Support for ADD and Executive Function

The schools don’t always pay for the services for the blind or deaf students. They’ll implement the services, like getting the notes translated to braille or use the speaker systems for the deaf, but often those services are paid for by other organizations.

I’m sure the disability services office would work with the EF coach to get information to the coach, to get access to assignments, etc., if the student paid for his own coach.

I don’t think anyone is saying the services aren’t needed, just that the school isn’t going to pay for them and isn’t required to pay for them. There are a lot of issues students have that, if treated, would make them much better students or even allow them to stay in school, like mental illness, alcoholism, drug problems, but the schools are not going to pay for services to treat those illnesses or conditions.

Actually, the needs of young people with all of those conditions were ignored and left out of education and other meaningful life experiences until quite recently. Still are in a great many places. The grass just looks greener from where we stand.

Let’s not fool ourselves. There are kids living with all kinds of trauma and disabling conditions who are thrown to the wolves every damn day. All we can do is educate ourselves and advocate for our loved ones as hard as we can. For that, I appreciate the detailed sharing in this conversation ENORMOUSLY. Thank you all so much.

Why are you sure of this? It hasn’t been our experience.

@“Cardinal Fang” that WAS my son. My son sounds like @Corraleno’s son. In 9th grade he was a basket case (hence executive function tutoring 3x a week). But he is also brilliant. It is a tough combination!

I guess my advice is to think a few years ahead, if possible. When my son was in 9th grade I didn’t know if he could handle college. (And before he was diagnosed in 6th grade, I doubted he could handle high school). As I’ve written, high school was a time of figuring out strategies so he could function on his own (over the course of 4 years).

I realize most of the posters on this thread have kids already in college but I’m writing about our experience in case someone reading is at an earlier stage.

In looking at schools we focused on small schools (my son visited and nixed medium sized schools (5,000 students) early on so we concentrated on schools with 2,000 or fewer students). Colorado College, seems perfect for kids with EF issues (only one class at a time!) (However my son was rejected ED).

Now that my son is a freshman, and doing ok, I am thinking a few years ahead. Obviously it is his path, but I am trying to think of careers where his ADD is an asset and not a liability.

I guess that’s my point: ultimately these kids need to figure out how to thrive. If our kids were blind, yes, they would need help, but I think we would be doing everything we could to give them the tools to succeed on their own, as much as possible.

I’m not saying sink or swim, or that our kids should never need help, just that it is important to give them the tools so they can function in the world independently.

To return to the original question, it’s interesting that my kid has focused on two final choices. Brandeis is small (but not super small at 3500), and UMass Amherst is huge. I think she’ll probably choose the big school because it’s familiar, closer to home, and more affordable. None of these factors directly address her learning needs, but neither are they unrelated. Her emotional comfort is going to have an enormous impact on how successfully she launches.

I don’t have concerns about her functioning independently in the world in general. Yes, she’s got challenges, but it seems that her assets are easier for others to see. The issue for me right now is specifically about college, and how overwhelmed and fearful she seems about the transition. But the truth is that I don’t know what would ease her transition. The availability of good EF coaching would help me feel better, but I have no indication that it would do anything for her. She wants to have those skills within herself, and is not able to accept that they might come excruciatingly slowly and only through modeling, coaching, and deliberately copying the strategies of others.

@Lynnski if it helps, my son was also very anxious before the start of college. So you can imagine how happy I was when he told me halfway through the first semester “it’s easier than I thought!”

I hope your daughter has a similar experience.

It’s great if a disability office support is great. Just make sure student has buy-in to use the services. Some bright / EF challenged kids (including one of my kids) tend to want to use the wing-it mode that worked well in the early years.

Lynnski, you sound like an smart, aware parent :slight_smile: I just want to add a few thoughts that haven’t been mentioned.

College is treated differently than high school in terms of accommodations because technically it is not compulsory. That is why the Americans with Disabilities Act is the main driver, not IDEA.

Colleges do not have to accommodate if it poses an administrative or financial burden, or if the accommodations substantially change the academic program. This is of course open to interpretation and does land in the courts.

I think people are relying way too much on disabilities offices here. Understand that at some schools, the function of those offices is to protect the school legally- and protect its curriculum (“guard dog of the curriculum” as one person put it).

