<p>Quick question- would it look bad for strength of schedule to take English III Honors rather than AP Comp as a junior? At my son's high school, a mean, old teacher who has been there 32 years teaches the AP Comp, but the English III is taught by an outgoing, super-kind, younger Columbia graduate who is a much better, more rigorous teacher. (older sons had both teachers to compare by) Will it hurt his chances at top schools to take the better teacher? Someone on the Princeton board suggested he take the better teacher and self-study the AP Comp, but I do not think the school lets you self-study a class if they offer it. Does anyone know if you could take the test at another school if they would let you?Thanks, and any input would be appreciated.</p>
<p>You would have to go to the College Board web site in order to learn more of the rules for AP classes. </p>
<p>I would humbly assume that if you and your child do not want to take the AP class because of the teacher, then you could try to politely gain permission from the principal to just go ahead and self study the AP. Unless there is some hard core rule written in stone precluding your child from self study, then I do not see how a principal would mind someone doing it.</p>
<p>Where I am from in the South :)my sweet magnolia blossom:), that method works for a thing or two, but I do not know of New Jersey for beans. </p>
<p>Your child could probably get a really nice rec letter off of the nicer of the two teachers. And, if the nicer of the two teachers is more thorough then that will be of great benefit to your child later on down the line at University.</p>
<p>I think as long as he takes AP Lit the next year it should not be a problem with applying to top colleges. And if he’s taking a good proportion of other AP’s that are offered, as well. At my D’s school a popular and nationally recognized course called “Facing History” was offered and many top students wanted to take it in lieu of AP. This did not hurt those kids in the admissions process.</p>
<p>Also, kids could take any AP test they wanted at D’s school even if the class was offered. Quite a few kids had scheduling conflicts because of long term commitments to band/choir, etc. Many did independent study and self study for languages, foreign literatures, history and economics. Why would the school want to block your son from taking an exam that in the long run benefits the school’s stats?</p>
<p>AP Lang/Comp is the only exam scheduled for the AM session on Wed May 12th, so, as long as your son isn’t taking AP Art History in the PM session, he shouldn’t have any scheduling conflicts and you could probably arrange for him to go to another testing site if that is what it comes down to.</p>
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<p>Exactly. </p>
<p>And that would be the argument, if it came down to that sort of thing.</p>
<p>Thank you both for your advice, and I guess the answer is that the school is not very progressive, and only a small number of kids are serious students. They do not think outside the box, and always try and take the easy road. The head of guidance did let him register for AP Environmental Science last year as a freshman, and he got a 5; you are right, the guidance department was very happy with him!
Thanks again.</p>
<p>My D can’t stand her AP Comp teacher and I totally understand why. I think what he is requing of them and grading them on is wacked out, but the school is behind him 100%. Yesterday I vowed that younger D would never have him, no matter what other class she has to take!</p>
<p>njmom:</p>
<p>Self-studying involves studying outside of school, in the student’s own time, over which the school has not control. It would thus be above and beyond the courseload the student was expected to take in school. The student must register for the AP exam and make sure that the school has the booklet available on the day for him.
