The Rowing Class of 2017 Recruiting Thread

Athletic Recruits
41

A lot of insightfull info on this thread - thx, all.

Question: anyone seen the process go into senior spring w/ D3 Nescac, Ivies, etc., say, when rosters weren’t filled out? I realize it’s late but appreciate perspective. Could a stunning on-campus erg or Crash B pull still garner coach interest + admissions bump for Regular D?

Our LW distinguished himself quickly (one year in) after switching from another sport. He’s in the 6.40-.45 zone now on a winning team and was lucky to gain solid national and England-based regatta experience. He had some OVs this fall w/ targeted D3s, a couple offers with pressure, positive pre-reads and a hard-to-swallow negative one. Test scores are the chief impediment for the more elite schools - not trainwreck but when other athletes all seem 2000+ these days…He ended up turning away from some nice opportunities, which he may live to regret, but the smaller program fit just didn’t feel right to him upon visiting so we have to respect that. Unfortunately, he was just deferred from his 1st-choice reach (no rowing/coach support available there-long story) so is still in the game.

The kid wants to row next year with an established program - a sibling rowed Ivy so he appreciates the commitment and he’s got the grit, if not the stellar test scores. Suggestions at this juncture? Happy to discuss via PM, too. Thx.

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@Valdog
I haven’t heard of any cases of this with ltwt (perhaps because it is a smaller market) but I know of a teammate of my son last year who put up a great time at indoors in January and then received multiple tag offers at HW programs. Two of these programs had underestimated their roster and had “free spots” so they were anxious to get competitive recruits signed on. Unfortunately for my son’s teammate the FA part of the equation was too late so he couldn’t accept some of the offers…just too $$$$ :frowning:
He ended up at a Pac12 school which has a fairly competitive program but I think he wishes he had hit that magical 2k zone in the fall and not late winter…

43

Again, thanks to those of you who have provided insight! I’ve been lurking around CC looking for a thread like this to clear up some of my questions (a 6:35 2k being outdated, for example, is very helpful).

I’m a junior in high school, and a novice rower (been rowing 4 months). I’ve decided I would like to row in college, perhaps even get recruited, if at all possible. I moved to California from the UK about 5 months ago, though, so I’m not sure how the process works around here. Need I register on the NCAA website? When should I be filling out the questionnaires for certain colleges, looking for emails for coaches, etc. given my situation? I’m a little lost, help would be greatly appreciated!

44

If you are still in your junior year, it’s too early to register with the NCAA - as I understand it, that’s done on July 1 between junior and senior year. But now is a good time to start contacting coaches at schools you’re interested in.

Direct messages are best, to the head coach or freshman coach (in charge of recruiting), or both. Some coaches also respond to filling out their questionnaires - but this seems hit and miss.

Bear in mind - at this point, most programs are very deliberately casting a wide net, identifying a large slate of potential candidates so that they are in touch with rowers who will be the leading recruits in fall of senior year. Some coaches may take a more personalized approach, at least with some kids; what’s hard to gauge is whether that is their style generally, or if they are really focusing on a smaller number of recruits.

However there does seem to be a good rule of thumb, as another parent put it in an earlier thread: “request for transcript = interest”.

As for times, the coaches usually tell you up front, or pretty soon afterwards, what they are looking for - mostly in terms of 2k times, but some also ask for 1’ times, or 6k times. Part of what can be confusing is that sometimes people are referring to the times that kids should be posting right now, as juniors, while other times coaches are referring to times they are looking for from the incoming freshmen. And as @CardioParty notes, objective stats are only part of the recruiting picture; subjective factors are also a key part of the process.

Finally, as @Valdog’s message reminds us, while many kids are focused on the Ivies, there are lots of great schools with good rowing programs outside of the Ivy league. Some kids are going to learn much better at a liberal arts college than a big research university, so those types of schools are the right choice for those kids.

Good luck, and stay in touch!

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Men do NOT need to register with the NCAA as men’s rowing is not an official NCAA sport.

46

@Shotwell
Welcome!
You say you are in Ca. Have you already found your crew? Club? HS team?
Indoors are upon us and, as I’ve mentioned previously, a good showing there will put you on the radar for D1 programs.
I’d also start by doing some research looking into schools. What are you looking for in an education…small/large campus, specific field of study, rural/urban etc.
Then look to see which schools have rowing…
Cast your net wide and see what resonates. You have time to look around.
If you find schools/programs that interest you, fill out the on-line recruiting questionnaire and perhaps introduce yourself via email to the coach.
Even though men’s rowing is not a NCAA sport as classicalmama points out, it does have to abide by the rules of the NCAA. A coach cannot contact you, unless you have contacted them first, before July 1st following your junior year.
Good luck!

47

So ED/SCEA decisions are out . . . no one disappointed, I hope. And the coaches turn to the next year. At least one Ivy has announced a junior day for this winter. Another has an open house on the day before CRASH-Bs (no surprise, given their location). A third has said they don’t have a junior day. Sounds like a great idea, if you don’t live too far away.

Also, for all the talk about 2k times, be aware that’s not the only metric the coaches look for. We’ve now heard two heavyweight coaches mention that they are looking for a 6k time of 20:30 or better. Interesting.

Finally, another very interesting discussion over on the rowing community in Reddit, questioning the necessity of doing large amounts of steady state and training in high school. The conversation was started by Nate Goodman, who is the stroke of Yale 1V8 (and yes, he’s disclosed his identity on Reddit; I’m not outing him). Look for “mtcgoodman”. So good to see his comments about the importance of having a training regimen that the athletes enjoy, instead of something that burns them out!