In our experience at several schools and dealing with several categories of disability, the disabilities office will require documentation (and I wrote the letter, with a list of accommodations from my own research, and then had a professional sign- all professionals appreciated this), and then provide the student with letters to give each professor. Then accommodations are discussed with the professor.

Some schools will list accommodations on the letter, and some will only write that the student is registered with a disability and then negotiations happen with the professor.

So…in our experience it is OTHER people on campus who provide the real support. If one of my kids had a seizure, the dean wrote professors an email that said “You MUST provide extra time to this student.” A therapist or advisor may intervene too. In one case, the dean, advisor and disabilities officer were all on one committee and recommended a reduced courseload for this daughter with wonderful results. So there can be kindness within the formal system too.

I personally think it is almost impossible to predict what school will work well. You can talk to the DO but I don’t think that really gives the full flavor of what can be done at a particular school. We ran into more understanding at a supposedly cutthroat Ivy than an small artsy LAC- perhaps because they have more money and staff, perhaps because they want to keep their stellar graduation rate! (There are agendas other than helping kids that can work in your favor!)

Sometimes it even depends on individuals that you deal with. Maybe a dean or professor has a kid with ADHD for instance! No way to know that in advance :slight_smile:

Landmark College can recommend coaches who will work from a distance, online and by phone. If you can afford it , that might help the first year. They also have a summer program to prepare kids, and maybe even a year-long prep program. Check their website.

My kid with ADHD also had bipolar 1, and cannot take meds for attention. Very destabilizing. She does occasionally take a relatively gentle one, but only rarely. She is smart and insightful. What worked for her in the end was leaving traditional residential college, getting an apartment with friends, working (work organizes her, it really does) and taking classes p/t through an adult learner program aka continuing ed. She is almost done her junior year. She works with autistic kids and her own experiences make her very empathetic. This is NOT a disaster story but a wonderful one of her following a path that works.

My other kid has several serious medical issues. She is almost done a doctorate. It has been a hard road though with some extraordinarily understanding and kind people along the way.

For both of them, accepting accommodations was difficult. I have explained the concept of “level playing field” over and over, as have their advisors. Kids’ reluctance to accept accommodations is one of the biggest challenges.

That said, I do believe that kids earn respect by taking responsibility. If my kid with medical issues was sick, and given two week to get an assignment in, she would do it in two days if she could. If things got bad enough so that she needed accommodations often, she took a medical leave twice. She did not burden the school and I believe she got more support as a result, not less.

Be reasonable, but firm. Documentation is important and provide your own list to the professionals writing letters.

Small thing: single rooms can be helpful but are isolating in freshman year, and cause gossip at some schools since everyone wonders why you have it.

Protecting the transcript is important. Withdrawing from classes before the deadline or even taking a W instead of an F. Taking a medical leave if appropriate, which can mean wiping grades.

Oh- and get tuition refund insurance. But check and see if ADHD/EF is covered. It IS brain-based so it should be!

Things do tend to work out over time. Maybe I’m a polyanna here and I don’t mean to discount the challenges. It has been an honor to be on CC and hear about what some kids, whose parents posted like you some years ago, have accomplished.

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I will add one more comment to the already wonderful suggestions and anecdotes here- parents need to take a hard and objective look at how much scaffolding and support they are currently providing to their HS kid. And I mean hard look.

I know parents who think it’s typical to drive to HS twice a week to deliver the forgotten chem book or lunch. I know parents who think that EVERYONE maintains a huge calendar in the kitchen where every assignment, test, and project is recorded (by the parent) in five colors and updated daily to help the student keep track. And I know parents who think that it’s the norm NOT to have your kids do any chores- and I mean zero- around the house, because Job 1 is HS, their EC’s, and getting into college.

I see some of these kids flounder in college- even with appropriate accommodations and even with support and it’s really sad. I don’t think you need to turn your HS kid into a unpaid housekeeper, but a kid who can’t run a load of laundry while he’s making a grilled cheese sandwich, or has never had to wash up from supper is going to be hit with a triple whammy in college. First- the workload is much harder, even if there’s no busy work and there’s less stuff due weekly. It’s still harder and that’s a pivot that every kid has to deal with. Second-- college typically doesn’t offer the second chances and extra credit opportunities that HS does, so falling behind can be really problematic. And third- Mom and Dad aren’t there to clean up, change the sheets, do laundry, get $20 from the ATM (yes, time-consuming) so the absence of all those parental assists becomes pretty painful once the work REALLY gets tough around midterms.

