for one do not mix well with hardcore nerds. Looking at most of the kids who are attending from my school, I would not want to be good friends with them. I believe this is in part due to MIT's focus on math and science, and in not caring about the humanities as much, some students certainly lose a "social component" (people who are more inclined towards the humanities have tended to much more multidimensional socially and much more interesting to talk to in my experience). Obviously, MIT still has some normal, socially aware kids but I believe there is a significant representation of socially unaware nerds (believe me, I love smart kids, but I really dislike when all they talk about is stuff like Pokemon, Starcraft, math math math math, etc...). I mean this in a serious way; I am doubting my probabilities of making meaningful relationships. I see myself fitting much more smoothly in the social life of Yale, where I believe the students are still very intelligent but who are much more "normal." However, I plan to do some kind of bio/chem major or engineering course, and I believe MIT's academics in these areas are superior to that of Yale. I would really appreciate some commentary on the social life at MIT.</p>
<p>Hopefully current students/alumni will comment, since they can give you a better picture than I can; nonetheless, as a 2015 I can say that there are all sorts of people in the incoming freshman class. I’ve seen people on the facebook page talking about “normal” things like sports and Lady Gaga as often as I’ve seen them talking about Harry Potter and Dungeons and Dragons. This especially came out when everyone was ranking dorms; as you may or may not be aware, all the dorms at MIT have distinct cultures. Some are “normal”, some are “weird”, and many are a mix of the two. People are able to find a place where they really fit. I was reminded of the diverse personalities that make up class of 2015 when people were desperate to get into dorms I had no interest in (and vice versa).
All that being said, MIT’s “nerdy” reputation was a plus for me when I chose it and it’s something pretty much every 2015 I’ve talked to values quite highly. I’ve been enjoying just being myself, nerdiness and all, without fear of censure.</p>
<p>The parties can actually get pretty intense. And you’ll find a great group of friends I’m sure. Best of luck during the admissions cycle!</p>
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<p>You believe incorrectly. (Although I suppose we could quibble about the exact threshold of a “significant” portion.)</p>
<p>To get an idea of what MIT is NOT like, watch the movie 21, and then remember that pretty much every actual MIT student who ever saw that movie desired to throw rotten tomatoes at the screen.</p>
<p>^ But the inaccuracies were hilarious!</p>
<p>The cultures of any two top schools you can name are, of course, going to overlap in a significant way. The types of people who would fit in at MIT and Yale can be drawn in a Venn diagram with a significant amount of overlap.</p>
<p>Still, there is a difference between the culture at MIT and Yale (although I, as an MIT alum, wouldn’t say it’s because Yale students are “more inclined toward the humanities” and therefore are more “multidimensional”). If you want to find people who care passionately about poetry and politics and art, you’ll find them at both schools, but MIT students might choose to identify more strongly as scientists and engineers first, then as poets/pundits/perusers of art second. </p>
<p>But MIT is indeed different from Yale. My best friend, also a PhD student in my lab, was an undergrad at Yale. I’ve met a bunch of his friends from college, and he’s met a bunch of mine, and although we both like each other’s friends, we’re ultimately both glad we went where we went. I wouldn’t have wanted to go to Yale – for me, being in “Yale mode” and talking to his friends is a lot of work, and it leaves me feeling tired and not particularly like myself. I know he feels the same way about my MIT friends.</p>
<p>So I think ultimately it’s true that you (or anyone else) may feel more at home at one of MIT or Yale. I don’t think it’s because the people themselves are necessarily all that different. But if you’re at all interested, apply both places. Get in. Visit during both schools’ prefrosh weekends. And then decide where you feel most like yourself.</p>
<p>I agree with mollie w/r/t this: </p>
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<p>I attended two different schools in undergrad, and have worked at MIT and down the road. Every place is very different. I have MIT friends with whom I talk / joke / BS about some things; my UMass friends are very different, but still fun. And my high school friends, who are still my closest friends, are different too. </p>
<p>Drawing any hard line about ANY college is so reductive as to be meaningless. You really have to visit places and get a feel for the culture of a place and whether or not you enjoy sitting around and talking to people. That’s the best - really only - thing you can do.</p>
