<p>Same problem. Advice me please! I am accepted by Boston College with no money and Santa Clara University with $23400. I am interested in business major. Which one to chose?<br>
Thanks in advance.</p>
<p>It is really a difficult thing to decide.</p>
<p>Firstly, let me say this.
When you look at your fin aid packet, add up all the federal and university loans to your family contribution - YOU WILL BE PAYING IT BACK. (with Interest in most cases!)</p>
<p>Now, secondly,
Going to a public/state school vs an expensive "name brand" (public or private - UCs fall in this category for all non-residents) depends on your major.</p>
<p>For example, if you re going into Law, or Computer Science (upcoming field in the next 4 - 5 years), 80k to 120k in debt should not take more than 5 to 7 years if you are willing to save money for that period.</p>
<p>Eg) $100,000/5yrs = 20,000 $/yr = 1666.67 $/month + interest = 2000$/month</p>
<p>If you did not slack off (i mean reserach, achievements...) in your "name brand school", then you should be able to get a job of about $50,000 per year in a popular field</p>
<p>thats 4166 $/month
which means you will have 2166$/month to live on.</p>
<p>Live in an (small) apartment (don't go buy a house), eat at home, and avoid those expensive "nights on town" and its not that hard...</p>
<p>Well, all that was just my 2c.</p>
<p>Yeah, my major is going to be law. It's still possible to get into law school going to a public, though, isn't it? Or is it that much harder?</p>
<p>I was not a student in HS & went to a State U. I wanted to go to a not-so-good private, but my parents' philosophy was it wasn't worth the $ to go to a "country club." I worked hard in college & went to a good grad school with loans.</p>
<p>My eldest is now at a private & we are very lucky that cost wasn't a consideration. Is the education any better than a public? I don't know. There's lots of research going on & great professors, and name recognition (how I hate US NEWS rankings).The big difference is the networking and commraderie that you don't get at a State U. Now, is that worth all that extra $? Hard to say.</p>
<p>I (now) think my parents were wise, as I didn't apply myself in HS & wasn't going to a good school, so it wasn't worth the $. However, many of the posters are torn between State U & top schools such as Duke, U Chicago. That's different, but then again the costs are so out of control. Tough decisions.</p>
<p>You students struggling with this decision:</p>
<p>As I've posted elsewhere, you fall into the great canyon of indecision if you're not eligible for aid, as my family is not. However you end up financing school, the notion of graduating with $20 or $30K or more of debt is, frankly, a bad thing. (And even those levels is alot of money.) </p>
<p>If you've never had debt, and at your ages I am sure you have not had any material debt, it is hard to convey the stress that comes with paying hundreds or thousands of dollars each month for many years, especially at a time when you should be working hard at your career and in a position to take some risks (i.e. big salary vs. going to work for a new company with stock options, etc.). </p>
<p>Another thing - this is strictly my opinion but, frankly, you will be somewhat of a commodity graduating with millions of your Echo Boomers in 4 years. (You might have gotten a sense of being a commodity when about 15,000 of your peers have applied to the same school you have, with about 3,000 slots available.) Your competitiveness coming out of school will NOT rely primarily upon "lots of individual attention from professors, smaller classes, ivy covered stone walls, etc." and other intangible factors that you may (or may not) find at a private school. YOU will get out of college - public or private - what YOU put into it, much more than what the college puts into you. IMHO it is largely illusory that somehow a private school will impart a glow that will somehow carry you along. It likely will help you with your first job, but your success thereafter will depend largely on traits and aptitudes that you have that college will have little to do with - diligence, dependability, likability, and competence.</p>
<p>The CC threads, taken as a whole, deal to a large extent with this angst surrounding "public vs. private", as if public is some sort of a step down. The California publics are excellent. My son will attend Penn State-UP in the fall and we have been nothing but impressed with the whole process so far. Maryland, Texas, FLorida, Pitt, NC, UVA, OSU,Rutgers - and a hundred others - all fine schools that you can enjoy without putting yourself in a huge financial hole.</p>
<p>I recall a recent TV show on college debt wherein a young graduate of Un. of Scranton wept during her interview that she was graduating with $130K of college debt. Her major was special education - her first salary was less than $40K. I was near tears as she related what a huge mistake she had made by not properly taking the cost of this expensive private college into account. Trust me, you can scarely survive servicing that kind of debt at those salary levels. She should have been a joyful recent graduate, but was miserable with stress at the miscalculation she had made. </p>
<p>In summary, try to be "clear eyed" about this issue. There are wonderful public options out there for the great "middle class" for which college expenses matter greatly. Make your decision, and then be happy and live with it. But do NOT underestimate the impact that sizable college debt will have on your life for many years if you decide to go that route. And, if you wish to attend grad school (as I did), it's nice to have some dry powder (in terms of debt capacity) down the road. </p>
