<p>Son is excited about Grinnell, we are all anxious about committing due to what seems like Institutional promotion of non-traditional lifestyles.</p>
<p>It would be much easier to commit if the University would commit to putting freshmen in sub-free dorms, however that does not seem possible.</p>
<p>Anyone care to comment on their experiences?</p>
<p>If you’re worried about what you call “non-traditional lifestyles,” then I strongly recommend sending your child somewhere else. Perhaps BYU?</p>
<p>Wow, zerozerowhat - that was pretty harsh. i was of the impression that the general attitude of tolerance at Grinnelll works both ways? it’s ok to be sub free, right?</p>
<p>We just returned from Accepted Students Day, and the overall message we got was one of respect for other students’ choices in every regard. My S did an overnight on a Friday night and asked about drinking and I guess saw the party scene in action as well, and he loved the school. He is not a partier.</p>
<p>Just to provide some possible insight here, I was told during orientation two years ago that Grinnell is commited to mixing students from 4 years together (no all freshman dorms as in some schools) so freshman can develop relationships with upperclassmen. The school thinks freshmen benefit from the mentoring that goes on. Since there are many more freshman than upperclassmen who want substance free dorms, it is a challenge to provide it to all the freshman who want it. As a result, not everyone who wants it, gets it-although they have added substance free floors to dorms that are otherwise ‘substance tolerant’ (or whatever you’d call it).</p>
<p>Not sure what you mean by “Institutional promotion of non-traditional lifestyles.” I haven’t seen the institution promote anything accept respect for others. If being respectful of non-traditional lifestyles constitutes ‘promotion’ than I think you may indeed find Grinnell pushing your boundaries.</p>
<p>To be clear, the primary concern would be if Grinnell says Son, we know you want to be in a substance free dorm, but we think it would be good for you to learn how to deal with fellow students smoking and drinking, similar concern regarding mixing boys & girls on one floor – if our son does not want to be in that environment. If son wants to be in a situation where girls come and go at all hours of the day & night, we won’t approve, but understand he is a big boy now…</p>
<p>The problem is if the institution forces these lifestyles on their students. At this point, I really have not had my question answered, previous responses assume I feel these issues must be banned on campus - if I (and my son) felt that way, then we would not be considering the school.</p>
<p>My daughter is a senior at Grinnell and lived in a substance free dorm her first and second years. Grinnell added a 3rd substance free dorm this school year so hopefully there are enough sub-free rooms for first years. If not, they most likely would cohort kids who could not get a sub-free room near other like minded kids. That is what has happened in the past. She has also always lived on co-ed floors with absolutely no problems. Co-ed floors were a non-issue for her, and that actually surprised me. All of her floors voted to have gender-segregated bathrooms. Although my D is pretty socially conservative, a non drinker and very religious, she has never felt pressure to be someone she was not, most students are very respectful of other lifestyles. If anything, Grinnell as an instituition models respect for all and does it extremely well. Schermold, feel free to email me if you would like.</p>
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<p>schmerold, I can’t imagine Grinnell saying anything like that. But they might say, Son, we don’t have enough sub-free (or single-sex) housing to accommodate all who requested it, so your room is not in a sub-free (or single-sex) dorm. If you would perceive that as the institution “forcing a non-traditional lifestyle” on Son, then Grinnell might not be the place for your family.</p>
<p>Truthfully, the majority of dorms at Grinnell are neither substance-free nor single-sex, and girls (and boys) do in fact come and go at all hours of the night. This <em>is</em> the traditional Grinnell lifestyle!</p>
<p>If they don’t have enough sub-free / single-sex housing, how difficult would it be to convert a floor to sub-free / single-sex housing?</p>
<p>As M’s Mom said, Grinnell does not want to have all first year floors or dorms. It is true that many more first year students want sub-free and/or single-sex housing so it is difficult to maintain the class year mix along with sub-free/ single-sex component. I think Bethievt’s son was on a floor that had sub-free cohorting. I don’t know how well that works, however. Has Grinnell told your S that there will be shortage of sub-free rooms next year? I’m not sure that there was a single-sex floor in my D’s sub-free dorm.</p>
<p>The reason why they don’t convert more sub-free / single-sex floors is because it is difficult to estimate how many of those floors are needed before room-draw. As far as I know, there aren’t too many returning students requesting single-sex housing, so there really is no shortage of those, at least not significantly. And even though some floors may be single-sex that does not mean that members of the opposite sex will not come in and visit.
Sub-free was over-enrolled this year again. Too many returning students who requested sub-free ended up not getting it, because they put some rooms aside specifically for first-years. As far as first-years living in sub-free goes, I believe a lot of those are pressured to sign up for it because of their parents, not because they actually wanted to. Also, the third substance-free dorm is only officially substance-free.
