<p>Does anyone know if there is an activity that will give a candidate an "edge." (Besides Gold Award/Eagle Scout, Boys State/Girls State)I heard that the Naval Academy likes it if you are Scuba certified. Is there anything like this that west point likes to see. Other than the "well rounded candidate." Something that really sticks out to Admissions?</p>
<p>Also, do they look very favorably on CAP, I was considering joining, it looks like fun.</p>
<p>If it's something that you'll enjoy doing, then go ahead and join. WP will not be looking for future cadets who sign up for programs/clubs because they think it will benefit their application. Have passion for what you're doing and be able to explain why it's important in your life.</p>
<p>From usma.edu </p>
<p>You should participate in extracurricular activities that provide valuable leadership experiences and responsibilities. This will help you prepare for the leadership development training you will receive at West Point. The following high school experiences will develop and demonstrate your leadership potential:</p>
<p>Class, club, or student government position.
Awards in academic societies, such as the National Honor Society.
Participation and achievement in athletics.
Participation and success in public speaking and other nonathletic activities.
Participation and achievement in Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts, Civil Air Patrol, or Reserve Officer Training Corps.
Membership in community or church organizations.
The United States Military Academy considers it more valuable for you to achieve distinction in a specific activity, rather than participation in a number of activities without any evidence of leadership achievement. If you have to work to provide financial assistance for your family, West Point views that working experience as a demonstration of your leadership potential even though it will limit participation in school activities.</p>
<p>It is too late for eagle, but if you like high adventure, you can join a venture crew. You might even get a late in life OA tap. What I've seen of the appointed kids is consistency and well-roundedness. Grades are not perfect, but they are consistently good. SAT may not be primo, but 1250+. Not just team members, but leaders. Are you good at a sport? Good enough for varsity? Contact the coach. I think (have been told) that my son would have been competitive without the fact that he's good enough for varsity at WP, but it sure sped up the process when the coach expressed an interest. Find something you are passionate about and stick with it, and also don't be afraid to try new things. Good luck to you! HUAH! (been watching too many hours of WP videos!)</p>
<p>mom3boys,</p>
<p>What's a venture crew? And an OA tap?</p>
<p>(3 years ago I was reluctant to ask what LOA or MOC meant. It took a few weeks to figure it out myself. I will never again fear an acronym.)</p>
<p>Venture Crew is part of the BSA (Boy Scouts of America) and is a coed program for youths between the ages of 14 and 20 years old. OA is Order of the Arrow and is an Honor Organization within the BSA for Scouts and Scouters. She was referring to a "Tap Out" which is the initial ceremony to be selected to join OA. One is elected to OA by members of his Troop, thus it is an honor and shows leadership.</p>
<p>Another option for older boys who know they will not have time to make Eagle would be to volunteer as the den chief for a cub scout den.</p>
<p>As was already mentioned, you need to participate in activities and such that you truly are interested in. You shouldn't be joining sports, clubs, etc... to fill a "Square" to get into one of the academies. If you join team sports just to cover a square, then you may get an appointment but you probably won't like being at the academy. The academies want people who participate in team sports, leadership in clubs, challenging classes, boys/girls state, etc... because those are the "Type of people" that they want in the academy.</p>
<p>Realize that going to any of the academies and getting an education is NOT the objective of the Army/Air Force/Navy/Coast Guard. Their objective is to train leaders of men/woman to be in the military and ultimately protect and defend the constitution of the United States. They're looking for a certain type of team player, leader, follower, etc... It requires a certain type of person. If you aren't into team sports or certain leadership type roles, then you really need to think hard about going to the academy. </p>
<p>There are way too many people who see the academy as a way to get a college education. Their attitude is that they get a semi-free education, and in return they serve the military for 5 years. The attitude SHOULD be just the opposite. You want to be a military officer. Possibly serve as a career. Wanting to protect and defend the constitution and the citizens of our country. AND IN RETURN, the government will pay for your college education. It's all a matter of the glass being half full or half empty. In this case, viewing it one way is definitely wrong.</p>
<p>This is not to say which category you are in. Only you know that. But the advice given about doing the clubs, classes, leadership positions, that you have a desire for is what is important. Which ones you do are not important. My son didn't have a long list of activities. He's played 4 years of varsity letter sports in 2 sports. He was selected for boy's state. National Honor Society. IB program/classes. Volunteer time. Held some class officer positions. That's about it. He received his appointment a couple of months ago. He never did boy scouts, CAP, JROTC, or anything like that. Not what he's into. Not enough time to do everything. </p>
