Some Advice on Premed and Medical School?

Colleges & Universities A-Z University of California - Berkeley
1

<p>Alright. Committed to Cal. And I'm looking for advice.</p>

<p>I'm hoping to major in Biochemistry and Molecular Biology as a premed student, and my next goal for medical school is Stanford School of Medicine. Okay, so yeah, I'm a future Cal student hoping to go to medical school at Stanford, but believe me, I do love Cal more than Stanford haha! But why not try out both great worlds? Anyways, I started off pretty late on the college search during my high school career, so I'm setting a goal for myself now for medical school, so that I have some thing to work towards and motivate me.</p>

<p>So, what do you guys suggest I start doing now? Whether it be classes, clubs, internships, etc. What should I start looking into now at Cal or what I should start doing once I attend Cal? Honestly, I'm pretty much asking for ANY KIND OF ADVICE, and feel free to ask me anything about myself.</p>

<p>And would I get more info if I posted in the Stanford forums?</p>

<p>Please and thank you, but my other choices for medical school are UCSF and UCLA. Starting early!</p>

2

<p>You could start by looking into the MCAT (which is the test you have to take for med school), and the requirements to apply for Med School? I mean it’s good to enjoy the rest of your senior year, so I wouldn’t worry too much YET. But sucks for you because MCAT is changing its requirements and I think they are adding in Sociology, Psychology, etc. That means it is going to be a lot harder for you. </p>

<p>Also, not to be mean, more blunt but your ACT/SAT scores seemed low compared to what you are aiming for in the future (MCAT is also a standardized test…). Ambition is good, but it is also important to know your limits (though this is from a jaded senior, so i encourage you to just stay optimistic). I would stay start off your freshman year with a relaxed schedule so you can get adjusted to college life and then add more along the way.</p>

<p>You could start off school early by taking summer school. Science classes at Cal tend to be easier during the summer than during the school years. And basically just do your research/google what the MCAT is, requirements to apply for med school. Once you start school, just join pre-med clubs, look for extracurricular activities/research positions/internships since you need to boost your resume for med-school </p>

3

<p>I think you’ll realize, fairly quickly, when you start college that no one has/should have a goal medical school, especially not ones as high ranked as Stanford, UCLA, or UCSF. As said above, ambition is good, but your goal should be to get into A medical school, since that’s hard enough as it is. </p>

4

<p>@totalcaprice @dina4119‌
Well thanks for advice. I can get to be a little too ambitious sometimes and overcommit to things. I’m trying hard to enjoy senior year, but I’m more excited to start college! As far as test scores go, I made the mistake of not getting enough practice for the SAT/ACT. And I’ll admit that. Granted, my scores might not have gotten so much better (some people are just better test takers than others… Who knows). And you’re right, I’ve had lots of family members tell me not to worry about what specific med school I want to attend, and to just get into one. Thanks again!</p>

5

<p>Hi there,</p>

<p>I am a current MCB Major at Cal (Sophomore) , and can offer some great advice </p>

<ol>
<li><p>Keep your interests open in terms of what major you choose, or if you really like MCB, what tract you choose. The Biochemistry and Molecular Biology tract is more focused on experimental and research topics within biochemistry, like biophysical chemistry, macromolecular synthesis (The process of proteins being made in ribosomes and other molecules being formed in the cell), biochemistry lab techniques, like cell cloning, DNA cloning, protein purification etc. These are things that might interest you, but they don’t necessarily translate to topics in medical school, and might be better suited for those interested in research. This tract also requires the more advanced biochemistry series, which involves much more physics and calculus than the less advanced biochemistry course. Many biology majors are not particular crazy about the large amount of organic chemistry involved within biochemistry, so just take your time and see what interests you. The cell and developmental biology tract provides a wider variety of courses that go into more detail about organ systems and physiology of the human body that may interest you more as a premed student.</p></li>
<li><p>DO NOT TAKE MORE THAN TWO SCIENCES CLASSES YOUR FIRST SEMESTER. No matter what school you came from, no matter how hard you worked in high school, you haven’t experienced the real rigor of Cal. If you want A’s here, you will have to work your ass off for them, guaranteed. </p></li>
<li><p>Consider a second major or a minor in an unrelated subject. It’s good to have diversity in your schedule, since doing only mcb classes will get you burned out pretty quickly. I am doing an art minor and also planning to take business classes soon as well.</p></li>
<li><p>Remember, Medicine is a long hard road, and it will only get harder and tougher from here on out. If it’s your life’s dream, you will probably stay in the game long enough to achieve it. But always look to see if other careers interest you. I personally started out as pre-med but i am now leaning towards working as an executive in corporate biotech or working in the biotech department of a private equity firm. </p></li>
<li><p>DON’T MAJOR IN BIOLOGY IF YOU DONT LIKE IT. MCB is a very tough major, do not let anyone fool you that it is not. You should only major in it if you truly love it, and have a smile every time you study your biology or biochemistry text book. You need to be happy with what your studying.</p></li>
</ol>

