State School vs Selective

Hey everyone,

Here’s the deal. I’m still in high school and haven’t yet applied to any schools, but with my ACT scores, GPA, extracurricular opportunities, and outside of school leadership opportunities, I can say that I’m confident that I have a good shot at getting into some very highly selective schools such as Georgetown, BU, etc.

Georgetown was everything I’m looking for when we went on the visit program-wise and student life-wise. I know I would have a really great time there and the opportunities and connections I can make with the help of the school would definitely help me in life.

The problem lies in that right now, tuition is $48,000 a year and I’m not going to get much if any financial aid. My parents and I have talked and they’ve said that we’ll figure it out if I get in, but it still means graduating with probably over 150k in loans and putting significant stress on my parents, financially.

The state school where we live is going to cost me just over a grand per year in tuition due to the merit-based scholarships I’m eligible for, I’d probably graduate in three years debt-free and the university offers decent programs and opportunities, but I don’t know if I’ll ever be super excited to go there.

So, long story short, does anyone have any advice on going to a state school vs a much more selective school that’s a lot more expensive? And does that much in loans ever make sense? Any and all advice is much appreciated!

@thegraypear Have your parents run their financials through the net price calculator? They may be eligible for need-based aid. If they are full pay, you could look to schools in the DC area that offer some merit scholarships for high stats students like American or GW.

150K in loans is too much and you as a student can only assume 27K in federal student loans over 4 years. The balance would be loans cosigned by your parents.

Also Georgetown full cost of room/board/tuition/fees/books/transportation is probably around 65K+ all in. You may have already considered this, but if not, the non-tuition costs are also considerable.

Find reasons to love the in-state school that is also a financial safety. Does it have an honors program, for example?

Also there are public universities that have great merit scholarships for high stats students like Alabama, Old Miss, UT-Dallas, Arizona State, U of Arizona, etc. Your state may also be in consortium with other states that offer reciprocal tuition like Wisconsin/Minnesota or the Western Undergraduate Exchange that offers discounted tuition at many campuses.

You need to understand how much money per year your parents can contribute without their taking out loans. As a student, you can borrow $27,000 in total.

Your state university option sounds like it is both a financial and admission safety. So you could apply EA to that school while fishing for merit at more selective schools. You are smart to consider finances from the beginning of this process.

Georgetown is a phenomenal place. It wasn’t what my son was looking for in a school at the time we toured, but we still talk about it. It was the best tour we’ve been on. If I could go back in time and do it all over again, Georgetown would be my dream school.

That said, 150K in loans for an undergrad education is nuts. What do you want to study? Can you go to Georgetown for graduate school?

State schools are loaded with high achievers that didn’t qualify for aid at elite schools. Part of the reason rankings are meaningless anymore.

@OhiBro Yup. Well said as usual.

We live in Iowa, so the University of Iowa would be where I’d go if I went in-state. I haven’t looked at a ton of other state schools that offer aid but I’ll definitely be applying to some schools like GW and Fordham that offer more merit aid.

I’m looking into studying somewhere around foreign service, language, and economics on a pre-law track. I know that’s fairly broad but I’m looking for a program that can somewhat synthesize those areas into a major or double major. UIowa has a decent program, but I’m not sure about the opportunities I’ll get in terms of internships and work with professors/alumni.

Does doing three years undergrad at Iowa and going to a better grad school make sense? Or would I be missing the value of the connections of Georgetown as an undergrad?

In general, it’s a decision that becomes much clearer.

When you are actually accepted to any combination of schools.

Then you complete a careful review of the opportunities and costs.

For instance, if you have a direct admission to a high quality major and honors college at Iowa with little or much lower cost vs Georgetown at much higher cost as an undecided major in the “college” as they call it at gtown. Iowa.

If the fact set changes. Or same cost and same major. Gtown may be an easy choice.

There’s no easy answer to your question.

But the examples above should give you some idea of the choices and analysis you can apply.

