@toowonderful can speak for the Tisch summer program. I’ll speak for the Steinhardt one.
I think that the Steinhardt summer intensive program gives students an opportunity to really get a sense of what the BM program is about. I believe the same can be said for the Tisch program. Because of that, I would start my research now to determine which program seems the best fit for your daughter.
The Steinhardt program offers a BM degree in vocal performance with a concentration in MT. It is one of a few programs out there that offers a music degree in vocal performance as well as MT training. But because it is a music degree, the emphasis of the program is more on voice than dance and acting, and students take the same music requirements as all other music majors (keyboarding, music theory, aural comprehension, and music history.) The vocal training is classically based, although it is MT repertoire primarily. The curriculum does include dance and theatre training, but offers more emphasis on music. There is a senior recital and a showcase for industry professionals.
By contrast the Tisch program is a BFA in theatre.
The thing that made the program so special for my D, was that the classes are truly run like the undergraduate program and are taught by their full-time faculty. So when your child auditions, she would be very well prepared and wouldl know her auditioners. Back when my D did the program (about 8 years ago) they even selected some students from the summer program who did not need to audition again for the BM program, but I do not think that is the case anymore. The same faculty and voice teachers are teaching that D had–with the exception of William Wesbrooks who no longer runs the summer program, but instead it is run by Dianna Heldmann who was D’s voice teacher and is now the head of undergraduate studies.
So the program would allow a student to really see what the undergrad program is like and who the faculty are. They will have a taste of living in NYU dorms and living in the city. The summer students will have some free time to explore NYC as well as some scheduled group outings in the evenings. Also the students will get a real sense of how they stand in a nationally competitive program. At least 6 or 7 students who earned the BM degree with my D attended the summer program as well, so it will give them a clue as to who their classmates will be.
Also, not sure if you can apply to both summer programs. I’d call to confirm, but my guess would be that you can.
Just to add…There are several Steinhardt grads that D knew that are currently/ recently on Bdway–most actually in very dance-y roles. So whether the dance training though the program was strong enough for them, or they supplemented it by taking classes–I can’t say.
One is ensemble in Kinky Boots, one is a dance captain/ ensemble in Book of Mormon and one was a lead in On the Town (Jay Johnson.) There may be others, too. I know that a Steinhardt grad student won a Tony in 2015 for the King and I (Ruthie Miles.)
@MTsg17 - The faculty D worked with in Tisch summer program were NSB faculty. One nice element was that at her audition 6 months later, several of the people on her panel were people she had studied with in summer, so she felt comfortable. The classes were a mirror of the studio curriculum- so that was nice too.
Another really nice element for Tisch was that summer students had the chance to visit most of the NYU studios in the course of her time there. So during the interview portions she felt she could comment confidently, which “might” (no way to know for sure) have helped her eventual placement.
And finally- the kids saw 8 shows over the course of the summer - and had talk backs with cast members of every one. And not just “guy in the chorus” (a la the HS chorus trip). It was Billy Porter after Kinky Boots, Cuba Gooding and Vanessa Williams after The Trip to Bountiful- that sort of thing. Sometimes they stayed in the theater- other times people came to their classes the next day
@toowonderful and @uskoolfish Thank you for your very helpful responses! My D has already submitted her Tisch application for the summer program (which is 4 weeks long, not 5 as I mistakenly posted above), and we will look further into the Steinhardt program because I think it could be a great fit since her greatest strength is her voice.
It is so interesting that the Tisch deadline was January 13th and the Steinhardt application priority deadline isn’t until April 27th.
My D attended Steinhardt last summer and loved it!! @uskoolfish described it well, and provided me with answers to all my questions last year! I’ll just add…Most kids saw 6-7 shows, some through program and some on spare time! They attended a talkback with cast from On The Town…Tony Yazbeck, Jay Armstrong Johnson,etc!! Jay taught dance class for the kids at least twice if I remember correctly and Ruthie Miles came in for a Q&A one day for lunch. I’m forgetting a few other special guests, but I’m not good with all the Broadway names!