6

<p>@Jweinst1‌ </p>

<p>Thank you so much for the advice! This is actually really helpful. </p>

<p>In regards to your advice, I actually chose the Biochemistry tract out of interest (at least what I’ve taken out of AP Biology, but I’m assuming that it’s much more intense and rigorous than a high school AP class), but I’ll be sure to look into it more if it’s not the best tract to better prepare me for medical school. And I actually really enjoy Organic Chemistry and Calculus, which is a surprise to some folks. Personally, I do prefer biology majors that are much more specific and fine-tuned details versus the ones that are more broad, if that makes sense. But got it. No more than two science classes. I was actually planning on a lighter schedule to start things off and get used to the college life first before diving in too deep and over-committing to various things. But I’m already considering a second major in Creative Writing, so that I can keep up my writing skills. Otherwise, it’d be a minor or two in Asian and Asian American Diaspora Studies and/or Linguistics. </p>

<p>But thanks again for the advice. I think the first thing I’ll do, once I get to Cal, is find someone who can guide and help me through the process of getting into medical school, so a few of these things are subject to change. See you at school next year (if by some divine means I know who you actually are… haha)!</p>

7

<p>Okay. Here is some advice from someone who attended Stanford Med and sat on their admissions committee.</p>

<p>1) There is no formula for getting into a top medical school, much less a specific medical school like Stanford. The things that Stanford looks at are similar to all other top medical schools. Acceptance rate is around 3% – so 97% rejection rate.</p>

<p>2) The areas you will be evaluated in are – academic achievement, personal qualities, and research/work experience. It is a research heavy school, so research does have its own category. This does not always mean in a lab, but is meant to assess intellectual curiosity and seeking answers that are not going to be found in any text book. This may be demonstrated by sustained work on a project, publications, presentations, work experience, etc. Academic achievement = Overall GPA, Science/Premed GPA, MCAT score, difficulty of course load (i.e. graduate level classes or a whole bunch of intro classes… we can tell), “distance traveled” to achieve this (we factor in other commitments, work/study, socioeconomic background, collegiate athelete, etc.). Personal qualities – letters of recommendation, personal essay, extracurriculars, interests, hobbies, barriers overcome, etc. – again looking for long-term commitment and achievement rather than a whole bunch of clubs with no executive positions held, etc.</p>

<p>3) You are really early. Evaluate if medical school is right for you. Shadow a doctor if you can to get exposure to the field. See if it is right for you. </p>

<p>4) Demonstrate passion in college. If you get to the interview phase, you will have to talk about something and we can pick out those who did things just to pad their resume.</p>

<p>A lot of UC Berkeley students want to come to Stanford Med, and in my opinion only the cream of the premed crop from that school got into UCSF or Stanford for Medical School. There are admittedly a lot of premeds out of that school. There were 3 Berkeley students in my med school class (total of 86). One had a perfect MCAT score, one was a Marshall Scholar, other was an academic stud as well. So good luck.</p>

8

<p>Don’t be too set on any one particular medical school. Of the pre-meds who make it to the point of applying to medical school (many give up the idea after their grades or MCAT scores are too low) only about half are admitted to any medical school. So you are unlikely to have much choice – the medical schools might choose you, rather than allowing you to choose them.</p>

<p>Overall medical school applicant and matriculant data:
<a href=“https://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/”>https://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/&lt;/a&gt;
Medical school tuition and fees:
<a href=“https://services.aamc.org/tsfreports/”>https://services.aamc.org/tsfreports/&lt;/a&gt;
Berkeley pre-med information:
<a href=“https://career.berkeley.edu/Medical/Medical.stm”>https://career.berkeley.edu/Medical/Medical.stm&lt;/a&gt;
Pre-med section on these forums:
<a href=“Pre-Med Topics - College Confidential Forums”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/pre-med-topics/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

9

<p>@AsianAlly‌ </p>

<p>You should pick whatever really draws your interest. The only reason I mentioned about the BMB tract of MCB is that a lot of premeds aren’t interested in research techniques, but if you are one who is then definitely go for it!</p>

<p>I know people on here are saying that you shouldn’t be set on one particular medical school, and that the medical school will probably choose you, not you choose it. I think however though it’s better to have a confident attitude towards everything so it will reflect in your grades and coursework. If you believe you are a future Stanford Med student, do everything you can to portray that! Get to the top of your class!</p>

10

<p>Also, i forgot to add this which is very important!</p>

<p>DO NOT TAKE THE MATH 10 SERIES I repeat, DO NOT. Take the Math1a-1b series instead. Math 10 is a year long math series meant to be for the life sciences but its five times as hard as the 1 series. The 1 series involves only calculus and differential equations, which the math 10 series does everything in the 1 series plus a year of probability, a year of statistics, a semester of linear algebra, and lots of discrete mathematics, along with some multivariable calculus all packed into one year. Do not take Math 10.</p>

11

<p>The description of Math 10A and 10B indicates that it includes bits and pieces of Math 1A, 1B, 54, 55 and Statistics 20 that are supposed to be most useful for biology majors. It does not appear to have the entire five other courses’ content in it.</p>