<p>I am friends with some ALO's and they aren't stupid. They know that if you are involved in "A LOT" of different activities, then it's possible that you may not be excelling in any of them. If you have excellent grades in "Challenging Classes", play varsity sports, have held some leadership positions in some activities or sports, and have community service/volunteer/civic involvement, then that is what they want to see. Too much of any or all areas doesn't look any better to them. In some cases it could even bring up questions and doubts by the ALO during their review and interview process. Just be passionate at what you do and do it the best you can. That's all you need to worry about. Good luck.</p>
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<p>This theme raises the hackles on the back of my neck every single time I read it. To what do you base this observation? You are on a USMA forum. I think all WP cadets right now are very much aware of the commitment they face upon graduation. For USNA, I can assure you it is not true. BGOs are tasked with subtely ferreting out your very supposition. I can assure you that it is not a problem. Early on in the decision stage, it might be. However, once a serious candidate has done the homework necessary to make a decision, the commitment is very evident. Those looking for a free education look elsewhere. The few who fall between the cracks usually resign. By the end of their second year, I can assure you that no USNA mids are still there solely for the free education. When listing the top 10 reasons they are there, very few would place it in the top 10.</p>
<p>I agree that the majority of applicants/candidates understand what they are getting into; and accept that committment eagerly. I never said differently. But there are still plenty of others who either don't know what they are getting into or are accepting the committment in exchange for the education. This is evident by those who go to summer training and quit prior to becoming a cadet and attending school. This is obviously figured into the numbers by the different academies. This is also obvious when 1300+/- start, yet only approximately 900+/- actually graduate. Also, if you look at the numbers, of the 1300+/- who enter, about 5% will drop out during the first 6 weeks of training. (This doesn't include the medical turnbacks). That's what I base my opinions on. Then there's some that are pretty obvious; such as the navy cadet this past year who should have graduated, but decided not to accept his commission in hopes of being able to buy his way out and possibly play football instead.</p>
<p>In</a> From the Cold: Taking a Pass</p>
<p>Now, I haven't followed the results, but his initial decision isn't unique. As I've said, the majority of candidates/cadets have no problem accepting the challenge and the committment. I would say that most of them even do it for the right reason and not as a payback for their college. (I've never looked at stats showing how many graduates ONLY do the mandatory 5 years and get out). My only point here is that it's better than candidates know what they are truly getting into. (Knowledge never hurts anyone). That they really want this way of life and not just a means of getting an education. That those dropping out in the first 6 weeks is reduced because they aren't surprised at what they got into. And as posted by so many others, that the candidates are taking on the sports, ec's, classes, etc... because that's the type of people they are and that they would passionately do those activities anyway whether they were applying to an academy or not. This makes for better and more successful candidates and eventual officers.</p>
<p>I only have a minute and will be back later but I challenge you that "not knowing what they are getting into" and "attending only for a free education" are more exclusive than inclusive terms.</p>
<p>Please don't use words like exclusive and inclusive as if you are trying to make a specific point or to dazzle/baffle. We are talking symantics. I have already said numerous times since the beginning of time that the MAJORITY know what they are getting into. That the MAJORITY accept the challenge and committment eagerly. And that the MAJORITY are very sincere with their motives and committment to the service of their country. I've just pointed out that there are "SOME" that either don't know what they are getting into, or see it strictly for the educational benefit and don't really consider or understand the committment they have entered into. (Yes, even the Navy). This is not opinion; this is fact. All service academies go through this with a certain number of cadets each summer and through the 4 years of school. </p>
<p>We don't need to argue this point because it's not important. If you want to argue that it doesn't need to be brought up in forums like this because it is a minority of cadets, then I can respect that. I have seen however a number of applicants go to summer seminar and when they get back realize and say; "this isn't for me". I wish every applicant could go to summer seminar. Unfortunately, the vast majority of applicants don't get to go. Some of these will enter training and be disappointed with their expectations. (Yes, they are the vast minority). If applicants can know this ahead of time, then they can make more informed decisions. The more knowledge one has, the better prepared they are.</p>
<p>Wow, this thread got off topic quickly. I only asked the question to see if there was something specific that admissions was looking for. Something on the same level as Eagle Scout, Boys/Girls state. Though I cannot speak for my fellow candidates, I can assure you that I am sincere in my motives to serve my country. I love this country very much and I am willing to make any commitment or sacrifice to help the nation. I am confident that most of my fellow candidates feel the same way. I am doing the best that I can to become a competive candidate for admissions to usma. I was just trying to get feedback. I am and will be devoted and sincere in my efforts at any and all activities that I do. Both of you are right, MOST PEOPLE ARE NOT LOOKING FOR A FREE EDUCATION.However, there are exceptions to every rule. If anyone has any further comments on the original post, they would be greatly appreciated! Good luck on everyone's applications, nominations ect!</p>
