<p>When you say his 8th grade SAT was 1560, was that CR+M or all three sections? I find it hard to square a 27 on the ACT with a 240–a perfect score–on the PSAT. A 27 is nowhere near the score he would need to get into one of the deep pockets schools that would be likely to really meet his financial and academic needs. Realistically, for an unhooked student, you should be looking for a 33+. To be a NMF, doesn’t he have to take the SAT, or have they changed that? In any case, if his performance on the PSAT is that much better than his ACT, I would forget about spending time prepping for and retaking the ACT.</p>
<p>With the exception of a Christian focus, schools such as the University of Chicago, Harvard, and Yale would seem to offer what he is looking for intellectually. (I took Biblical Hebrew at Harvard extension school decades ago. It was taught by someone from the divinity school.) I can’t imagine why MIT is on his list at all, frankly. The fact that it has some respectable non-STEM departments doesn’t change the primary focus of the institution. </p>
<p>OOS flagships are not going to meet your level of need, unless he wins a special scholarship of some kind.</p>
<p>How graduate departments in philosophy would regard the preparation at Wheaton or Taylor is an interesting question. I have no idea. I doubt that places such as Juniata or Gordon would provide the preparation he would need.</p>
<p>You might want to look into Pitt, which has a good honors college with the possibility of substantial aid for OOS kids with high stats, and a well-regarded graduate philosophy program. NYU is notorious for bad FA, and it is very expensive to live in NYC.</p>
<p>Questbridge should be a priority for you. If your income is under $500 per month, merit aid schools are not going to do the trick, unless that merit aid extends all the way up to a full ride. $30K off a $50K bill will not work for you. (BTDT)</p>
<p>When I read the OP, it sounds like someone more interested in a religious studies departments than philosophy departments. Or maybe Classics, concentrating on philosophy? I am waiting around for clarification.</p>
<p>This is my concern: a lot of schools aren’t adequately preparing students for competitive graduate schools, aren’t giving them the level of coursework needed, especially in ancient languages How does someone figure that out before it’s too late?</p>
<p>The OP’s kid doesn’t need to pick a career track now at the age of 17. He needs to find an affordable way to get a degree in a field that he loves which will help him launch at age 22 whether to grad school, professional school, a job, or some combination thereof.</p>
<p>There are philosophy majors in med school, and there are classics majors in virtually every discipline in corporate America and there are theology majors in law school and there are linguists in social work. I don’t the OP needs to figure out the next decade of her son’s life this minute.</p>
<p>It it wasn’t obvious from my post, I totally agree with blossom. </p>
<p>When a kid is thinking about medical school, though, it makes sense to look for a college that has a good track record of getting its students into medical school. Based on the OP’s post, I thought–maybe erroneously–that she was taking a similar approach to choosing a school which would help him get into a top graduate program in philosophy. </p>
<p>She also seemed to be saying that teaching was a sort of “back up plan” for him–he was going to teach “so he doesn’t starve.” For me, that “sounds” as if he thinks it’s fairly easy to get a job teaching philosophy in college. It isn’t; it’s extremely difficult. </p>
<p>Because teaching philosophy isn’t likely to become his ultimate profession, IMO, using a college’s track record in terms of getting its students into top-ranked philosophy programs should NOT play a major role in his search process.</p>
<p>I don’t know the OP’s family situation, but she should be aware that if her S’s father is known and living but isn’t part of the household, his income/assets will still be considered by many colleges in determining financial aid.</p>
<p>I agree with you too Jonri but let’s help the OP by being explicit:</p>
<p>OP- teaching philosophy at the college level is not a back up plan. If your son decides that teaching history at a private school after undergrad (which he can do in most states without a teaching certificate or a Master’s degree) is a possibility- well, that’s a back up plan. Developing expertise on the side in computer trouble-shooting or social media or taking a few courses in statistics (and doing well in them)-- these are all fine backup plans.</p>
<p>So picking a college which will get him into a top philosophy PhD program doesn’t need to be the be-all and end-all right now. This kid could change his mind 10 times between now and college graduation (which is totally normal!).</p>
<p>And because there have been so many great philosophy Ph.D.s chasing so few jobs, the quality of many, many college philosophy departments (not just the usual suspects) is very high.</p>
<p>Studying philosophy as an undergraduate is excellent training for the mind. Philosophy majors learn how to write and think and get the highest LSAT scores.</p>
<p>That said, I must agree that the doctorate in Philosophy doesn’t open doors to employment.
The academic job market is very poor.</p>
<p>The last time my university had an opening in Philosophy, there were over 200 applicants. This is far more competitive than getting into Harvard as an undergraduate.</p>
<p>First, let me say: “Thank you all for your replies! It has been very helpful in giving me additional things to consider and research.”</p>
<p>I have been wanting to reply to each one of you specifically, and hope to be able to do so more thoroughly next week sometime. And ask more questions as well, lol. ;)</p>
<p>A few quick clarifications:</p>
<p>I had to go back and check what I wrote to make sure I hadn’t misstated his intended “career path,” and thankfully I said what I thought I had - though obviously I was unclear. When I say “teach,” I do not intend to suggest that his “back up plan” in to become a Professor. While I do not know the availability of teaching positions at a High School level for someone with a PhD in Philosophy, I am quite confident that he is more likely to make a living at SOME teaching job than as a published Philosopher.</p>
<p>I’ll also point out that my son is not at all overly idealistic with regards to a life lived on a low income! Of his 16 years of life, less than 2 have been lived above the “poverty line.” I’ve been very close to a couple of people who were accustomed to a certain level of prosperity from birth, and when financial difficulty hit them it was utterly devastating emotionally and psychologically. I am by no means ignoring the power of “financial security,” but I suppose I’ve concluded that my son “knows what he’s getting into.” And his determination to get through college without accumulating debt reinforces my ability to “let go” in this particular area of his life and future (not that I’d have any other choice in a couple years anyway, lol). In all honesty I am very proud of the young man he is becoming, and often amazed by his maturity. Poverty often creates a life-defining drive for material wealth and success; and I am truly grateful that the only piece of this I have ever observed in him is his desire to remain debt free.</p>
<p>Roughly in the same vein: I am very much aware of the fact that he will most likely change his mind regarding his intended educational and career paths. I am approaching this not so much - as I suppose I’ve come across - as how to make him most successful in his pursuit of becoming a Philosopher; but rather I want to ensure that he has reasonable access to the resources needed to do so if he “stays the course.” Which is why we aren’t focusing solely on the Phil Depts and seeking out THE BEST undergrad philosophy school (otherwise Reed would be at the top of his list rather than excluded). It’s also why there are multiple things desired of any possibility, because we both want him to go to a school that is - at the very least - solid in the areas that most interest him (those which are very real possibilities for his future focus). It seems silly for someone to knowingly choose to attend a school that would effectively destroy their chances of advancement in the very subject which they (currently) most desire - assuming of course that there are better options available.</p>
<p>With regard to what I mean by “‘hostile’ to Christianity,” I mean precisely that: hostile. I went to a small, private college which was proudly anti-christianity, and I know the hostility there was quite mild compared to many places. I consider it to be a hostile environment when professors - as a general rule - respond to learning that someone is a Christian by rolling their eyes or laughter. I consider a classroom environment to be “hostile” when mocking someone’s beliefs is acceptable, especially when the professor is the one doing the mocking. And I consider it “hostile to Christianity” when the only open discrimination tolerated is against Christianity.</p>
<p>I know I am missing a LOT here, but I do hope to have some time to sit down and reply properly in a few days!</p>