I think girls hockey is later too.
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Yes. I edited the post - the link shows the calendar for all sports.
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I think lacrosse made a big mistake by picking Sept 1 rather than June 15 because college coaches lose the summer tournament season to talk to players. Maybe that’s how they want it, not having parents and athletes approach them at the tournaments, but it seems late.
In the olden days, everyone was committing to the big D1 powerhouse schools (including the Ivies) by Jan 1 of sophomore year (the lists would be published after that day). Now there are still a ton who commit very close to Sept 1 of junior year. Clearly there has been contact before Sept 1, there has been a lot of observation at summer tournaments, at camps, during fall ball. The Sept 1 date doesn’t really impact the top players as much as it does the next tier.
My daughter didn’t even decide to play in college until very late in the spring of junior year, and never contacted a coach until that summer. She was recruited by D1, D2 and many D3 schools, but the ship had sailed on her playing for a top ranked D1 school like an Ivy or Maryland or Virginia or receiving scholarship money from one of those schools (which was needed). It is never too late to find a spot to play at ‘a’ school. There are schools that want these good students/good athletes and my daughter found several (or they found her). She just didn’t have the option of saying “Hey, Yale, here I am, pick me.” She could have played at Smith (not a great team), she was recruited by Kenyon, lots of southern LACs, a few D1 schools that weren’t ranked as high. She found a D2 she liked academically and that really worked out well athletically and financially.
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I think particularly on the boy side for lacrosse, the latter date makes sense because boys are still growing. Many of those 8th and 9th grade recruits from before the rule change were busts in college lacrosse.
And many were the brothers or sons or nephews of former players of the coaches. They knew what they were getting.
IMO, they are still being recruited early. A friend was “Mr. Lax” in our state. He was an all american several times in college. His little brother? Even more heavily recruited and is currently only a sophomore.
The older brother was actually a very late recruit. He committed as a sophomore but decided against that school and didn’t commit until April of senior year. Top players have that power.
With the new transfer portals, all of this is changing. I can’t believe how often the announcers during games are saying “he played at X last year” or “she’s a transfer from GT”. Some of that is because of extra eligibility due to Covid but some is just the new transfer rules.
Clearly there is a very active back door. Every Ivy recruit I know announced their commitment within the first few days of school. Same for JHU and Stanford.
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To be clear, you are referring to Lacrosse recruits here, correct? All the Ivy commits I know(in a different sport) announced in October, November, or December. It depended on the timing of the likely letters or if the recruit chose to wait for the official acceptance in mid December.
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Yes. Girls Lax. Sorry… back to swimming.
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some schools coaches have put very clear tables showing top recruit/recruit/walk-on times. of course, it makes a huge difference in terms of certainty of admission, certainty of representing the team, but in the end, what is the difference between a recruit and a walk-on swimmer ? what are the limitations applied to walk-on swimmers in terms of training, meet participation, and road trips?
These are questions to ask the coaches.
Generally, the fastest swimmers will compete, regardless of how those swimmers joined the team. Often, not all rostered swimmers/those who attend practices have the opportunity to compete and/or travel with the team.
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that makes sense especially for very large teams. is it similar for smaller teams as well, which could travel with the bus half full and leave some qualified swimmers behind because they aren’t going to earn points on the road or at championship?
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also asking the broader question for the group is how do swimmers join as a walk-on, and continue to be motivated enough to train without being able to join any meets at all: is it because they’re going to train, improve and hope to actually race?
NESCAC championship rules state that the travel squad size can only be 24 individuals, and that count includes divers. So yes, there are definitely 5-10 swimmers at the bottom of the roster (slowest) that do not compete at the championships. I am fairly certain that all leagues have a similar rule in place.
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The swim time tables do not give any certainty of admission.
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It’s not just room on the bus. Some schools (even in d3) have flights; plus there’s food and hotel rooms for some away meets/games. Schools have tight budgets for nonrevenue sports – which is one practical reason (independent of conference rules) teams don’t take everyone.
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is it because they’re going to train, improve and hope to actually race?
Yes, that’s why the slowest folks on the roster stick around. They may love to swim. It may be part of their fitness routine. They may see their times improve at time trials for the team, not meets. From time to time, at home meets, they may swim in second and third relays. There may even be an an unofficial heat here or there.
Or they may tire of this and quit. Way back when, I was on a team with a new ambitious (and very good!) coach. Each year, she succeeded in ensuring that the incoming class was better than in one before. So every year, the fastest swimmers – including ones setting school records – became has-beens. We traded middle lanes for outside ones, often in a year. And very few of the swimmers who were in my freshman class were still swimming as seniors.
But that’s also not unusual- in many sports. Maybe you leave for a junior year abroad and realize your life is full without your sport and that you’re not motivated (or able) to get back in racing shape.
There is SO much going on at every campus and only so many hours in a day, and you get a lot of them back if you give up your sport. Some athletes discount this when they are injured. Quitting is not the worst outcome.
Personally, i think being on a team is a great way to start college. Instant community and friends, including older students who can give guidance on many matters. Daily structure. But other students find friends, activities, and mentors too.
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@gardenstategal thanks for the color, are there specific coaches/teams currently known to aggressively pursue improvement such that many team athletes no longer qualify to race by their junior/senior years?
@NiVo I can’t speak to swimming specifically, but that is EVERY coach’s goal, in every sport! They always want to bring in a new class that is better than their current athletes.
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I have not followed this for years, and team dominance comes and goes in almost all sports at all schools. But I think this is what most coaches aspire to – always having a better team. Even the tippy top D1 programs stacked with Olympians presumably always want better swimmers if they’re out there.
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And 18 at NCAAs, correct? But maybe that is getting very ahead of ourselves 
According to DH, back in the day Ivies allowed 18 athletes, with divers counting as 1/2. I looked through the rosters attending this weekend and teams seem to have anywhere between 18 and 24.
@Nivo it doesn’t mean you can’t compete. As you probably know, Ivies were this past weekend. But did you know that several of those schools also had swimmers at ECACs? That’s where the slower swimmers competed. They also swim at home meets and some invitationals. Schools like UVA hold meets agains local slower schools and the “B squad” swims.
A walk-on is not some kind of second class citizen on the team. The are plenty of stories of walk-ons who become major scorers. I know of a lacrosse player turned swimmer after being cut who eventually became captain.
Regardless, the situation is not so different from a club team. Some kids only swim a small local meets, while others get to go to big National Meets. If your swimmer needs to be a big fish it’s probably not for them but plenty of kids are ok with not being on the travel team.
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