For my D, she particularly appreciated the private voice lessons with Dianna Heldmann and working with Michael Ricciardone. She also received some material (songs) and suggestions for other material that would suit her voice.
Ultimately, it was a great experience at a more voice-based program (BM) after a BFA intensive the summer prior. And, a great experience ‘living’ in NYC for three weeks. I appreciated the freedom they had to explore the city once classes were done for the day.
She’s now looking forward to her audition in February!!
The Steinhardt one is for fewer weeks and does not offer college credit, so it is significantly less expensive.
But again, I think it is worth really delving into both programs to see which appears to be the better fit as an undergraduate student. Since the summer programs are so aligned to the actual undergrad programs, I think it is an excellent opportunity to try out the program you are hoping to get into for college.
Also, unless you are considering allowing a student to apply to NYU, and see it as a real possibility, I would not chose these as summer programs. In our experience, most of the students decided to apply based on how much they loved the experience. If it is too much of a financial burden, or if grades/ scores might not be high enough, I would not chose this route because there’s a good chance they will really want to attend NYU after going.
Thanks @toowonderful for the msg. Yes @uskoolfish I would say you wouldn’t attend those summer programs unless NYU was an option for your child, which for us it isn’t. My D will have to focus on some other options…just isn’t in the cards money wise…
Here is something that has been on my mind while reading this thread… I think if I had a child who was just entering this process I would be feeling very defeated because I could not afford summer programs, expensive coaching, SAT prep classes, many cross country trips to attend auditions on campus etc. We had to do things very frugally. But she succeeded in getting into one BFA and several other schools despite the lack of extras. Don’t despair if you don’t have the funds to send your kid to an amazing camp or audition coach. They will end up finding a special spot to thrive. <3
Same, @bisouu .
My D did attend an excellent conservatory-type theatre camp a few times when she was a bit younger, but it was a lot less expensive, and it wasn’t associated with a college program and isn’t known nationally. She did use a coach, but on more limited, affordable-to-us basis than many (after starting with a local monologue coach and panicking a little in September senior year and realizing that wasn’t optimal), and she did have a fantastic local vocal coach and another fabulous one sort of nearby that also helped a couple times. (The latter “just” suggested a song once and confirmed that D was on track and ready.) She did have ACT tutoring, but my friend (the tutor) generously gifted that to D. I remember getting a bit freaked out that we hadn’t chosen to have her go to one of these camps or use a national coach (before we used one a little), but her results were great, and she’s fabulously happy so far at her choice. I thought it would’ve been nice for D to know more of the auditioners like the kids who do these programs did, but D didn’t seem to mind; she really just wanted to focus on herself and her auditions, anyway, and she also ended up meeting people along the way.
We did do many trips (all driving), including both NY and Chicago Unifieds, but we were fortunate enough that H could travel with us for business and expense hotels and gas. We would’ve found a way to travel like we did, anyway, but that was a nice bonus!
@bisouu I would say I am that parent…my D is a junior so my experience is getting ready to ramp up here soon with SAT and making college lists and feeling inadequate is surely a part of it. My husband and I have managed to provide my D with camps of a moderate cost each summer since 4th grade and voice lessons and dance etc. now she is at an arts high school so those costs ended but others took their place. At least i do not have other kids so at least I don’t have that to contend with more expenses. I go from thinking my D needs a coach to thinking wow I can’t afford that. We can’t send her to a summer camp that costs $7000 etc. she can’t meet and “collaborate " with big name college faculty and that’s just the way it is… I am just praying it all works out and to be honest at this point I’m just hoping and praying her song choices in her auditions are the right ones for her and they show off her voice enough to get noticed and a few acceptances follow suit. There of course is that always looming background thought also of " well the school that did accept you you can’t attend because it’s not affordable”
It’s seems like it will be an endless puzzle to fit in all the pieces together of : apply to a lot of schools, hope they admit you academically, then hope you get in artistically and then hope we can afford the price if your stats weren’t high enough for a lot of merit money and …what if the only schools that take you aren’t reachable financially in the end? I will say in all honesty I envy those who are at the point that the money isn’t an obstacle.