<p>I have visited both MIT and Yale and feel like I understand the environments of both schools. I did not have a good experience on visiting MIT’s AI class (in fact, I was a bit disgusted at the fact that there was a girl who wasn’t paying attention to the lecture and who was playing Pokemon, and I was also surprised at how inarticulate a student was in asking a question. I found myself asking, how would these students fare in a subject of true feelings - a discussion, for example, on the beauty of a relationship in a novel or something like Gatsby’s feelings? Honestly not so well…) At Yale I attended a philosophy lecture and the students struck me as much more approachable, relaxed, eloquent … and more attractive :P. Just an observation. I am really not trying to bash MIT here, but there is definitely a much greater “nerd” population at MIT than most other schools. I’m not saying that’s a bad thing in general, but for me it is. I go to a school that sends a fair number to MIT and Yale each year (about 6-10 matriculate to both), and I can say that about 70% of the kids who go to MIT from my school fit the “nerd” bill. </p>
<p>I feel like I would make many more meaningful friends at Yale (the wording in my first statement was poor; I wasn’t doubting my ability to make meaningful friends at MIT, but I know I would be definitely losing a social component that is present at Yale). However, Yale’s science program is simply inferior to that of MIT. But is the difference in academics worth the difference in people? I am planning on attending my early choice school if I am accepted, so I am trying to make the most well-informed decision. Obviously both these institutions are wonderful and I would be happy to attend either one. I also haven’t narrowed down my options down to just these two schools, but they are two of my main three candidates. I am planning on posting in the Yale forum as well.</p>
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And your views about both schools, and about the students who go there, are orders of magnitude too simplistic. </p>
<p>Ultimately, it’s true that there exist MIT students who care about science and engineering and nothing else. It’s also true that due to the choices available to you at MIT, you can choose not to live with or socialize with people whose worldviews you don’t support. But if you can’t live with the idea that those people exist on campus and in your classes, then MIT isn’t the place for you. (And not just because it will make you unhappy – because living and letting live is pretty central to the MIT ethos.)</p>
<p>@Suffuse, the girl who was playing Pokemon instead of listening to the AI lecture sounds like my daughter. She thought that class was dreadfully boring. She turned down Yale for MIT when she was a high-school senior, because she came back from the preview week at Yale saying, “A lot of choral groups performed, and there were some interesting discussions…but where’s the math at Yale? Where’s the physics?” I think you just need to confirm where your passion lies. Maybe it’s not really in the sciences.</p>
<p>To celebrate graduation, my daughter and a group of MIT friends converged at our house last month to borrow camping equipment and procure a car; then they took off for a 3-week road trip around the state, hiking, swimming, mountaineering, snorkeling, and body-surfing. They hiked up through the snow to the top of Chaos Crags, encountered bears, and roasted rainbow trout over a campfire. When they came back to our house, they went crayfishing, picked olallieberries, and returned to cook a large dinner including whole crayfish with paella and olallieberry pies. If these are the actions of nerds, then I’ll take nerds any day – and I’m a historian by profession. :-)</p>
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<p>When I talk like this (in fact, that exact sentence structure), people smirk - almost every time, they catch me saying something like that. I do not attend MIT.</p>
<p>Here, apparently it’s normal. Suffuse, run for it.</p>
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<p>Well sure, because people in philosophy academia think themselves smart for taking single (possibly inane) statements and writing essays about them. When all you think about is how to say stuff, you’ll sound more eloquent, whether you are or not.</p>
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<p>You might be a bit like an old MIT janitor who presumed to know everything about someone after seeing a painting of his. Then again, he apparently liked the Harvard social scene better. Sound familiar… </p>
<p>In all seriousness - of course the stereotypical math nerd is probably more attracted to MIT. But MIT hardly sets itself to admitting the largest percentage of geeks it can. That might be closer to Caltech’s motto. I think you’ll be pleasantly surprised at the conversations you’ll be able to have - you’ve barely seen a few students. </p>
<p>I think you’re trying to make the decision easier for yourself by creating an easy dichotomy that doesn’t exist. MIT attracts a more colorful crowd, if anything MITChris says is true at all, than you seem to understand. </p>
<p>You might want to ask yourself if it’s social you’re looking for or that elitist humanities “chat about poetry and love in coffee shops” feeling in particular. </p>
