San Diego County has a population over three million. There is a case for multiple CSUs there.
In contrast, the Central Coast – including San Luis Obispo, northern Santa Barbara, and southern Monterey Counties combined – has a population of maybe 650,000. The case for multiple CSUs is a lot harder to make in this situation.
For comparison, San Joaquin County, which includes Stockton, has a population of about 750,000 and no CSU. Maybe it’s more important to build the first CSU in the Stockton area than to build the second CSU on the Central Coast.
No one can reasonably expect the CSU System to guarantee an accessible campus within commuting distance of every single Californian. But still, I can understand why the Central Coast feels like the system let them down. They did have an accessible local CSU, and then it became inaccessible due to high non-local demand. It’s the academic equivalent of neighborhood gentrification.
Perhaps then it would make more sense to expand CPSLO to accommodate more local area applicants with a very heavy local area preference (like CSULB apparently does). Based on a rough estimate of about 7,500 HS graduates per year in SLO and SB counties, with about 2,500 being CSU eligible, that would mean having to expand CPSLO by up to 10,000 or so undergraduates if every CSU eligible HS graduate wanted to go there and were admitted at baseline CSU eligibility (of course, not all do want to go there, and the number would be lower if we exclude southern SB county that is closer to CSUCI). Then CPSLO could still be a statewide-desirable campus while also serving all local area CSU eligible HS graduates who want to go there.
But then the tricky part would be how to allocate space in the most desired majors, if the local area applicants tend to prefer the same majors as other applicants.
Unfortunately Cal Poly is one of the more difficult state universities to expand. The current enrollment, at about 22,000, is unusually large relative to the adjacent City of San Luis Obispo, with about 48,000 residents. At this size, CP is already a strain on the local infrastructure. It cannot be automatically assumed, for example, that there would be sufficient water supply or sewage treatment capacity to support another 10,000 students in town.
I expect that such issues could be resolved, given enough time and money. The real question, though, is whether the delay and expense is worthwhile, given the fact that the local education market has already found a workable alternative solution for accessible bachelor’s degrees: CCC/private partnerships in the City of Santa Maria, 33 miles to the south. Maybe the best approach here is to simply listen to the market, instead of rigidly adhering to a traditional model that isn’t working.
Santa Maria is larger than SLO, and would love to host a 4-year school. Allan Hancock College would love to take over the degree completion programs currently handled by the privates. The students at AHC would love to avoid the hassle of switching schools after the first two years of college; they would also love to pay state school tuition, rather than private school tuition, for the last two years of college. The only thing that is preventing everyone from being happy here is the traditional assumption that CCCs are limited to 2-year education.
Maybe it’s time to rethink that assumption. The State previously rewrote the rules on doctoral degrees, because it made sense to expand them to the CSUs. Maybe it would make sense to rethink the rules on bachelor’s degrees as well, at least in some situations.
Re #20: we have CSU Monterey Bay that already serves central coast
Re#19: CSUCI is 55 miles from Goleta/UCSB so its location makes it more commutable than SLO (~100 miles away) for Santa Barbara kids.
IMO, the CSU system has very good coverage in ideal locations ranging from So Cal, central, central coast, inland empire/high desert to far NorCal areas. The key going forward is looking at population trends and where the next CSU can optimally serve the most students.
CSUMB and CSUCI are 274 miles apart, and CPSLO is almost at the midpoint between the two (based on road distances). Note that CSUB is of similar distance from parts of the central coast as CSUCI. From San Luis Obispo / Pismo Beach, you are looking at a ~130 mile commute to CSUMB, CSUCI, or CSUB if you are unable to get into CPSLO.
But with those distances, there are places on the central coast that are ~60 miles from the nearest CSU even for a student who is able to get into CPSLO as well as CSUMB, CSUCI, and CSUB.
@CALSmom The CSU System does, in fact, have pretty good geographic coverage. Most Californians live within commuting distance of a CSU, and that’s great. But – what if you can’t get into your nice local CSU?