In general, it is important to keep in mind, that sub-free-housing does not equal sub-free person.</p>
<p>Since the situations you seem to be concerned about (“Son, we know you want to be in a substance free dorm, but we think it would be good for you to learn how to deal with fellow students smoking and drinking, similar concern regarding mixing boys & girls on one floor.”) can happen at most schools in the country, perhaps it would be helpful for you and your son to talk through how he can constructively handle potential problems as they come up. A respectful conversation about boundaries is always appropriate with room-mates. No one should have to put up with inconsiderate behavior in their shared space and lots of kids need help with the idea that discussing issues as they come up can save a lot of stress. That’s part of what self-governance is about and yes, Grinnell does want your kid to learn how to do that.</p>
<p>Schmerold, I’m betting that your son, while anxious right now about the big changes coming into his life, will be more than equal to dealing with them. There will be many others who share his views and are supportive. If it adds to his/your peace of mind, find out how receptive the housing office is to making changes mid-year for students who decide that their current situation is just not sustainable. I’m sure it happens, albeit rarely.</p>
<p>Been lurking on this thread. Grinnell is in ds’s top three. I haven’t visited and haven’t investigated these matters at all, but _silence’s post, combined with the others, raised a question for me:</p>
<p>If, as was mentioned in post no. 5, Grinnell wants to integrate the housing, agewise, and if, as mentioned in post no. 11, sub-free was overenrolled and more upperclassmen wanted sub-free than were able to get it because so many freshmen wanted it, then why not just have more sub-free housing for everyone? There seems to be a demand for it. What am I missing?</p>
<p>YDS - my guess is that the demand is evolving and growing, and that this year the College underestimated the upperclass demand. Presumably they will address it for the upcoming year, but if it is a deal breaker for a prospective student, I would recommend asking the Admissions office directly.</p>
<p>I believe from what we were told that the school, regardless of whether they run out of sub-free housing or not, they will try their very best to place you with a like minded roommate and that is the most important thing of all. </p>
<p>FYI the school has the upper classes draw their rooms much earlier in the process, so when the older students are drawing the school actually does not even know how many sub-free dorm rooms will be needed.</p>
<p>Grinnell feels very strongly about its close knit family environment and that is why they like to have every dorm and I believe floor for that matter be integrated with various grade levels. The younger ones will have the ability to have the older students right there in their dorm. This helps to foster a closer knit school. It makes for more inclusiveness in the overall experience. </p>
<p>From what my S has been told, this is one of the best parts of the Grinnell experience. The only way Grinnell could be able to absolutely guarantee that there would be enough sub-free housing for freshman each year would be to get rid of the inter grade level set-up, which I do know the school feels very strongly about. Much of it has to do with self-governance and as I said fostering a close knit inclusive school environment. I am very excited that my S will be living amongst older and presumably wiser students. My S has been told by a few kids that he corresponds regularly with that they love being able to live amongst all different grade levels and it has really helped them to feel comfortable with the school in general. </p>
<p>What we were told when we did our overnight in the fall is that you should be as honest as possible in your housing form and they will do their very best to put you with someone of like mind. The school would gain absolutely nothing by not doing their very best in pairing students together and by and large most students are very happy with their dorms and room mates.</p>
<p>I think the reason why there aren’t more sub-free dorms is that, while more people than anticipated request it, there aren’t enough to fill a whole dorm with it. or even more likely they have no clue, which dorm to turn sub-free.I remember how a lot of the upperclassmen got furious of James being declared a sub-free dorm. As for substance-free floors, they had those last year, from what I’ve gathered that didn’t work out to well. </p>
<p>I agree with what has been said about integrating different class years. I live on a floor that’s mainly upperclassmen this year and I loved it. I certainly prefer this to the alternative, living on a floor with people mostly my year or close to it.</p>
<p>D requested sub-free for next year and got it along with several of her friends (all are rising juniors). These kids will all have private rooms. If they can give four kids private rooms on the same hall in a sub-free environment (James), my guess is that there will be plenty of space available for new students.</p>
<p>D lived on a sub-free “cluster” her first year and loved it. It was the best of both worlds-go to parties if you want, come back for peace when you tire of the party.This past year was not as good of a residence life experience for her as the parties were in her living environment. She elected to go with sub-free again for next year as did a number of her friends. I do think Grinnell makes every effort to group students together who do not want the substance use in their living environment.</p>
<p>Additionally, think there is a quietly growing population of students who are opting for less or no substance use in their living environment. There are plenty of students who are not big fans of “all out” partying if the OP is worried about a social group being available for the individual who either does not use or, if they do, use in a limited fashion. In typical Grinnell style, they are not strident in their decision to limit substance use and are not judgmental of those who opt for heavier use.</p>
<p>_Silence</p>
<p>Not sure what you mean about sub-free floors not working. I suppose it depends on who the students are in any case, but my son was on a sub-free floor his first year and had a great experience.</p>
<p>OP–I wouldn’t say Grinnell promotes alternative lifestyles. I think a lot of unconventional students are drawn to Grinnell and the culture of the college is one of acceptance. I personally think of that as a good thing.</p>
<p>bethievt I believe you are right, it depends a lot on the person. I just happen to know some students, this year, who live in sub-free dorms, but are definitely not sub-free people. Why some of these students opted to live in sub-free dorms again next year and take away the place for students who want to live in a sub-free dorm because they prefer not do drink or smoke, is a mystery to me.
I know that my current floor was officially substance-free last year, but for the most part people did not care. It has to be said though, that my floor is not in the right dorm for substance-free housing and it was turned into substance-free after room-draw from what I’ve gathered.</p>
<p>Mary B James? That did sound like an odd choice for sub-free. I hear what you are saying. I think some students prefer a quieter “home” space even if they might drink at a party. Perhaps the new president will help refine these approaches.</p>