Even the most understanding professor is not coming to your kid’s dorm room to check on clean underwear, pick the towels up off the floor before mildew sets in, or make sure your kid is eating at least one healthy meal per day.

So do an honest assessment about how your child has been making it through the week before figuring out how much support and what type.

I agree with a lot of the previous comment - except that , honestly, no amount of training is going to address the challenges of certain brain-based disorders. Would we say that having my kid with epilepsy doing the dishes more would help her in college?

That said, this comment is extremely valuable in terms of looking at the “scaffolding” going on at home for academics. Love the description of the calendar in 5 colors by the parent (thought that can be modeled by the kid).

My kids did not do chores during high school (they were never home) and they are all hard-working, and keep their places up, do laundry and make meals. Well the kid with ADHD is usually late and buys food to take out :slight_smile: But she earns the money so that is her business.

I confess to driving three hours- once- to take my kid with ADHD to a motel to work. At her teary request. The dorm was wild at her college. Her older sister, home on medical leave, went with me so it wasn’t just mom .

I can justify that I guess because my daughter had already decided to leave and do school p/t and she just needed to squeak by this one last time.

Her friend, who had money to hire a tutor, stayed and graduated. I remember telling him that I had chained her to the motel bed so she would write a paper, and he believed me!

I would say that for all kids, but especially kids with these challenges, leaving for college should be gentle slope and not a cliff.

Maybe some can manage starting that gentle slope while in high school but we were too busy coping with a bunch of stuff.

So for instance, when my medical kid went, the first couple of years I still dealt with prescriptions, supplies for devices, and insurance. She dealt with appointments. As things get passed to the kid, errors occur, at which point either you go backwards a bit or they learn- it depends on how serious it is for the error not to occur.

It’s a lot to ask a kid with challenges to take it all on once leaving home. Thank heavens for dining halls, honestly, and pay for laundry for one year if you have to.

That said, blossom is right. Too much support at home can backfire and also affect decision-making, making families think a kid can handle more than they actually can.

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Yes, I would say that. It may not help her epilepsy, but it would help her balance school, health issues, life issues.

My friend with many learning differences (and an alphabet of conditions like ADHD) did much better in college when she returned home and returned to her familiar routine of cooking (which she loves), taking care of the dog, loading the dishwasher, and doing some laundry. She was much more successful at school work when she had a balance of life too. When school was tough, she had the success of doing well at life skills. When she was away at school living in a dorm, it was pretty much all school, all the time. When she wasn’t doing well at school, she had no other successes happening.

Well it is different for different kids and families I guess. My kid with epilepsy could not do a whole lot extra for some of those years. Maybe you have a kid with health issues, maybe not, but for mine, with several other conditions, we did not ask her to do some things so she could focus her limited energy and her healthy time on things like school and EC’s. A kid with health issues is hardly spoiled and faces challenges just getting up every day. Ten years later, she is independent, lives 3,000 miles away and certainly cooks and cleans. Thank God for the right meds finally that allowed all this, as well as some technological advances for some of her other issues. Having seizures and being disoriented half the time isn’t conducive to a lot of chores.

This isn’t that relevant to the OP except that I have seen a lot of parents be really tough with their kids with ADHD and it hurts to watch. Noone here is going to be like that of course, and there is a fine line between understanding and enabling. But I do think most kids DO grow up and take care of themselves and giving them support during teen years doesn’t prevent that.

If a kid isn’t ready, fine. They can go to school close to home or live at home and go to school and make the transition more slowly.

Wow, you all have shared so many important comments and experiences here! I expect I will refer back to this discussion a great many times in the years ahead.

I don’t think she is ready to leave home, in that she is emotionally very attached and dreading the separation. She wants to go to college, and she doesn’t want to take a gap year, but she shows us how scared and overwhelmed and guilty she feels All. The. Time. She doesn’t ever let anyone else ever see that. I think she’s extremely dependent on us as a kind of relief valve. I’m sure this is related to the specific way her brain is wired, but I can’t imagine the accommodations or coach who could help a person with that.

