I’ve not heard too much interest in Northwestern’s jazz program - in fact, a jazz drummer from Chicago we met during auditions a few years ago was a little dismissive. I know it’s an excellent school in many other areas!
Many local folks go to DePaul. Closer to downtown that Northwestern BTW.
@japanesemusic I am bit confused. Are you looking for a major in music or simply coursework? Do you plan to major in business and take music history & theory courses or do you want to major in music? Either way - I would add IU Bloomington to your list. More on that later.
The schools you mentioned all have excellent music schools. So if you are majoring in music you have to consider all the application requirements and your level of playing/theory. If you just want to take music classes, than there are many universities in the US where you can major in business and take classes - and I would suggest looking beyond the top music schools to the schools that have business schools (or at least majors) and music schools/departments. The list is long.
As for IU specifically - you have both the Jacobs School of Music and the Kelly School of Business - both are top schools in their fields.
If you provide more information - either here or privately - I can share more thoughts generally.
@japanesemusic I would expand on beaglemom’s post just a little. The schools you mention have BM programs and so are conservatory programs. The terms “conservatory” and “music school” both apply to BM programs that include 2/3-3/4 music classes in the degree, have auditions, and focus on performance. Double degrees also include a BM (or MM in some cases).
The alternative is not only to just take music classes. There are many ways to study music. You can get a BA with a music major, or do a double major, or a major/minor in a BA program within a liberal arts setting. If you do a BA in music you might want to actually avoid schools that do have a conservatory or school of music, because often the best teachers and performance opportunities go to the BM students. There are exceptions so check it out carefully.
If you want to do business, that is often a separate school within a larger university. If you majored in business, you could take classes in music as electives in the college of liberal arts, but check that out too.
You might want to read the Double Degree Dilemma posted toward the top of this forum. It is really about different paths in studying music.
@Japanesemusic to be honest, if the financial side is not an issue, I would highly recommend you check out on Youtube any lessons or performances of your potential teacher at the schools you have picked as top choices. Then contact the teacher and arrange for a trial lesson. The cost of visiting USA and taking a private lesson with your potential teacher for the next four years is well worth the money in your case. You could make one trip to USA where you can visit 2, 3 or 4 schools of your choice and take all the private lessons during the same trip. Others have posted on the subject of taking a private lesson with a potential teacher especially in the actual school setting of your choice. That experience will automatically allow you to pick your school for you. This way you are the one deciding from your own personal experience as to which teacher you want to learn from. The choice of the teacher is the number issue in deciding which school you want to attend.
Just a couple comments on @japanesemusic post. The student is getting assistance from an English speaker on the post…which is fine. My H who has been here for over 30 years would not have that ease or structure a sentence in such a fluent manner (or understand quote marks for effect). I say this bc I wonder if something is lost in translation. Full UG studies in the US can be a career killer in Japan unless it’s maybe a creative field or graduate studies sponsored by an institution or company. But businesses traditionally hires from specific Japanese colleges. My nephew and niece are going through this process. If you are outside the system it’s tough.
My H has a US university diploma (sponsored through rotary) and that made finding a job in Japan MORE difficult. I’ve not heard of that changing. If the OP is serious I would suggest starting by working hard on TOEFL to get a good score. That is what propelled my H to rotary, scholarships and university programs in the US. He was determined to get a US degree when everyone advised him not too…that’s where my D gets her stubborn desire to get a performance degree from. But you need to look for assistance within Japan. My sister-in-law was researching this for my niece…checking programs in the US. Its too difficult on your own even with US relatives. It’s best to work through groups similar to rotary in Japan. They have a lot of information to help you.
Does anybody here have thoughts about UNCSA for undergrad vocal performance? D is a soprano who wants to sing opera. She has a friend there in dance who is really enjoying it, and got a really good scholarship, and bonus- they’re still taking applications.
D wants a liberal arts music major, as opposed to a conservatory or performance major. Top choices at the moment are Wesleyan and Vassar, planning to look at Tufts and Ithaca. She wants “no more rural than suburban” and would prefer East Coast or Midwest. Didn’t care for Bard, and Oberlin shockingly has no Italian dept (she wants to double major or minor in Italian). Thoughts about Skidmore, Dickinon, U Mich, U Miami and U Richmond? What haven’t I thought of? Would be great to find a school with merit aid since. Thanks!
Welcome! What’s your D’s instrument? Is she looking for a BM or BA? Or a double degree - Italian BA and Music BM? A program like Michigan is a conservatory within a University…but does have the gen ed requirements. Is that type of conservatory OK? Sorry for all the questions! The issue is that at first glance Skidmore and U Michigan are completely different animals. So it’s hard to have a sense of what would be a good fit. Not that she can’t try a few different “types”…but wondering what is most important starting with degree type.
