I was talking to a friend whose kid got 211 as afreshman and 216 as a sophomore in a state where cut off score is 219. Mom thinks that kid can make cut off with self prep but he thinks that everyone else is doing prep center so he needs it too. What’s your advice looking at back view mirror? Is it worth to shell out $1800.
Save the money, since the vast majority of schools gave the PSAT on 10/14. If the kid is in one of the very few schools that is giving the PSAT on 10/28, although I’m a big of test prep I just can’t fathom what good it would do to pay $1800 for test prep ten days before the test!
Do the free practice test, make sure kid knows it’s a different test then in the past and that omitted answers don’t count against you.
Not sure of the quality of prep books given the change in the test, but the same could be said for a class at the moment. A prep book is probably $20, and will do as much good. One of my kids prepped her way to a 2380 with just books, no class.
I’m sorry for not making it clear that these scores were in practice PSAT and he is a sophomore.
Then he is taking the wrong practice tests, the test and the scoring have changed this year. He should take the current CB PSAT practice tests (1520 scale) in a timed proctored environment if possible. Did he take the new PSAT this year? If so, wait and see what his real scores are. Has he done the Khan prep for the new PSAT? He really should go through all the free/ low cost stuff first, before spending that kind of money.
He took free new PSAT at some prep center and scored 1250.
Is old one a good prediction of new one or are they totally different? Is new one tougher?
I am confused. 10th grade PSAT scores do not matter at all. He has a whole year until the PSAT counts for NMF status. Stand down… and wait until spring when the prep books are more up to date to match the new tests. He can study books late next summer and early fall, and it will be fine.
I know that only junior year PSAT matters, others just give you an idea of where do you stand and what do you need to improve. I was just wanting to know if a student who is scoring well on old format, can expect similar scores on new format without in person prep courses.
I think a kid who is fairly high scoring to start with should get books and study on their own. Courses make sense for kids who need a LOT of improvement, and maybe don’t have the best study skills or self discipline. But there isn’t really anything taught in the courses that you can’t find in a prep book, and that will be true with the new test as well once they have a chance to get the books published. So… his mom isn’t wrong. I’d suggest to him that he come up with the prep class money if he wants to take it… Or knock the $1,800 off what they are willing to contribute for college.
The new PSAT is totally different - not tougher, just not the same. No one knows what the cut offs will be. Not sure why you didn’t make it clear in your first post that these were ‘practice tests’ and that he had taken a new practice test too, but my advice still stands, use free and local/low cost prep first and then, if needed, pay for more expensive prep.
- work through Khan it's free!
- if needed get some subject specific prep books (I like Erica Meltzer's Grammar and Critical Reader, both updated for the new PSAT/SAT and PWN the SAT Mat, update in the works) 3.if needed, local or on line test company > $500 4.if help is still needed hire a private tutor ...
FWIW my sophomore scored 1500 on the new practice test and he’ll revisit Khan and do the books I mentioned. If his real 10th grade PSAT comes in much lower than his new practice PSAT we’ll do Prepscholar.com too. I have no problem paying for reasonable prep if it’s needed. We spent about $1K total for d16’s prep (books, local and online classes) over several years. She’s looking at a $124K scholarship from OU. I’d say that was money well spent since it was her first choice school. I’d have a much harder time paying $1.8K for a single prep course.
Look at it this way: NM scholarships are a $2500 one-time grant. The top 1% of each state’s scorers will be semifinalists, and only 2500 of 16000 semifinalists will end up getting national merit money (plus a few thousand who will get money from corporation- or school-funded scholarships). The expected value of spending $1800 to hopefully have just under a 1-in-6 shot at a $2500 scholarship is negative. This kid’s mom is right: self-prep is the way to go, especially when all he’s looking for is a 3-point increase. If the kid’s parents are going to invest in prep (and I wouldn’t - all I used was a second-hand copy of the Colllege Board’s blue book), it should be SAT prep with a local company. A PSAT course is barely worth the hours of his life the kid will spend on the work, to say nothing of $1800.
Once you’re at the upper end of the score range (which I view as 200+ or 210+), PSAT scores are essentially random, as 2-3 wrong answers can mean a 20-point difference in some cases. The same is true of the SAT, although the larger number of questions reduces the randomness some (while doing nothing to make the test less arbitrary). From there onwards, what matters most isn’t so much whether you invest in a $1800 prep course as whether you get enough sleep in the days before the test, hopefully avoid catching the flu or something similar, eat a proper breakfast on test day, and get questions that happen to work for you.
Two students of identical ability may well end up with a 30-point (or, for the SAT, 300-point) difference in score due to such external variables - especially the last, which I think is rather understated. I myself got a 67 in math on my junior-year PSAT, then scored an 800 on the real test with almost no prep in the intervening period. I didn’t forget how to do basic math during the PSAT and then improve my math skills (or even SAT-taking skills) significantly before the SAT, so the above considerations (and statistical noise) account for the difference.