<p>BTW, I am NOT advocating for public colleges. I AM advocating for sanity with respect to making sound financial decisions at a time of delicate decision making. If you are not eligible for aid it does not mandate that you take on ungodlly amounts of debt to attend college. Try to be clear-eyed about your goals. If you're seeking a field that is relatively highly "credentialed" like law, medicine, or research, perhaps the cache of a private college will be meaningful down the road. Otherwise, it is hard to imagine that taking in $80 or $100K will lead you a good place. </p>
<p>Good luck with these difficult decisions.</p>
<p>Yesterday C-Span was broadcasting some sort of senate committee on "paying for college". I was only able to watch for a short time (D and I had just returned from return college visit #3 - heading out for #4 today!), but it seemed like Senator Edward Kennedy was the head of this committee and was speaking to a panel of "experts". One of these experts was the financial lady, I think her name is Suze Orman (or something close). She was saying that if a student takes on $20,000 of debt to attend college and is unable to pay upon graduation, the loan companies are more than willing to "defer" your payments. In time, that $20,000 loan, due to compounding and compounding of interest, will become $60,000 and you WILL have to pay it back!!! She was advocating that loan companies should have to show students exactly what they will owe with interest, if they defer payments, etc. I wish I would have been able to see the whole thing - lots of interesting points were brought up about all facets of paying for college - how much should the general public be responsible (i.e. taxes to support public schools) etc.</p>
<p>hvccgolf, I enjoy reading most of your posts, as they offer some very sound advice. Once again, excellent advice. BTW, my son is also at a public university. </p>
<p>I often think about what it must be like for young graduates who marry, where each has 50,000+ in loans. I really cannot imagine it. Both my H and I had relatively small loans from graduate school (mine was 7500, and his was 15000). We did not have any loans for our undergraduate tuitions. Those graduate school loans weighted us down enough. Large loans can really effect lifestyle. It will put a lot of pressure on a young couple struggling to save money for the down payment on a home, paying rent, and wanting to start a family.</p>
<p>Perspective from a person who already made the decision last year...I was in much of the same position. Choosing a prestigious university with no aid or my state public for free, or also a smaller university with a lot of merit.</p>
<p>I chose the expensive university.</p>
<p>My parents said that they would pay for much of it (take out loans and whatnot), and I would pay $40,000 worth. I assessed not only the quality of education I would be receiving but also the quality of life I would be getting. By attending the more expensive college, I believed that I would be surrounded by peers, to a higher degree, that would challenge me and push me. That I could engage in conversation with. This would make me happy. Happiness, or more happiness than I would have had, was more important to me than going in debt.</p>
<p>I also assessed my own personal financial situation at the time (with the savings/mutual funds/stocks I had) and figured that it would be doable. Further, my parents said that I didn't have to take out loans; I only had to pay them back - which saved me tons of money on interest.</p>
<p>Just showing the other side of the story! Good luck everyone.</p>
<p>descant - excellent comment from that side of the question. I also appreciate that you are already enrolled at the more expensive option and are thus in a position to provide that perspective on a "been there" basis.</p>
<p>As for the question of consorting with peers that "you can talk to", I've been reminded by several buddies with kids in college that it does not terribly matter if there are tens of thousands of kids at a large public university, as a kid's circle of friends is likely to be numbered in the dozens regardless of the size of the school. And they tend to congregate with kids like them that share their interests.</p>
<p>Excellent point, hvccgolf. My post also referred to the people in the classroom and outside of it. Learning occurs when your peers volunteer in discussion for seminar, or over the lunch table, or when you go talk to a professor for office hours, and you are able to listen.</p>
<p>However, I also appreciate the different kind of learning that is sure to take place in these situations of the student should choose to attend the larger university. Learning that much of education is what makes of it. Of challenging oneself in different social realms; making new friends that you normally wouldn't have made in the smaller school. Of accepting where you are now, living in the moment, and striving to do the best with the situation you are in. Also extraordinarily valuable life skills.</p>
<p>Midwest parent - I may be out of my field of expertise, but college loans used to have a fairly high default rate (I'm talking 20-25 years ago) and it was comment for kids to default on those loans. COllection efforts were poor and the loans often were written off by lenders and forgotten. There were sensational stories of doctors, subsequently highly paid, welching on their med school loans, for example. Sometimes bankruptcy was used to avoid repayment.</p>
<p>The law changed in 1998 and the ability to have student loans tossed out in a bankrupcty was materally reduced. In short, the stakes were raised with respect to taking on these loans and then being unable to service them. (If anyone wants mroe info google "student loans in bankruptcy" - there's alot of into out there on it. </p>
<p>My post is not intended to scare, but to educate. The average high school senior has not understanding of these very heavy issues.</p>
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</p>