And this is an growing concern. The CSUs are intended to serve the upper 33% of high school seniors. But if your local CSU is a school like Cal Poly SLO or San Diego State, you can easily be in the upper 33% and still get rejected. If you live within the Cal Poly service area (roughly Paso Robles to Lompoc), you could be in the Top 12.5% (which is UC-level) and still get rejected by your local CSU. And there is no other CSU within commuting distance, because CSUCI, CSUB, and CSUMB are all more than 100 miles away from that area.
It’s important to put new CSUs in areas of population growth. But it’s also important to recognize that some of the old ones are failing to serve the 33%, which is what they are supposed to be doing. You should expect more and more of the most popular CSUs to be affected over the next 5-10 years.
Indeed, there are some students who would not get into CPSLO, but would get into some of the UCs. For these students, the UCs may be better choices than attending another CSU as a resident student because UC financial aid adjusts for living expenses for non-commuter students, unlike CSU financial aid. The UCs are also more residential, so attending them as a resident student may be more attractive than attending a mostly-commuter distant CSU as a resident student.
But those in the CPSLO area who cannot get into CPSLO or a UC may find the option of attending a distant CSU as a resident student less attractive due to both the higher cost and the unattractiveness of being a resident at a mostly-commuter school.
Re:#25: That’s where CCCs become a viable alternative. It’s cheaper and many times closer to home for most families. Kids can transfer with better chances into a UC or CSU and get their upper division courses easily compared to GEs as a freshman at an impacted CSU
Well, that exact point has already been made in this thread. See Post #8 above.
@CALSmom As you note, the CCCs are a “viable alternative” – but only for the first two years of undergraduate study. What about the last two years? If the local UCs/CSUs are so popular that they are inaccessible to many qualified freshman applicants, then it follows that they may also be inaccessible to qualified transfer applicants, right?
Another option has developed on the Central Coast. A local community college, Allan Hancock College, invites less selective private universities, like Chapman or LaVerne or Embry-Riddle, to set up satellite programs on the AHC campus. After two years, the AHC grads then “transfer” to the private schools – but they actually continue to study locally at AHC.
This is a clever “workaround”, but like any workaround, there is room for improvement. My suggestion would be to make the process cheaper and easier by allowing AHC to take over the private degree completion programs and offer four years of instruction. This would mean allowing a CCC to offer four years of instruction, instead of capping them at two. That way, the CCC becomes a “viable alternative” for the the last two years, instead of only for the first two years.
It’s not realistic to assume that all AHC grads can transfer into Cal Poly or UCSB. Such students currently have the option of finishing their bachelor’s at a less selective CSU, like CSUCI or CSUB or CSUMB. But all those schools are more than 100 miles away, so for commuters this is not a realistic option either. That’s why the AHC/private hybrid has emerged as Option 3. I think the market is trying to tell us something here. http://www.hancockcollege.edu/university_programs/
Corbett, a lot of CCs feed into the nearby CSUs and UCs and I know plenty of families who have chosen this route and it worked out great for their kids. Their chances of getting into a tough UC or an impacted CSU (program) are much more competitive as a high school senior as opposed to a CC junior transfer (assuming they have a very high CC GPA).
“UCLA is committed to being a transfer-friendly institution. A strong academic preparation and performance make you a more competitive candidate during the admission review process. The average GPA of admitted transfer students is above 3.5, and admitted students have completed most or all major preparatory courses. We give highest priority to applicants from California community colleges…”
From my experience/first hand knowledge, CC is chosen deliberately to save money not because the kid couldn’t get into a UC or CSU.
For what it is worth, the prior college GPA of CPSLO new transfer students averaged 3.41 (but varying by division, 3.24 for architecture and environmental design, 3.53 for business): https://admissions.calpoly.edu/prospective/profile.html
While this is not crazy-selective, it is not broad-access either (non-impacted majors at non-impacted CSUs would admit with 2.0 GPA and C grades).