<p>Menloparkmom...I do appreciate how you so succinctly summarized every negative (and for the most-part false) stereotype about UC Berkeley. You sound like every other high school student on this board who spreads falsehoods having never actually stepped foot on the Berkeley campus (I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you've actually been to Cal).</p>
<p>Cheers,
CUgrad</p>
<p>I would say that Columbia and Chicago (though u didnt list it) are the two best schools you could apply to. I mean both are in huge cities, and also offer great programs in the areas you are interested in. I think Chicago probably bests columbia in all that u listed, but both are still great schools.. Like chicago Econ and finance are some of the best (well actually chicago Econ is the best).</p>
<p>They may be false for some students, but they are defintely not false for many of my son's HS classmates who are at berkeley now, and are miserable. So I'd appreciate it if you would not think you can speak for all students at such a huge campus. This is not a" my school is better than your school" ****ing contest. I was reporting on the UNDERGRADUATE experience my son's classmates have reported to me. If you want to think I'm bashing UC then go ahead.</p>
<p>Chicago is academically similar to MIT, Columbia, and Stanford - but if he was to apply to Chicago (which is totally different than the 3 he's applying to) he might as well apply to a dozen other schools of the same caliber.</p>
<p>Applying to Columbia ED and MIT EA would definitely be your best bet.. except if you like Stanford a lot better... however, if you apply to Columbia early, make sure you show interest in the school. </p>
<p>One of my friends applied to Columbia early, got deferred, wrote a letter showing how interested he was in the school, and then got in RD.</p>
<p>CUgrad,</p>
<p>You are saying there's absolutely no difference between a school with a student/faculty ratio of 8/1 and a school with 15/1??? Columbia/MIT/Stanford may be far from LACs but to say they are absolutely no different from the publics seems to be a stretch to me.</p>
<p>/ hank you! and the student/faculty ratio at Chicago is 4/1!, second only to Cal Tech in the top tier colleges.</p>
<p>you're still smoking something magicle if you think that by having a 4/1 student to faculty ratio, that professors are going to somehow approach you and give you that personal attention.</p>
<p>The point is, and I don't think anyone can dispute this, that whether there are 10 kids in a class or 100, that the only "personal interaction" a student will get is if he initiates it himself.</p>
<p>And I was only painting with the same broad brush that MenloParkMom was painting with. Huge classes taught by TA's? I agree, there are huge classes, but you're kidding yourself if you think that there are not huge classes at MIT, Columbia or Stanford particularly in the core courses for majors. It's the same at Berkeley, but upper division courses tend to be much smaller, seminar type situations with 20-50 students (often smaller).</p>
<p>Also, for the last time, can we stop with the complete BS in saying that TA's teach courses. TA's never ever teach "huge" courses (I teach at a UC). They teach sections or labs. Sections are hour long recitations where students review material from lectures taught by professors.</p>
<p>You're also right that rent is high around Berkeley, but as someone from California, you should know that rent is high everywhere in the state. You being from Menlo Park should know this particularly well.</p>
<p>I will grant you that Chicago is unique in it's attention and focus on undergraduates (despite having a mammoth graduate school). I wouldn't pretend to compare the undergraduate experience at Chicago with that at Berkeley, MIT, Stanford or Columbia...however, the latter three schools are more similar to each other (one man's opinion) than they are to Chicago.</p>
<p>The bottom line is you portray Berkeley (as many on this board do) as large impersonal research university where students get lost in the shuffle based on the experiences you've heard from a few of your son's friends. I have just as many counter stories that relay the opposite experience. The point is that some people at Berkeley are happy, others are not...to say that this is unique to Cal is ridiculous. Every single school has it's detractors and supporters. Let's not pretend to relay the experience of every student at a school with 25 thousand undergraduates based on the experience of at most, .01% of the student population.</p>
<p>Cheers!
CUgrad</p>
<p>cory what do you plan to major in?
I think you should pick your school based on majors rather than overall education if you are pretty sure of a specific field. </p>
<p>In my opinion, Columbia ED is most likely easier to get in than Stanford SCEA or MIT EA, but are you willing to put Columbia as your first choice? You have to go to Columbia if you are accepted right, so make sure you are willing to commit to Columbia 100%. </p>
<p>Also, if you are considering MIT and UChicago, what about Caltech? Caltech is much smaller, but I think academically is undoubtably amazing. As good or even better in some aspects than MIT. </p>
<p>I agree with some of the people about Berekley. It is a very good school, but for GRAD SCHOOL. Surviving Berkeley is insanly hard. I know a lot of people who graduate from Berekely undergrad recently, and they don't even what to continue with school anymore.</p>
<p>For ED and EA application in general, we are allowed to apply ED and EA at the same time? I know SCEA limits it to one, but do ED schools have that policy as well?</p>
<p>good luck cory!</p>
<p>Uh. Cu, I was letting OTHERS who are OUT OF STATE know about the price of rentals in Berkeley, not you. I also never said that having unhappy students is unique to Berkeley, so I suggest you read more carefully, and quit looking for reasons to tout Berkeley, when the OP clearly wasn't considering it in the first place.</p>
<p>true menloparkmom, the op didn't ask about berkeley, and in my innitial comments, I did not "tout" berkeley as you suggest. I should point out, however, that you yourself made a completely unsolicited appeal for Chicago on a Harvard post (which is fine, UofC is a great school). You know what they say about those who live in glass houses? Only after your comments in response to my first post did I defend Berkeley, and only in response to your comments. Besides, in your underhanded critique of Cal, you made it seem as if the other schools didn't share many of the same problems that Cal, as a big research university has, to which I say, rubish!</p>
<p>to the O.P. If you are able to ignore Menloparkmom's criticism of my reading comprehension skills, let me reiterate my reasons for simply suggesting you look into Berkeley in the first place.</p>
<p>1) You wanted an urban school
2) You expressed interest in Stanford, a great school in the Bay Area (though more suburban than urban)
3) Your choice of study suits both Stanford and Berkeley.