You may want to read the Double Degree Dilemma on the main thread page (near the top) to help answer some of those questions.
Second the suggestion to read the Double Degree Dilemma, which discusses the many paths for studying music.
Ithaca has a conservatory (and double degrees). For a school that DOES have a BM program, check out the opportunities for students who are not in the BM program (or perhaps even majoring in music) and how they compare to the BM students.
Wesleyan is excellent for world music. Tufts and Vassar are great choices. Skidmore would be more in that vein.
@joeycorp
We are very new to this but just got some emails from Bowdoin and seems it fits the LAC+music need of your D. (I know it has Latin)
Hi! Similar questions: My son, now a junior (tenor and bari sax), wants a conservatory experience within a college or university. Also wants jazz, and the option to major in either performance or education or both (will audition for performance and, I guess, apply for education as well? Or doesn’t it work that way?). Is U. Mich a good fit for that? Ithaca, Syracuse, Rutgers (we are in NJ, Eastman are on the list so far. His GPA is quite high/standardized tests not so much.
@akapiratequeen
In general, your S would apply for a double major with Music Ed at any school that allows it and where he thinks that might be what he wants. If it’s not clear whether a double major is possible, call or shoot an email to the Music Admissions people to ask or have your son do it. You shouldn’t assume that it will be possible to do both and graduate in 4 years or even 4.5 years. It was something S asked about at every sample lesson in order to get the professor’s take, even if he had the official answer already. At many schools Music Ed applicants have an interview and sometimes an extra placement test or two on audition day. Adding or switching to Music Ed later can be done but could prolong the course of study at some schools. At other schools, the first year is pretty much the same for all music students in all majors so it’s less important. My S applied Music Ed only at our in state schools and at 3 others where a double major was not realistic and as a double major to two conservatories. You can keep a variety of options available and your S can decide next April.
For those interested in both performance and Music Ed, I’d recommend looking carefully at a few things. First, consider what core curriculum or general ed requirements all students have to take outside of their music course work. The more gen eds required, the harder it will be to do a double major. Coming in with AP credit might help with gen ed requirements at some schools, but other schools will not allow AP credit to replace core requirements. Gen ed requirements were the main reason the double major wasn’t realistic at some of my S’s target schools.
Second, try to find out how many students in the school of music overall and in the target studio are Music Ed majors, how many are performance majors, and how many are double majors, because it can affect fit for many musicians. For example, one of our state publics is very good at Music Ed, so the vast majority of music students are Music Ed, and there are not as many high level performers at that school. Another public school on our list had a different ratio of Music Ed vs. performance students - it’s in a major metro area and many applied faculty are working professional musicians so there were more performance majors. On the other side you may find that at a top conservatory or school of music, there might be very few Music Ed double majors in the studio and the double majors will have to take a heavier course load and so will inevitably have less time to practice than the performance only students. That isn’t necessarily a bad thing, but should be taken into account when considering fit.
Marching band also might be an important fit factor for some Music Ed majors - future teachers may or may not want college marching band experience and some schools even require a year or two of marching band for their music ed majors. At other schools (e.g. Northwestern, Michigan) very few BM students participate in marching band because it’s so time consuming. Different cultures at different places.
U of Miami: I think they allow you to get a Music Ed major plus a performance certificate, if that’s of interest, check to see if I’m right about that. That can be done in 4 years, I think, but a double major isn’t doable. I think they said they were adding that option when we visited, but my S did not end up applying. Great jazz program there.
Michigan: I seem to remember Michigan offered some similar combinations (performance w/ teacher certification or Music ed w/ performer’s certificate) but I could be wrong, it’s been a while. Check to see if your S meets the standardized test minimums that are posted for Michigan, but they aren’t terribly high.
Eastman: in many (but not all) studios a performance-based major is required (you can’t do MusicEd by itself) but you can double major in Music Ed and be done in 4.5 years, with the final semester tuition free if certain requirements are met. My S has been really pleased with the Music Ed dept at Eastman, though most studios don’t have very many Music Ed double majors. Most semesters S will be taking several more credit hours than the performance only majors in his studio.
Ithaca: the classical sax prof told us most of his studio is Music Ed only and he treats everyone llke performance majors anyway, so there is little benefit to a Performance/Music Ed 4.5 year double major unless you really want performance on your diploma. I do not know if that’s true for the jazz sax studio (given that there are more performance career opportunities for jazz saxophonists vs. classical), but worth asking.
