The Parent Gap by Income Level (Inside Higher Ed)

Parents Forum
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<p>"But have people really changed–not that much I think. We had EXACTLY the same problems with poverty and educational achievement then as now. Going to the moon solved nothing in that regard.</p>

<p>so if " people" haven’t changed
why is it that marriage rights for all- are law in many countries.
Where are African Americans segregated to the “back of the bus” or have to use separate facilities?</p>

<p>Did these things happen by themselves or did " people" make them happen?</p>

<p>You might come down from your planned community once in a while and go across the bridge and see that the high school that parents are taking their kids out of private school for and is not only public, but in the " inner city". </p>

<p>How has moving to the front of the bus done anything for the problems that are still endemic to poor communites-actually among Blacks family stability is far worse than it was in the segregation days when many black families were still nuclear with a mother and father. And granting gay rights does next to nothing for the poor. If I’m wrong on that please show me.<br>
The Seattle schools are STILL dealing with an AA achievement gap that is about as bad as it was in the 50’s. Your post was irrelevant noise. The main reason anyone is taking kids out of the private schools is the recession. Seattle schools overall are still losing students. Things may be increasing in some gentrifying inner city areas but the overall trends are not good.</p>

<p>Before moving to my new home I lived for 14 years in the central seattle area–mostly at 19th and Jefferson. I saw gunfire in the street, hookers and drug deals on a regular basis. After getting robbed twice it was time to go. I would not allow my new wife to live in such an unsafe area given that I travel on business often. Thank you.</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.seattlepi.com/local/176577_garfield07.html[/url]”>http://www.seattlepi.com/local/176577_garfield07.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>[Seattle</a> Public Schools<em>|</em>](<a href=“http://www.seattleschools.org/area/main/Public_Affairs/06_Consolidation.xml]Seattle”>http://www.seattleschools.org/area/main/Public_Affairs/06_Consolidation.xml)</p>

<p><a href=“http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=20031227&slug=maps27m[/url]”>http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=20031227&slug=maps27m&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

62

<p>OK–we’ve established that a “nearly poor but clean and working” Puerto Rican kid who attended a 99% white school system made it without do-gooder assistance.</p>

<p>We’ve established that many Hispanic kids are disadvantaged by a cultural bias against education and especially higher education.</p>

<p>While some have said that asking for solutions takes the focus off the need for self-help, I still have a problem with essentially writing off the children of parents below the poverty line (including the white and black kids in the 30+ million below that line) if for no other reason than the social cost set out in post #44.</p>

<p>Has anyone experienced anything (other than “cherry picking” such kids by college prepatory private schools) that works to change any of this? </p>

<p>BTW–my S’s private “cherry picking” school has found it very challanging to find Hispanic kids who would attend even on full scholarship. But, it has not given up trying to do so. </p>

<p>And, the poster who said that by changing one student’s life, it can change the lives of others is correct. Tommy Lee Jones (the actor) went to my S’s private school on scholarship because his oil field worker dad couldn’t afford it. Then to Harvard to room with Gore and to graduate with honors.</p>

<p>He has been a leader in the fund raising efforts of that private school especially for the scholarship fund. He has uniformly mentioned in interviews that the education he received at the private school was what assisted him in achieving everything he has accomplished thereafter.</p>

63

<p>Yes, it MUST have been those white kids. The ones that I beat on all the standardized tests before I was old enough to even know about the racial differences.</p>

64

<p>Healthy families often have similar goals for their children.
Learn to be responsible , contributing member of society, earn enough to cover health and housing expenses, find a way to make a living that they enjoy, have friends and family as support.</p>

<p>Depending on parents background, their vision of how their child will acheive those goals varies.</p>

<p>While my own parents went to college, my husbands parents did not, indeed they were horrified that we were contemplating preparing our daughters to do so.</p>

<p>There was an implication that the way they had raised their kids was not " good enough", that our children were " smarter" than their own, not to mention the years out of the work force that a college education would require.</p>

<p>While my parents attended university, neither I nor my brother or sister went to college after high school.
( my brother eventually did, while he was in the service, it took him quite a few years, but he earned his engineering degree).
We did not discuss at home schoolwork, we didn’t discuss what to do after high school, our parents were not involved in the schools and the schools did not have special programs to help students find their path.</p>

<p>The parks dept however did have a few programs for low income families. While my father was alive and working, we wouldn’t have qualified, but when he died when I turned 17, I was then eligible for a youth work program that was designed to provide teens with job training and mentors.</p>

<p>Although I greatly miss my father
( and if I had to pick one parent to lose, it would not have been him), I still realized that I had more opportunities when I qualified for low income support, than when I did not.</p>

<p>The work program was a huge help. I met with an intake person, who told me of the positions available and helped me choose which one to apply for.</p>

<p>I really only applied for one position, that of a “secretary” to the on site caretaker of a large county park. I worked there all summer, doing the payroll and since that didn’t take 40 hrs a week, also got to know the life guards and the history of the park.</p>

<p>It wasn’t the same as college prep classes & it didn’t get my mother involved in my studies or life ( I no longer lived at home), but I got to know people who had higher expectations than I had and it changed the direction of my thinking.</p>

<p>When I found out that Social Security, would pay towards attending community college, I took my GED exam and began classes.</p>

<p>( unfortunately, I did not know I qualified for any additional money like loans or grants, and I stopped going to college because of transportation difficulties getting to school and work- you think getting around Bellevue on Metro is a PITA now, in the 70’s, it was much faster if not safer to hitchhike)</p>

<p>My point is that experience laid the groundwork for me to become more involved with my own children’s education.</p>