It is really, really hard for middle income parents. But, @theaterwork, take heart that most of the kids represented on this board do end up in a good spot. Not always the spot they expected, and it doesn’t always happen fast enough to prevent severe anxiety and doubt, but it does happen most of the time.
I think that lots of parents feel inadequate at some point in the process (if not the ENTIRE time). We chose to do the college summer program rather than a coach or sleep away camps (interlochen etc) in earlier years- and I second guessed that decision a million times. It is so easy to read this site and think that you have to do it ALL. That simply isn’t true. While any one of those things can be a “help” - especially in terms of confidence, they are not necessary. The two most successful kids to come out of my D’s PA HS in the last 5 years (multiple bway, tv and film credits) did not do ANY of those things. They stayed home summers and did local youth theater, worked on audition pieces with teachers, and we’re done. Btw - one of them only had 1 BFA acceptance- Carnegie Mellon. (On the other hand, he only applied to 4 programs)
And a lot of it is luck or kismet or whatever you believe in that have the stars align in your favor. For us, it was the summer program that set everything in motion. That particular year acceptances were offered (talent-wise) for a dozen or so students who had done the Steinhardt summer program. (I had no idea that was a possibility!) Really not sure if that has happened again since. But it worked for us. So my D did not audition at all for MT programs. And knowing she’d be accepted at NYU, allowed her to explore other non-audition programs–some non-musical theatre schools all together-- and allowed her to decide which direction she wanted to go. She did audition in voice for talent scholarships at other schools like Brandeis, Muhlenberg and GW, but no coaches, unified auditions, etc. So for us the $4,000 we spent that summer for the NYU program saved us money and was probably the reason she won her $11K a year scholarship there.
But in the end, you do what you can do. And hope that some factor goes right and makes things move in the direction you hope for!
The decision to do these summer programs, coaching and the rest is as much about choice as it is about income. You can be someone that can afford all of it and still decide nope, not a priority nor a necessity and not look back.
@bisouu not to pick on you but since I know your story a bit, your daughter had plenty of very enriching summer experiences prior to applying to college. Some of them involved theatre, some involved scooping ice cream and doing whatever else many a 16, 17, 18 year old does in the summer once they are old enough to work. She brought those life shaping experiences to the table and they made her ready to take on all she has taken on. She is excelling in her program because of who she is and the experiences she brought to the table. Would you really trade that? Why?
I agree with uskoolfish above that you do what you can do. Doing what you can do does not have to have anything to do with what you are able to spend. It might mean letting your kid borrow your car to get to work or rehearsal or lessons. Or packing a lunch in the morning before they go off to their job. Or doing some thorough research into the college process as @theaterwork and many others to help organize the college application process. The list goes on. These summer programs are terrific. But they are but one of many choices.
True but hearing that people travelled all over the country doing on campus auditions, hired professional coaches and had their kids attend training programs in excess of $8,000 made me worry that my daughter was at a serious disadvantage. Just trying to help those out there know that their child can be successful without spending a lot of money.
I think parenting gets more competitive every year. Everyone wants their kids to have "the edge. Talk to parents trying to get their kids into HYPS, or trying to have a kid play a sport at the college level - the same ideas of “coaching” (academic, athletic, artistic) and “enrichment” (camps, teams, college programs) are all over the place. I don’t know if it works or not - are we raising the bar or creating a rat race?
Please know that I am not putting down those who can afford and choose to do these wonderful things for their kids.I just want others, like me, to know that a student can be successful in this process without it.
^^^And I want people also to know that there are people who maybe could decide to afford it who also came to the same conclusion about being successful in the process without it too.