<p>By the way, I think I know what you’re talking about. I think the average humanities student I talk to can present himself/herself using a slick line or two much better. But I also think their disciplines rip them to shreds for saying something illogical quite a bit less, at least when they’re young undergrads. You might discover some of these ‘relaxed, easygoing, charismatic’ people are spewing a bunch of junk, and it gets old in a few. </p>
<p>These days, to get into basically any top school, the students are probably going to be pretty well-spoken. That non-English-speaking genius physicist with an accent isn’t the standard admit.</p>
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<p>I thought there was plenty?! The math faculty seem renowned and to do interesting stuff. Maybe it’s the pesky undergraduates.</p>
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<p>Not to derail the thread - but this isn’t really true. Maybe for freshman intro classes. But, as a liberal arts major, even in some of those intro classes I had a lot of professors who tore me a new one for shoddy thinking. </p>
<p>It is a bit easier, I suppose, to get away with a lack of rigor in humanities classes than in a math or engineering class. I mean it’s at least <em>possible</em>. But good teachers and respectable programs don’t let it happen to those students who are actually interested in studying it. The critical and analytical skills in top-notch social studies (broadly defined) courses are just as unmerciful as in the hard sciences; just look at the Frankfurt School, the crits, or the realists and see how they demolish their respective fields. </p>
<p>Ok, derail over :)</p>
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<p>I agree.</p>
<p>I know philosophy classes in logic can be the most rip-to-shreds type classes ever.</p>
<p>But as we both know, that’s not the standard everywhere. I know it’s not cake to write an A essay at a top school.</p>
<p>But you acknowledged that grey area. I.e. what about the students who don’t really care to go the extra step? I think it’s possible for them to get by with a lot less on the analytical front if they choose their paths “wisely”.</p>
<p>I’ve seen both very lax English teachers and those who basically shut the students up halfway through if they’re just rambling.</p>
<p>I think what you say about logic being emphasized greatly is true more of disciplines that are heavy on analytical writing.</p>
<p>There’s another issue, however - sometimes, a field that focuses on the logic too much will forget that there’s such a thing as content. That’s something which has turned me off about some philosophy.</p>
<p>I don’t think this is actually too irrelevant in a sense - I think unfortunately, at the heart of this thread is a simplistic view on humanities vs. math/science subjects. Clearing such things up seems relevant, even if not immediately MIT-related.</p>
<p>@molliebat/mathboy who are quoting my “I feel like I understand…”</p>
<p>Keep in mind I said “I feel like”! I’m not claiming to know these schools in depth. Of course I’m not a student at both these colleges. And I understand the AI/philosophy classes are not representative of the entire population. Both these colleges are complex, colorful places with diverse peoples and ideas. I’m not claiming saying that the presence of nerdy people at MIT would absolutely want me to make me kill myself, nor am I saying Yale’s somewhat inferior science program is a dealbreaker. All I am pointing out is what I perceive as stronger areas for both schools. </p>
<p>Also, I’m not an elitist poetry dude who just b/s’es stuff to make myself feel fancy, important, and high-class. I find those people repulsive. My passion is certainly in the sciences, in biology/chemistry/nano. I’m a USABO semi-finalist/USNCO finalist (though I don’t think Olympiads are necessarily a good indicator of skill…) I am doing research in a nanotech-related field right now and I have downright love these subjects. I want to contribute to these fields and I can claim to be a “nerd” in such areas. This is why I value MIT’s science program so highly. However, I truly respect those who are attuned to the pure humanities/feelings. The literature examples were perhaps bad, but honestly the core of what literature and English is about is the sharing of feelings. What I’m really talking about is people who I can live, laugh, and love - people who I can be sensitive and share intense feelings with… (yes, I just ended my sentence on a preposition… what of it) From my experience science/math people are less inclined to be people who are interested in sharing that. I am sure to find those people at MIT, but I feel like there would be more of those people at Yale… That’s all I’m trying to say. Right now I am leaning heavily towards MIT though. Haha.</p>
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<p>Nor was I saying you are. However, your impressions from a few visits can be deceptive - like I said, on average, the humanities students I’ve talked to just present themselves more smoothly. </p>
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<p>Anyone who is passionate about something and has experienced failure and isn’t for some reason opposed to talking about things outside of work should be able to do this. What you want are people who acknowledge the humanities as a beautiful body of knowledge and a worthwhile pursuit. Even if they are engineers.</p>