If your student is willing to go this route, he definitely should take the course with the better teacher. Nothing kills a student’s enthusiasm for a particular subject faster than a bad teacher.</p>
<p>Thanks, he is familiar with self study, as stated in my previous post, he studied for AP Environmental Science at got a 5. While science is not his favorite, English classes are positively his strongest subjects, as he has a 690 already on the SAT from a few years ago.</p>
<p>Some schools allow “self study” or “independent study” for credit. At our school this was only an option if the class was not offered. But anyone could self-study for an AP test, and just take the test, as long as they signed up and paid for it. If your school district pays for the tests, the rules might be different.</p>
<p>I definitely think go for the better teacher. My daugther looks back on her senior year and wishes she had gone for a more fun English class. She finally told her AP Lit teacher that she could make herself crazy and put in a lot of work for an A or do very little for the B. She ended her senior year with a B and was quite happy.</p>
<p>I’m not completely clear what the question is. He has to take four years of English - every college will expect that. Is the choice regular English with AP Comp or Honors English with nothing? There must be other choices than that. Honors English definitely looks better than regular English and AP Comp is not a course colleges look for. AP Comp is easy to self study for if your mind works that way. My older son learned the material in middle school - my younger son would have hated it. Taking the AP exam, if he wants to, shouldn’t be a problem, getting credit for it, is likely to be difficult. What does the rest of the schedule look like?</p>
<p>Go for the good teacher - don’t even think twice about it.</p>
<p>My DS2 didnt’ like the AP comp teacher, so he took Honors English III instead. He got permission to take the AP comp test the following May. He got a 5. He did lose a small part of a GPA point this way, but he graduated with 4.6 so it probably didn’t matter.</p>
<p>mathmom, I think you read it the same way I did at first. It’s not AP Computer, she’s referring to AP Eng Composition. </p>
<p>I vote for the better teacher also, and try to take the AP exam anyway.</p>
<p>Having 3 kids who have gone through HS with better & worse teachers and my youngest is now a senior in university, my take is:</p>
<p>Find a way to do it your way. Do not waste your/their time in a class with a lousy HS teacher, no matter what ‘critical’ class he/she teaches. My kids have done this on occasion and still look back and view some of those teachers as a waste of time and even worse some one who made their day miserable. Not worth it.
Will your GC still tick the box “toughest courseload” of your DS has other APS?
Can he take the good comp teacher and still take the AP exam self-studying the extras?
What about just taking a college English comp class senior year instead?</p>
<p>Make the choice that will cause him to me more not less invested in his educational experience, that will allow him to find some enjoyment in learning</p>
<p>Thank you all for sound advice, and I cannot wait to show him this thread!</p>
<p>Ah, we call that AP Eng Lang in our school! That makes MUCH more sense. Then my advice is go for the better teacher - no need to make yourself miserable. Both my kids opted out of any AP English courses and took English electives, not even the honors class as seniors. It didn’t stop my older son from getting into Harvard and Carnegie Mellon. I’ll let you know how it plays out with younger son, but he’s loving his English class - it’s on mysteries - they read Edgar Allen Poe earlier this year, they are reading Sherlock Holmes now and they’ve also been watching some classic movies and TV shows. It’s really nice to see him enjoy an English class for the first time ever. </p>
<p>Since he’s a junior, he might be able to just take the AP exam anyway and get the brownie points in the college admissions game.</p>
<p>Go for the better teacher! My daughter is wasting (wasting!) her time in a poorly taught AP Lit class this year. I don’t care what colleges want to see, I hate seeing my daughter wasting her time attending a useless class.</p>
<p>The variation in the quality of AP classes is really bugging me. My son had great AP teachers at a different public school in the same town; my daughter has had one mediocre class after another, but this one takes the cake.</p>
<p>Even if self-study is not possible, a student is better off with a well-taught class. In my opinion.</p>
<p>Another option is an online AP English course, such as Virtual High School or Aventa Learning. Our daughter complained that her US History teacher didn’t teach anything, but just talked about himself the whole time. She met with the principal about this, telling him she “loved” history and “wanted to learn something.” When it turned out that this same teacher would be teaching AP history classes, she got permission to take them online, took the AP tests at school, and was the only one to get 5’s (not the other kids’ fault, just making a point about the teaching).</p>
<p>A bonus: by speaking up, she contributed to future students’ experiences. The poor teacher’s students got 2’s and 3’s, and now that the state is running a standardized history test each year, that teacher has been demoted, so to speak, and only teaches the electives like “around the world in 80 days” and “justice and law.”</p>
<p>Your son, having gotten a 690 on the SAT verbal a few years ago, and having already self-studied for one AP exam is exactly the kind of kid that will be able to self-study for English Comp and get a 5. Furthermore, you will be teaching him to
- take initative
- that he doesn’t have to put up with a bad situation if he can make it better.</p>
<p>DS self-studied for 7 AP exams in high school. He practically ignored the offerings of the math and science departments at his school, took some college courses, customized his education. In the end, I’m pretty sure they checked the “hardest course load” box, even though he didn’t get an IB diploma in an IB school.</p>
<p>Here’s the trick, though, never, never say to them what you said here (that the teacher is bad). The AP English teacher is “fine” as far as you are concerned, just cook up a reason why his schedule won’t allow him to be in that class.</p>