We spent yesterday at an Admitted Students day at Brandeis, and I was super impressed. I left feeling that she would be better off at a small school, being a big fish in a small pond. I think she is leaving towards UMass, however. It’s familiar and it’s close to home. Both options are terrific, and it’s hard to picture her availing herself if services wherever she is. She’s fierce about her self-sufficiency and her own high standards. She also doesn’t feel or believe that anyone at any school really wants her to succeed. I think if she were in a smaller and explicitly caring community like Brandeis she might eventually accept that there are people on her side. But who knows? She’s at a good HS and it’s there that she became convinced that no one really wants her to succeed.

More to come. She is completely overwhelmed and won’t/can’t/doesn’t want to talk about any of the college decision process. So I am processing it here are much as I can!

Another possibility for her, if she eventually comes to feel she’s not ready to leave home, is to do her first two years at a community college and then transfer. This doesn’t work for everyone, but it works wonderfully for some.

IF UMass is close by, she may be able to live at home, and may also be able to matriculate but only take two or three classes. I think of this as a training wheels approach and can work well for some.

I read once that 1/3 of kids are not ready academically or emotionally for college, a figure that I think seems accurate.

Does she reach out to trusted teachers for help now? For me, that would be key.

An acquaintance who is a college professor told me recently that the difference between his A students and his C students had nothing to do with intellect. But when he announces “please come see me during office hours to discuss the topic of your research paper before you get started on your research”, the A students show up- with a few ideas- and then 15 minutes later, they leave with an actual topic and and outline. A few B students will show up- unprepared, waiting for the professor to “assign” them a topic (which he does). And the C students? nothing. Vapor.

The next week he announces “I’d love to check in with you on how your work is going- so feel free to email me any roadblocks you’ve found, or drop by my office. If my office hours don’t work with your schedule, stay a few minutes after class today and we can talk”. Same pattern- the A students take advantage of every opportunity to let him help troubleshoot, suggest additional resources, steer them away from a blind alley or time wasters. The C students- they are always winging it.

And what pains him- often, the C students are working harder- much harder- than the A students. But they end up doing twice as much work, whether studying for an exam, preparing to present at a seminar, or writing a paper, because they don’t reach out for guidance. He tries to be as non-threatening as possible; he’s not an authority figure, he’s there to help the students become the best they can be-- but if someone won’t share “I’m finding my topic impossible to write about- can you help me figure out why?” what can he do other than suggest and cajole???

Can you figure out how much help your D is willing to access in HS??? Not tutoring help- but looking to teachers to guide her work???

She does reach out to teachers. And she is an A student. Unfortunately, she spends a great deal of her time avoiding the work…and berating herself and feeling guilty for that. She (usually) does a great job eventually, but there’s NO time or attention available for enjoyment.

She shouldn’t stay home next year. I think that would feel to her like failure. But I’m thinking a lot about the idea of taking fewer classes. I wonder if she could matriculate at UMass and still be in the honors college, but with a smaller course load as an extended time accommodation. That feels like a good amount of/approach to scaffolding.

Procrastination is so common for people with ADHD. They (we) need the pressure of an approaching deadline. Along with list-making, I think help with planning work in increments over time is so helpful.

To me, reduced courseload is the single most helpful accommodation, and especially at a school with courses as standard enrollment.

Funding issues arise since that means more time on campus. Logically this would mean extended financial aid for the extra time needed to finish and in fact, that is what my kid received. Other schools may balk.

State and federal grants require that at least two course are taken (at UMass it might be 3 for “f/t”).

I hope that they agree to some reduction in course load for her!

Checking for clarity @Lynnski are you saying that exams will be more prevalent than papers in college?

I have to say…I’m not sure I agree. Most college courses do require written assignments that must be completed…on time and turned in. Written communication is a skill that is now required across disciplines.

There will be exams AND papers.

For clarity @thumper1 since she will be concentrating in the natural sciences yes, I would expect more exams than papers. She has great writing skills and writes a beautiful lab report. On the other hand, the open-ended essays in HS humanities classes were torture. What’s helpful for me is less about exams vs papers, however, and more about remembering that post-secondary, one can focus more on the kinds of exploration that are more natural and appealing to the individual.