Peabody was the one school we found where a performance and Music Ed double major could be completed in 4 years only, so you might check that out. I’m not sure if the new curriculum there as of Fall 2017 makes that 4 year double major less likely or not.
Perhaps look at Indiana or UNT to see if a double major is possible. I’m not sure because they weren’t on our list.
FYI most of the schools above stream at least some ensemble concerts and studio performances online - This is a really good time to look them up and mark the spring live streaming performances on your calendar. By the end of April most performances will be done for the year and you’ll have to wait until fall to stream any more and by then the school list will likely be mostly set.
This is great info! Does your son like Eastman? My son is doing the summer jazz program there this July to get a feel for it. It’s tops on his list as of now but we heard it is very small and therefore competitive/a reach. Did you feel like this was the case? Was the audition especially grueling, for instance? My son is much stronger in jazz than classical so that factors in as well.
Ithaca is his No. 2 choice. He’s going to visit Rutgers and Peabody, but the latter doesn’t seem to do early action which is a negative – he is doing it everywhere else if they will allow it. What were your S’s other choices? What did he like best about Eastman?
Thank you!
Just want to point out that a “liberal arts music major, as opposed to a conservatory or performance major” is very different from a BM/conservatory/school of music program, whether that program is in a freestanding “conservatory” or part of a college or university.
The liberal arts music major will be 1/4- 1/3 classes in music, with the rest gen eds/distribution requirements and electives. It is an academic degree that may or may not have a performance component. Classes include music history, theory, musicology, ethnomusicology, technology, composition and so on. Often there are no auditions (not always) for admission but in the fall students audition for extracurricular performance ensembles. Lessons may be available, often for credit. Performance may be entirely extracurricular or there may be some integrated into classes.
A BM/conservatory/school of music degree, whether freestanding or part of a college or university, will be 2/3-3/4 music classes, with fewer gen eds/distribution requirements. Almost all require auditions, many with prescreens. These programs offer immersion in music, with classes focused on music, lessons, rehearsals and practice taking a lot of time each day.
For anyone wanting to combine, say, performance and education, it might be worthwhile to consider doing performance for undergrad and education for grad. It can be hard to try to fit too much into one undergrad experience.
The Double Degree Dilemma covers all of this much better than this post 
Hi compmom, Thanks! Not sure if you are talking to me, but in my son’s case we are well aware of this. He will be getting a conservatory/school of music degree, not a liberal arts music major. The only question is whether to double up performance and grad or just do performance undergrad and education grad (or at Ithaca, education undergrad with the performance component).
One point I have seen made here is that undergrad Music Ed programs have the “methods” classes that teach you how to play the various types of instruments and how to teach others to play those instruments, whereas a master’s degree in Music Ed typically does not have that type of training. The person who made that comment here was a music teacher or former music teacher, I believe, but I can’t remember the name or I’d tag that person. I have also read here (but am not sure if it’s true or if it’s true in all geographic areas/regions) that someone with a Music Ed bachelor’s degree with no teaching experience (beyond student teaching) might be more likely to be hired than someone with a Master’s Degree in Music Ed and no teaching experience because the person with the bachelor’s degree will cost less, salary wise. Anyone knowledgeable care to comment on that? For what it’s worth, my son has loved his methods classes so far.
@akapiratequeen I’ll answer your other questions via pm when I have a chance. Glad your son is doing a summer program at Eastman - it’s a very good way to get a feel for the school, though summer is pretty quiet so you’ll get a much better sense of the Eastman community on audition day.
Thanks @classicalsaxmom!
Sorry - I forgot to check back in here! Thanks for all the great replies. My D is a singer, with an interesting combination of loving choral music and being an indie pop singer/songwriter. She likes classical solo rep, but is not enough of a stage creature to pursue musical theater and opera. Hence the B.A. Music interest: she wants to study composition, conducting, history and theory.
Since my first posting she’s decided she does NOT want to double major, but rather to minor in Italian and do a semester abroad. We did visit Tufts which is now #3 after Wesleyan and Vassar. Does anyone know anything about the music major at Dickinson? I don’t know anything about Gettysburg, so would welcome information there, too. (Yes, Mich is an outlier; so, in a way, is Northwestern, which we may consider too.) I know ideally she wants the big side of small, not isolated in a rural setting, and if possible, an easy train ride in any direction from NYC.
@joeycorp - I would recommend she look into Bard College - the (wonderful) music department in the college (not the conservatory) would provide everything she’s looking for.