<p>friar. I believe you are sincere. I'm not questioning that. Remember however that MANY PEOPLE read these posts. Many lurk and never ask questions themselves. Sometimes it's important to elaborate. In this case, there were 2 very important responses that you received from numerous people. </p>
<p>1st; there is no magic list of specific activities. The academies look for A)challenging classes with good grades. B) sports; preferably varsity level and team oriented. C)other extra curricular activities that demonstrate leadership, community service, etc...</p>
<p>Contrary to some beliefs, no particular activity is seen more important by the academies. Boy Scouts, CAP, JROTC is no more important than say NHS, Boy's state, etc... They are looking at the "WHOLE" person concept.</p>
<p>2nd: WHATEVER activity, sport, classes, etc... that you take or participate in; make it something you like and have passion for. Don't do it or take it to fill a block for the academy if that's not what you really like doing.</p>
<p>This advice was given by a number of people. It is very good advice. It is true however that if you aren't taking challenging classes; aren't getting high grades in them; aren't involved in team sports; don't have leadership experience; are civic minded; and so on; then you would have an extremely difficult time getting into the academies. WHICH activities is NOT important.</p>
<p>Again; accept my apologies if you believe I was insinuating that you weren't 100% committed to attending one of the academies. Again; these comments, posts, threads, are read by many people. It isn't a private conversation between you and the posters. It's very important that someone else reading it doesn't grab a pen and paper and start writing down what they believe to be some "List" of activities and classes they need to take to get into the academy. It doesn't work that way.</p>
<p>Friartown, by looking at the recent class profile you can get a feel for activities that USMA values. USMA</a> Admissions: More Info: Class Profile: 2008</p>
<p>You have been given good advice. Find an activity that you enjoy and will allow you to demonstrate leadership. Good luck.</p>
<p>Thanks Ann! I am the editor of my yearbook. Does anyone know if that will give me the same amount of "Leadership POints" as something like eagle scout? Also, when they say scouting participants, does that include something like CAP? Thank you, everyone, for you're advice.</p>
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<p>Well, at least you have discontinued countering your ‘vast majority’ with ‘way too many’ and ‘plenty of others’, to ‘SOME’ , we are making headway. However, with the ‘exclusive’ and ‘inclusive’, yes, I am attempting to make a specific point. Are specific points verboten in this forum. Sometimes I think so, but I hope not. Somehow you are attempting to tie the 5% or so who don’t make it through plebe summer and the 15%-25% who don’t make it to graduation as an indicator of those desiring a free education. While you recognize those who don’t know what they are getting into, you either seem to ignore their significance in the attrition numbers or somehow try to imply, in my opinion, that they are one in the same.</p>
<p>First off, I ask you, how can a USMA candidate today, seeing all the casualty figures from Iraq, and being an informed candidate, not realize that USMA is in no way, shape, or form, a ‘free education.’ To state otherwise gives these candidates no credit at all for their intelligence. I would go so far as to say that, as friartown points out, you are insulting them. </p>
<p>Now, “those who don’t know what they are getting into”. This is entirely another matter. Probably, if the statement were made at quarters on the morning prior to the plebes joining the brigade/corps for the first time; “Would all of those whose plebe summer experience was not what they expected, take one step forward”, it would be tantamount to; “Corps, one step forward march.” The experience, by definition, since it is different for each and every cadet, means they do not know what they are getting into. How well they cope is the definition of success. Free education has very little to do with it. Yes, in my opinion, as one who has been there. the terms are more exclusive than inclusive.</p>
<p>Christmas break at our house was spent learning a great deal about USMA: we watched "Surviving West Point" and read "Absolutely American." (I know these should be underlined or italicized, but can't make that happen on the forum post...so no need to write: sic). There are many, many reasons for high attrition, not simply dropping out because it's not what a cadet expected. There will always be those who enter new situations with rose-colored glasses; however, I think most of our future cadets are doing their best to be as informed as possible. I have thoroughly enjoyed watching the process in my own son. He is approaching his decision in a well-thought out manner. He has had several variables he wanted to investigate, and as each one is determined, he is closing the gap on his decision. I would wager that most of these students have enough on the ball to get appointments will be equally sharp at determining what to expect and will enter the SA's with eyes wide open.</p>
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<p>So what I think I am hearing you saying is that those who don't make it through plebe summer and those who don't graduate, except for those few who flunk out, since they knew what they were getting into, are probably resigning due to beind disillusioned about the excessive demands being placed on their idea of a free education?</p>
<p>Having been there and also listened to the comments of others over the past 40 years, I can assure you that it will not be what they expect. However, those prepared for anything and everything will, with the right attitude, survive.</p>