<p>If "UC" = the University of California, I do not believe that the "very little prestige" evaluation is correct. I've always found that my degrees from the UC were to my advantage. It was, of course, a geologic age ago, but I wouldn't describe my education as impersonal, and I definitely didn't expect any trouble getting into grad school. But perhaps you meant some other UC...</p>
<p>Post to all interested -- there is an article in today's Wall Street Journal (personal section) about kickbacks to colleges for taking compensation and other perks (i.e. kickbacks) from student loan providers. The NY attorney general is investigating over 100 schools and siz lenders for "widespread conflict of interest". </p>
<p>"Earler this week eight universities including Univ of Penn, Syracuse and NYU settled allegations of kickbacks by agreeing to stop accepting payments, travel and other perks from student lenders." </p>
<p>Please, please be an educated consumer of these products/services. Ask the hard questions and shop around.</p>
<p>It should be noted that at Columbia, USC and Univ. of Texas, their financial aid officers had preferred stock in several lending companies and are now being investigated. The whole story is on CNN.</p>
<p>What if I hate my public school option?</p>
<p>I applied to my state's most prestigious public school, and it is a top-quality, very well-known and respected university. I applied because I assumed that it would be foolish not to. I was accepted, and now my parents will basically not pay for another school.</p>
<p>I visited and did not like it. I hate the idea of large lectures taught by TAs, I hate its cramped housing, and furthermore I hate the idea that I will know many people - I wanted a chance to reinvent myself. I wanted a smaller campus with a smaller student body, where the focus was mainly on undergraduate education and where I would be able to receive more specialized attention from my professors.</p>
<p>I've been accepted to most of my top choices (of course, not my first - waitlisted), but they are all either small LACs or mid-sized universities. They are all in the 45k/year range. I feel that I would be much happier at one of those schools than at my state school - when I visited, I loved the campuses and the students, and felt like I fit in very well.</p>
<p>My family does not qualify for any financial aid, so we didn't file FAFSA. So I would be graduating with a SUBSTANTIAL debt after undergrad, plus fees for grad school. How can I make the decision between public and private if I fear that I may be very unhappy going the cheap route?</p>
<p>I remember seeing past threads on this topic. Can anyone provide links to some of the good ones?</p>
<p>sharpie - tough choice. It's really between you and your parents.</p>
<p>You may (underline "may") harbor some resistance to the public option for perceptions which may not be completely accurate. I attended a "prestigious" private university years ago and sat through my share of large lectures and TAs who barely spoke English. I can;t believe it's changed much. You're gonna get those wherever you go, especially in the first two years when all the mandatory courses get filled up with hundreds of kids. You may find yourself at the private school freshman year in a lecture hall with 300 other freshmen and feel that you were misled about this whole private school "high touch" thing. </p>
<p>I recommend spending a day or two at the public university, attend some classes, really get to know the place a bit better and see how you feel. Talk to lots of frosh about their larger classes and if it;s a problem. </p>
<p>I sense you have a real prejudicace against it and I understand that you have real issues, but cost IS an important underlying factor in the whole discussion. If you go public, and it works for you, you'll forget about large classes long before the massive debt you took on to go private is retired.</p>
<p>
[quote]
If "UC" = the University of California, I do not believe that the "very little prestige" evaluation is correct. I've always found that my degrees from the UC were to my advantage. It was, of course, a geologic age ago, but I wouldn't describe my education as impersonal, and I definitely didn't expect any trouble getting into grad school. But perhaps you meant some other UC...
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Oh, who's ever heard of those silly little UCs? Berkeley? UCLA? Pfft... :p</p>
<p>well, it's too late now, sharpie, but anyone starting the search needs a financial safety that they'd be happy attending. so the visit needs to come before and not after. plus we had our D who was desperate to blow town and leave the state apply only to privates where there was a pretty good chance she's get either good finaid or a scholarship. that meant she didn't apply to a private school who said up front they do not give merit aid, period.</p>
<p>next, file the fafsa even if you think you don't qualify for need based aid. sometimes a school with scholarships will give you one if they know you're not getting any finaid and they really want you. also, some schools use what is called "institutional method" for calculating finaid. that means they use their own formula for determining what you get......ie, they can give you whatever they want. if you don't ask, you don't get. "ask and ye shall receive" - happens more often than you think.</p>
<p>but it's too late for you........maybe! of the schools you like, pick the cheapest one and call them and see if you can cut a deal. beg. seriously. find out if there are on campus jobs for kids with no finaid. can you get an RA job your second year and have it pay the room and board and maybe a stipend? promise to work every summer and break to earn extra money. write it all out like a business plan, maybe do a power point and then "present" it to the parents like they were a bank you needed a loan from to start your own shop. make a respectful, well researched pitch.</p>
<p>do everything you can to reduce the cost to your parents. </p>
<p>and then beg.</p>
<p>and then see how you can love the state u in spite of itself.</p>