<p><a href=“https://mcb.berkeley.edu/undergrad/courses/courses/math91/”>https://mcb.berkeley.edu/undergrad/courses/courses/math91/&lt;/a&gt;
<a href=“Lower Division Course Outlines | Department of Mathematics at University of California Berkeley”>Lower Division Course Outlines | Department of Mathematics at University of California Berkeley;

<p>It is rather unlikely that, for example, the one week on infinite series in Math 10A covers all of the material of four weeks on infinite series in Math 1B.</p>

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<p>@‌ ucbalumnus </p>

<p>Have you taken the course yourself? I did last year for the fall and spring and it DID have all of math 54 and at least 70% of math 55 and for sure all of stats 20 in it. You should have seen the professor go through 5,6 or even eight sticks of chalk in a single lecture. It is by far much, much harder than the 1 series, with an unforgiving curve and grade distribution.</p>

<p>This course being useful for biology majors is absolutely ludicrous. No courses in MCB or IB require Math 54, 55, or Stats 20. Many do not require Math 1B. This is a weedout course.</p>

13

<p>^Um wow, I have NEVER heard that about math10a and I’ve asked a lot of students about it. Do you know if your classmates felt that way about it too? Maybe it was just the professor? </p>

<p>I agree that it’s kind of useless to biologists, and that math1a is sufficient, but I’m having a hard time believing 3 courses are somehow being fit into one class. Especially since math10a is “lower” than math54. </p>

<p>The reason I’d say not to take math10 is because it’s new and there could be potential problems because of this. All lower-div MCB/IB courses are weeder courses.</p>

14

<p>@‌ dina4119</p>

<p>My closest friends did feel this way, except one who took rigorous math courses during high school. But, given that the average on the final was 39% for the first semester, which is very low for any freshmen course, I think a lot of students did struggle with the enormous amount of material given over the year.</p>

<p>Now its not 3 courses in one semester, but more like this</p>

<p>Math10A=
100% of Math 1A
45% of Math 1B
70% of Stats 20</p>

<p>Math 10B=
80% of Math 55
the Other 30% of Math 1B (differential equations)
65% of Math 54
the other 30% of stats 20</p>

<p>Hard to believe, but it is certainly true. And yes, you said it right, this is by far a weed out course. I could see this type of math being useful in grad level MCB or IB research, but by no means in undergrad classes.</p>

15

<p>Ok, I’m sure it has aspects of those courses and that it was difficult, but to say that it has more than two semester’s worth of higher classes confuses me a little.
I think it’d make more sense to liken it to Bio1a/1b, these are “less advanced” classes that encompass physiology, ecology, human reproduction, etc. etc., and are generally thought to be more difficult to get an A in than upperdiv MCB courses, but you wouldn’t say that they contain 100% of MCB136, 50% of IB140. </p>

16

<p>Hi, I’m thinking about going to UCLA for pre-med. I got to see the campus yesterday, and after a look around, I loved it. I know this sounds weird, but I heard the “attrition rate” (or whatever you call the dropout/quit the premed track rate) at UCLA for pre-med is very high. I’m deciding between UCSD and UCLA, as UCSD does graduate more pre-med students (according to what stats I’ve seen), but I really like the UCLA campus and the resources available there too. I’m just curious, why do so many students end up quitting the pre-med track? Is it the difficulty of the courses? Do they give up on studying? If somebody could give me a little advice, I’d really appreciate it, because I have to make a decision in the next week or so.</p>

17

<p>@‌ Oshovah </p>

<p>In my honest opinion, you should absolutely NOT pay any attention to statistics involving what percent of premed students are accepted to medical school from a specific undergraduate institution, because all of those statistics are edited and rehashed to only reflect the top students from each university much of the time. Also, rejected premed students whom were not accepted to any US medical school are often under-reported due to the applicant not wanting to report that kind of scenario.</p>

<p>Also, going to any undergraduate school DOES NOT get you accepted into medical school. It does not matter at all if you go to Stanford and screw off every quarter then expect to be accepted to medical school just because you went to Stanford. It’s what you do in your undergraduate experience, the hours upon hours you spend studying for your organic chemistry final, the mountain of practice problems you do for your math final, the speeches you give at clubs, the research publications you work on, those are the things that get you into medical school. The college you go to has a very insignificant factor in your admission chances as a whole, it just plays a minor role in evaluating the context of your coursework, AKA “GPA”.</p>

<p>Second, many students give up for many reasons. The most common is that, they realized that the path to be a doctor, is extremely grueling and full of possible personal sacrifices that they are not willing to undertake, and the course work was too stressful “Note, its often not too difficult, it’s just that many find it too stressful to really perform at the A level in every midterm and final you take”. </p>

<p>The most common other reason is that, people find they aren’t as interested in being a doctor as they once thought, because of new interest in other professions like law, dentistry. Personally, I have a deep interest in science and medicine, but I also have a fantasy of being a billionaire, and that cannot come true while being a doctor, so I am looking at more a healthcare focused I-banking route or a biotech corporate finance route right now.</p>