<p>When my oldest was born just a few years later, I recognized that I needed more of a support system in place & with encouragement from UW profs where she was enrolled in a special study, I took the huge mental leap to enroll her in private school.</p>

<p>Much like Tommy Lee Jones experience, we found a support system in the private school that was greater than anything we could cobble together on our own.</p>

<p>Not only was my daughter challenged with more appropriate classes than were available in the public schools at that time( we had been told that there was no place for twice gifted children), but the private school parents were * my* mentors, exposing me to things I had never thought about and giving me lots of encouragement.</p>

<p>I agree that many of the public schools in Seattle still suck.
Programs that actually help kids have been cut, instead the money has been diverted to " teacher training" or flashy technology that no one knows how to use.( it doesn’t help that the high paid administrators in SPS have high turnover as well)</p>

<p>Minorities ( and others) moving to this area with education in mind are more likely to move to the suburbs &/or place their kids in private schools.</p>

<p>But there are success stories and they have a ripple effect.
Effort to get parents involved only helps so much, they often have other concerns- don’t have time or interest or ability to change their mind set.</p>

<p>But if we can broaden the students perspective, we can get them thinking about all the opportunities that are there and teach them how to evaluate choices so that their decisions open doors instead of close them- then we can change lives.</p>

<p>Along with the [College Access Now](<a href=“http://www.collegeaccessnow.org/”>http://www.collegeaccessnow.org/&lt;/a&gt; ) program</p>

<p>There are things that are working.</p>

<p>[Techie</a> students fill world of need overseas](<a href=“http://www.seattlepi.com/local/265258_garfield03.html]Techie”>http://www.seattlepi.com/local/265258_garfield03.html)</p>

<p>Students are learning that what they do * does make a difference*.</p>

<p>That is huge.
:)</p>

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<p>epiphany: In our case, all of the charter schools I’m thinking of are “grass roots” in that they were proposed and shepherded through the approval process by groups of parents within the community, for the most part. The problem is that the process to charter them involves being chartered by the district, or if the district does not approve the charter, by the county, or if the county does not approve the charter, by the state. In this case, the school district board is very anti-charter and has repeatedly filed lawsuits in state court to block charter schools or to attempt to circumvent state law about them. Because of that, this particular new charter ended up being approved at the state level. </p>

<p>But that said, I think there is a wide range of success of charters in our state; I’ve witnessed it myself. There were two particular charter high schools started in our immediate area in 2003; my son chose to attend one of them. It started out with great ideas, but was poorly managed and eventually became so bad that it was jeopardizing his college prospects. He ended up transferring to the other charter for his senior year; that’s the one my daughter attends. The year my son graduated, the crappy charter graduated 20 of the original 75 students, and then closed. What we learned is that it’s not enough to have a great idea or great curriculum or a great space; every person involved in the charter also has to be on board and great, too. </p>

<p>One of the things that’s happened is that this year, almost 25 percent of the district’s incoming freshmen applied for one of 200 spaces at my daughter’s school and its sister. There’s increasing talk among everyone in the community that when that many people are seeking an alternative, the district needs to think more about how it’s serving the needs of those within the district.</p>

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<p>I am a parent of kids who are definitely getting a short end of a stick because of top elite colleges’ consideration for URM and other disadvantaged kids in their admission practice. Yet, I enthusiastically support these policies, and I do it for my kids on a long term basis.</p>

<p>A society that does not actively promote social mobility on a constant basis is a society that can morph into one that was ripe for French Revolution. I wouldn’t want my kids to live in a society where they will have to lock themselves up in a gated community for security and refrain from walking on the street after sundown. </p>

<p>Since my kids are the product of privilege and will likely to occupy its upper echelon , it’s imperative that they and we ensure that the society that so favored them remain its current system by providing adequate outlet and avenues for success for the disadvantaged segment for the population so that it does not become “I have nothing to lose and therefore let’s see what happens when I turn it upside down” situation. </p>

<p>A historical parallel is the Western Europe and North American labor movement. By giving an “inch” and providing an outlet for their self assertion, these societies prevented “workers’ revolt” a la Russian style - in short, it stole the thunder from the extreme element. As a society, we can’t afford a permanent underclass. We MUST break the cycle.</p>

<p>In this vein, regardless whether it’s the parents and home environment or the outside world that fail the kids, it’s important that we do our best to help and support these kids. Simply absolving ourselves of any further responsibility by putting all the blame on the family is irresponsible.</p>

<p>Those from that background who achieved despite all the adversity and then come out and say “see, I did it. why not the others!” in an attempt to dismiss the needs for collective action on the part of the general society are at best inconsiderate and at worst irresponsible - irresponsible in that they are now used as poster girls and boys to justify callous practices and reactionary policies of people with different political agenda. </p>

<p>To these people, I say “yes, you made it, and I congratulate you, but there are others who need a bit of additional support and assistance: it’s fine if you don’t want to personally lend a helping hand, but don’t make it more difficult for them to get help by justifying policies of others with dubious motives”</p>

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<p>TrinSF: Thanks for the background. I’m quite aware of the process, having been in on early stages, including WASC accreditations, and I know the various stages involved in chartering. The charter movement has grown by gargantuan leaps in response to families serious about education not being served by their local site schools. Within a few years, more than half of the schools in my state will be chartered. The demand is outpacing the ability of the State administrative offices to sift requests. The result is both good and bad: fewer rejections (which works for the well structured ones), but less oversight & previous review for those not so well-thought-out.</p>

<p>hyeonjlee: I wish you’d post such sentiments in the Admissions Forum in response to the whiny students who feel entitled to dismiss all efforts of (especially Ivies) to look for talent in URM populations.</p>