Talk to your parents or have them sit with you and complete what is called the NPC on each schools website. If you find they are affordable to you as a family. Then look at how you fit into their admissions framework. Go on to the schools threads here on cc. Look at class of 2023 around ed and rd decision dates. You’ll get a sense of who’s getting in and who isn’t.

Just curious — why are you trying to cram four years of an exceptional experience (your undergrad years) into three? As an attorney and a former law school professor, I’d tell you to get a full four-year education before applying to law school. So many different fields of study are relevant to law — English literature and writing, economics, history, political science, logic, statistics, accounting, government and public policy. Heck, engineering and numerous other STEM fields for patent. What’s the rush?

As to the state school question: I was offered a full-ride scholarship from The University of Arizona and a place in their honors program. With a single parent who hadn’t managed to save anything for college, I happily accepted and moved to Arizona. For me, it was a great experience. My honors coursework was challenging, my professors were engaging and helpful, and I enjoyed four years of amazing basketball, hiking, and albondigas soup. I also won a Truman Scholarship at UofA which I used to pay for law school at UVA. Once at UVA, I made law review and ended up at a highly-respected DC firm pretty much loan-free. While I’m not advocating a state school over a more prestigious one, I add these details only to make the point that the key to your future success is far more your effort than the school you attend.

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There are lots of connections to be made at state schools. They have their share of elite students and also have strong alumni networks. Elite schools don’t come with guarantees. And yes you would be crazy to consider $150k in loans for undergrad.

I had this discussion today with one of my classmates from my MBA program. We both went to Michigan undergrad and Minnesota for our MBA. Michigan is one of the better public schools and Minnesota Top 30 grad B school. We both agreed get out of undergrad with as little debt as possible, also grad school too. Michigan did next to nothing for me for connections. Might have helped a bit for grad school, but I had classmates from places like Bemidji State and Augustana and they were all very smart. Unless you go to Harvard, Stanford, or a prestigious Ivy, I doubt the connection aspect does much. (Maybe Notre Dame which has a really good alum network). But I dont think someone will hire you just because you went to the same school as them if you don’t have the skill sets they need.

Yes, Georgetown is special, but lots of places are. My neighbor went to Iowa both undergrad and MBA, has done very well as a CFO, so it hasn’t been bad for him, and he enjoyed it. I like Iowa City a lot. Or find another school out of state that will give you cash and you like. After your first job or two, no one cares where you went to school anyway.

Student loans will burden you and your family like you can’t imagine, especially with that level. You won’t be able to take trips and see the world, buy a car you like, a home, or even delay starting a family if you have to worry about a large student loan. And they are one of the few debts that isn’t dischargeable in bankruptcy, so it sticks to you no matter what like an albatross.

Again, graduate with as little debt as you can ($150K is nuts), enjoy yourself at college, wherever you go, as it is one of the few times in your life where you have few cares, study hard, and if law school is your thing, great. You might change your mind too like me (who got in to law school and changed my mind). This is the time of your life to explore.

If you want a smaller college you could also try to chase some merit $$. There’s a thread on CC on colleges known for merit. Check it out!

I firmly believe any state flagship will provide a top notch education as long as you pursue the right classes, profs, and opportunities. You will be a big fish and can chart your future. Honestly, applying to prestigious law schools from Uni. of Iowa will make you a geographic diversity pick compared to the dozens or more applying from G’town.

Definitely check the net price calculator for Georgetown. It is unlikely that any student would truly need to take out $150k in loans for a school, like Georgetown, that provides need based aid unless parents are able but unwilling to pay.

Here is what I would do if I were you.

I would ask my parents exactly what is the budget for college.

Run NPC on the selective schools. If the selective schools would require more than $40K of loans in total for the 4 years then I would not pursue those schools at all.

If the state school is good enough to progress you and your career to where you want to go and it would cost $1K a year for tuition. (no sure if you also meant room and board) Then I would apply to the state school and be done with the whole process. Enjoy senior year without the crazy hassle of the college app process.

Just be sure to be certain that the merit from the state school is guaranteed based on your scores. If not you need to apply to a few schools.