4) Berkeley simply expands your options</p>
<p>The schools you mentioned are all difficult schools to get into, I am simply trying to help with your options. I know Berkeley doesn't suit everybody, but I would hope you wouldn't dismiss it based on the critiques of a few people on this board. If you look into it and decide it's not for you great--but please don't let menloparkmom or a few of her sons friends dissuade you. I give you enough credit to form your own opinion.</p>
<p>Cheers,
CUgrad</p>
<p>OP, all I can say is, does this post /\ sound like it is written by an mature adult who supposedly teaches at a top university, or more like someone who is a rapid Cal fan who hates Stanford as only a Cal Big game fan can, and who jumps into forums to criticize others when his beloved school is mentioned? Which brings up the point, why did you bring up Berkeley on a Harvard thread? I brought up Chicago, because like Columbia, it has the core [Berkeley doesn't] and it has about the same #of undergraduates as Columbia, [around 4000] In other words, it is a comparable alternative for many students who are intersted in Columbia. And in fact, many students who apply to Columbia also apply to Chicago. Bringing up Berkeley alone, just because it is on the west coast, [like Stanford] doesn't make too much sense- why not UCLA too? OR UCSD? Or how about other top colleges on the west coast like Pomona? hmmm? Whether you like it or not, there is a big difference in desirability for many top students between a huge public university, and a smaller university with a higher student/ professor ratio. But for you to take criticism of different , widely known aspects of Berkeley personally, as you have, and then hurl insults, does not reflect well on you either as an education professional, if that is what you are, or as a mature adult.</p>
<p>Can we drop Berkeley from the discussion? It was not on the OP's list, and therefore it is off topic.</p>
<p>I would suggest avoiding "focus on one really good application". You are an excellent candidate for any of the colleges on your list. However, they are all ridiculously difficult to get in to, and your ED/EA application may well be denied. You are lucky to have narrowed down the top of your list this early. Give yourself the best chance by working on all 3 (or 4 if you have added Chicago) starting now. You have months to decide whether or where to apply early. You could be done with perfect apps to all of them by then. </p>
<p>You should also turn your attention to the large group of slightly and considerably less selective colleges to round out your list. Unfortunately, there will be students with credentials as strong as yours who will be denied at all of the places you have discussed so far. You can get a wonderful education at many other colleges, and you owe it to yourself to look around.</p>
<p>menloparkmom...you are truly misleading the reader. Nowhere, NOWHERE, did I insult Stanford or any of the other original schools that were posted by the O.P. (exactly the opposite of you). Nevertheless I won't bring up Berkeley anymore as I said all I needed to say in my first post. I said nothing about the school other than to "check it out." I would leave it to the O.P. to form his own decision. Most of your arguments are poorly supported. Another reason I suggested Berkeley is that applicants to Stanford also apply to Berkeley in huge number (the same is true of Harvard).</p>
<p>And menloparkmom, please enlighten me and the readers as to where I posted about Berkeley on a Harvard board (this is irrelevant by the way)? You are once again being selective with your information and misleading.</p>
<p>I will once again direct the O.P. to my original post which simply "suggested" he look into Berkeley as an urban, west coast school (I only mention Berkeley as opposed to the other schools suggested by menloparkmom because it's in the Bay Area).</p>
<p>Anyway...I'm done. I will let you have the last word--and I'm sure you will take it to flame away. Your most recent post certainly speaks volumes of the type of incendiary poster you are. I was trying to be helpful by having the audacity to merely suggest a school, you insisted on being critical. If you must argue this point, I would suggest (and read carefully) that you go back and re-read my first very first post and your response...then perhaps you'll know why I got testy.</p>
<p>Cheers,
CUgrad </p>
<p>I apologize to others on this post...but MPM continues to attack my character (as she has done above) and I feel obliged to respond.</p>
<p>Another reason I suggested "that school," is exactly as you say--they are all incredibly difficult to get in to. I didn't want to be pessimistic and suggest that as a reason to apply to "that school" or any of a dozen others--but it's a valid reason and certainly bears considertaion.</p>
<p>Cheers,
CUgrad</p>
<p>Also Afan, I responded because this was posted in the general college search and selection forum...Had this been posted on the Stanford, Columbia or MIT forums, I certainly would have left it alone since I don't frequent those forums. Your previous advice though is excellent. Thanks for lending useful information to this discussion.</p>
<p>Cheers,
CUgrad</p>
<p>I totally agree with Afan. I would add at least seven more schools to your list. This is the prudent step to take in case you are denied admission by your three choices. Your statistics are good but it does not guarantee admission because of the competition from other students. Those three schools are among the most sought after in the U.S. because of their prestige and strong name recognition.</p>