I have paid for the external prep for both of my DDs and it did pay off - both are/will be NMFs and taking advantage of the scholarships that come with it. I will say our prep courses were less than $1000 and the course they took is very well respected in this area with proven results. It kept my DDs focused on it, gave them testing and time strategies and were able to work thru any issues. Also, prep for the PSAT is also prep for the SAT. My oldest D did not take a NMF scholarship but received a full tuition for SAT scores. In total, I expect over $200,000 in scholarships for a $2000 investment. Maybe the $2000 wasn’t necessary but it did help. Also, a friend’s son missed the cutoff by 1 question this year and he did not do outside prep. He wants to go to a school with a full scholarship for NMF - that 1 question costs $100,000. Both him and has mother are questioning that decision now.
My kid was NMF, too – with about $40 of prep books. And she cleared the NMF number in our state by 20 points, with a 2380 on the actual SAT. Just saying, your kids might have gone the same. But it does depend on their starting point and discipline/self motivation.
I also don’t think the prep classes mostly focus on the few hardest questions that make the difference for the top scorer. I think they are more focused on bringing low and middle scorers up. So a fair amount of time is spent on stuff the potential NMF already knows.
Going to add that a SAT tutor might make more sense for skid near NMF status vs s prep class. A more focused attention on the areas needing improvement would be possible.
@NotVerySmart There’s way more money involved than just the $2500 NMSC awards. Some schools award very large scholarships for NMF (the 2nd stage, after NMSF, which is what the junior year PSAT is for.) It’s a big deal if you can get it. I’m on a full ride scholarship because if it. I don’t know if a $1800 class is the answer to preparation, but it is worth doing something for if the kid is in the ballpark for getting a qualifying score.
I’m still inclined to think that @intparent is correct. Slightly under $40 worth of prep books ended up being more helpful for me than the prep courses a few friends took. As scorers in the 2100+ range, they found that about 80% of the course consisted of prior knowledge such as a detailed breakdown of the math behind “guess if you can eliminate at least 2 answers.” The other 20% may or may not have made a difference - they weren’t particularly happy with their scores, though a lot of the middle-of-the-pack students appear to have benefited from the prep.
It isn’t as straightforward as picking a student’s weakest area on a practice PSAT, buying a book with 500 questions on that specific area, and laughing all the way to the FA office after a 10-point increase in a kid’s section score, but that strategy will work more often than not. If a student knows he/she won’t be able to stay on task well enough to self-prep, or has issues with test-taking strategy, prep may help. If that same kid believes his/her parents need to shell out $1800 for a prep course “because everyone else is doing prep center,” I’m skeptical.
I’m still inclined to think that @intparent is correct. Slightly under $40 worth of prep books ended up being more helpful for me than the prep courses a few friends took. As scorers in the 2100+ range, they found that about 80% of the course consisted of prior knowledge such as a detailed breakdown of the math behind “guess if you can eliminate at least 2 answers.” The other 20% may or may not have made a difference - they weren’t particularly happy with their scores, though a lot of the middle-of-the-pack students appear to have benefited from the prep.
It isn’t as straightforward as picking a student’s weakest area on a practice PSAT, buying a book with 500 questions on that specific area, and laughing all the way to the FA office after a 10-point increase in a kid’s section score, but that strategy will work more often than not. If a student knows he/she won’t be able to stay on task well enough to self-prep, or has issues with test-taking strategy, prep may help. If that same kid believes his/her parents need to shell out $1800 for a prep course “because everyone else is doing prep center,” I’m skeptical.
One of the major questions in this discussion is whether you want or need the very large scholarships that go with NMF. If the schools that you are interested in do not offer that then it may not be as important to get that magic number on the PSAT. If it is important to your family’s finances then doing everything that you can is important. Not only with trying to get that number but knowing if you did not, you gave it your best shot.
Also, not all prep courses are the same. I sent my DDs to a local/regional course that produces a lot of NMSF. They also helped with the essays, gave free ACT practice tests and free seminars for the parents for $600. Both DD made the mark. I considered it a very good value.
@GTAustin I think we use the same test prep company! It’s been a great value for us. We are in the unusual situation that my kids have ZERO standardized test experience due to home schooling and have to take the PSAT for their application to high school. My kids sign up for their program the August before eight grade and then have unlimited free instruction on both SAT and PSAT. It’s a very good deal for us, they offer a sibling discount and a sign up with a friend discount so it was under $600 and for my middle kiddo he took both class for the old SAT/PSAT and new SAT/PSAT at no additional charge, not even a charge for the the old and new blue books. I like the special free class for kids that are specifically going for NM I think that really helped.