<p>Hey, that sounds like you!</p>
<p>Given a lot of people here have expressed enthusiasm about the humanities subjects at MIT, you’re likely to be very satisfied by choosing to spend time with the ‘right’ people.</p>
<p>I was a lot like the OP in terms of being very oriented toward the humanities…First of all, the proportion of people that are into Dungeons and Dragons and that type of thing is low, I think. However, most people will be much more left-brained than right (although certainly many will have gotten A’s in their humanities classes in high school, but I don’t think that really measures aptitude.) Getting A’s in humanities in high school can most often be done by just writing well-organized essays, something which doesn’t take a lot of talent.</p>
<p>You might feel out of your element. There isn’t much of a humanities atmosphere at MIT, although there will certainly be some good humanities classes. And the tooling mentality, the idea that thinking is aquiring a vast array of algorithms, is kind of a prevalent idea, especially in engineering. This is in contrast to the gestalt, in which you try to arrive at a new idea at once. It’s easy to get sucked into the tooling mentality because of the volume of work and the left-brained mentality prevalent, as opposed to trying to look at what you’ve learned in a different way. However, I must say that part of my dissatisfaction may have been because I majored in engineering, in which there is less of this type of thinking than say, math or physics. But I feel like the general sentiment is still true. </p>
<p>There are advantages to MIT, depending on the field. You are much more likely to learn everything there is to know about a field at MIT. Certain majors are much more likely to be significantly more rigorous, like physics for instance, as well as engineering. I feel like the advantages in chemistry and bio are less clear. Even though you do learn more at MIT, I’m not sure that’s as important. Trust your instincts. There are professors in engineering at MIT who majored in math at Yale, and chem professors often come from liberal arts colleges.</p>
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<p>While I agree with this, I guess I wanted to really emphasize that it doesn’t seem clear humanities is what the OP is looking for. Having intelligent, heartfelt conversations and making meaningful relationships are what seem to be mentioned more. I think he is worried that the humanities folk may be easier to do this with.</p>
<p>I strongly feel that those with some humanities bent who meet my description of passionate + having experienced failure can be some of the most meaningful to form relationships with.</p>
<p>When I think a literature academic, I think someone who analyzes the craft of the writing. Sure, humanities may be more about ‘feelings’ - but the academics are about taking apart how we can communicate those things.</p>
<p>I will also agree with collegealum that engineering is very different from other ‘hard sciences, math, etc’ - there is a much more professional mentality crowding it, and even among the less professionally oriented, there is a mentality of how can I produce something. </p>
<p>But what about someone who went into physics because of wanting to understand great mysteries of the universe? Often such an individual may have a dual interest in philosophy and other disciplines which ponder big questions.</p>
<p>I think engineering has a starkly distinct culture, and in reality, I don’t think I click quite as perfectly with engineers myself. I’m much more interested in literature than I am in engineering, truth be told.</p>
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<p>All said, I do agree with this. You’re not going to remember everything you try to learn under the firehose anyway, and if you plan on committing to a life of learning this stuff, you’re going to mature slowly and painfully. Don’t go to MIT just to drink that extra cup of poison valiantly in one go. Realistically, you’ll visit and revisit things for a long time after you graduate college before you really understand the stuff very well, if your university presented hard stuff.</p>
<p>For bio/chem, what about dual enrollment class at Harvard? Also, I am very much so enjoy making things/engineering. This is I recently took a programming class and loved it (plan to do more CS this upcoming year). The research that I’m doing isn’t really pure academic research (which I of course respect) but is more so focused on how to make nanotechnological tools… which I believe falls under biological/chemical engineering.</p>
<p>^From what you’ve told us, there are good reasons for you to apply, and also reasons why you may have reservations. However, at this point there is no point in figuring it out. You should apply to both MIT and the ivies. Figure out which school is best for you when and if you get in. You can apply and in good conscious say that MIT is a fit for you in your app and interview, because it looks like there are certain things you want which MIT is best for.</p>
<p>Also, you should apply to Northwestern, which is arguably the best in nanotechnology in the country.</p>