48

For those who are curious about how walk-ons are treated at top rowing programs, here is an interesting recent piece in one of the Harvard student papers about walk-ons and their lightweight team:
http://www.harvardindependent.com/2015/10/walking-onto-crew/

The piece made me look at the Harvard mens’ lightweight roster page, which shows 30 freshmen (and only one sophomore). Apparently many of the 30 freshmen have already dropped the program (which is fine - they tried it, it wasn’t for them, they presumably found other things to do). But what happened to the sophomore class? Is this just a glitch of some kind, on the web page, or did something else happen?

There’s also one statement in the article that seems quite dubious: “Despite the success of great walk-on programs at Harvard, Princeton and Cornell, many of the other schools in the league have decided to focus mainly on recruits.” I had not heard there was much difference between any of these programs regarding recruits and walk-ons. Curious to hear others’ experiences. In particular, given some other posts about Harvard’s recruiting, do they really not recruit as much for its lightweights as other Ivies?

49

^^^interesting article. The only place I specifically heard “walk ons” referenced was Princeton. Not that other programs don’t encourage them but that was the only program that mentioned they fill their roster with walk ons.

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@Valdog - I have no experience with LW, but I do know that Ivy LLs and D1 scholarship offers are made in RD too - far fewer LLs or non-Ivy $/pull for spots available obviously, but these offers are made - not every coach gets every one they think they will (either due to the admissions office or the recruit going elsewhere), and not every recruit has his/her original commitment come through. The D1 recruiting dance can continue through the winter.

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@sweepscull - thanks for confirming.

Just going back to the subject of walk-ons for a minute, someone mentioned that there were 60 guys at a recent practice of the Princeton mens’ lightweights. Very impressive.

Still curious to hear from people with knowledge of Harvard’s lightweight rowing recruiting. Looking around, it seems that at least a couple of guys a year are recruits.

Also curious to hear from people going through the womens’ recruiting cycle.

52

Hi!

I’m a junior, 5 feet 5 inches, 125 pounds, a lightweight women’s rower.
I have a few questions:

  1. Is it okay to start connecting with coaches in the summer (summer between junior and senior year)? Have you ever heard of anyone doing that? My erg times aren’t good enough right now.

  2. Is a 7:50 2k erg time a good enough time for Ivies/Stanford/BU etc? That’s not my score right now, it’s my goal.

  3. Does your club have impact on your recruitment? For example: if my club isn’t “famous” for sending recruits to a certain school, does that have an impact on my chances?

  4. If my grades and SAT scores are really good, can my erg times be higher? (for Stanford/Ivies)

Thanks!

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Hi @kimjiwonjenny Others who have been through the who process may be better placed to comment, but FWIW:

  1. If you really want to be at a particular school, apart from their rowing, you should let the coach know that sooner rather than later - I’d say this winter. Then send updates over the year. I’m told that coaches love to see big improvements in erg time, as it suggests you’re applying yourself and you have the ability to get faster and faster in college. If your ergs times don’t improve to the point where you are recruitable, you haven’t lost anything - and if you get in anyway, the coach will welcome you to walk on the team.

Also, summer between junior and senior year is when coaches are revising their lists of recruits, in advance of official visits at the start of fall semester, so if you don’t contact them by then, you may miss the boat entirely.

  1. I can’t say what the ‘benchmark’ time is for light women, but if you look around on other discussions you may find it. I would then suggest that you get a reality check on that number for any given school by (a) looking up the freshmen on the team’s website (if they have lots of walk-ons, look under their “News” section for a press release over the summer along the lines of “Ivy U. welcomes 8 new rowers in the Class of 2020”; those are the recruits). Then (b) look up their 2k times. You can do that by going to the Logbook section of the Concept2 website (where you can filter for gender, lightweight, and ages 13-18, but you’ll probably have to look at a couple of years - 2015 and 2014), or look up the rowers on BeRecruited. On the men’s side, at least, there are several rowers who posted their times on BeRecruited but not on Concept2.

  2. I think there are only a few clubs that are really “feeders” in the sense you suggest - they are the ones that win medals at Nationals year after year. Top clubs give you experience in major regattas, and nationals, which is great. But coaches also know that you often don’t have lots of choices of where to row, and they are looking for ‘diamonds in the rough’ - rowers who have lots of room to improve, once they get better coaching.

That said, I’d pick the program that will best develop your skills as a rower.

  1. The simple answer is yes, but maybe not as much as you would think. There are countless discussions about this topic on CC and elsewhere. IMHO it boils down to the following: coaches prefer candidates with better grades, higher test scores, and faster 2k times. This is particularly true for the Ivies, who have to follow the Academic Index. But rowing tends to attract bright, high-achieving kids, so the advantage may be less than you would think.

Good luck!

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Hi kimjiwonjenny!

I’ll try to answer your questions as best I can.

  1. You should absolutely contact coaches by the summer between your junior and senior year. That’s actually late. Start contacting coaches this winter. Fill out the online recruiting form and follow up with a letter introducing yourself. Don’t wait to get the erg score. Your academics are strong. They will watch your erg scores. Update coaches with all PR’s.

  2. Lightweight times have dropped pretty dramatically in the last couple years. There are a handful of high school Lwts pulling in the 7:30’s and many more pulling in the 7:40’s in their junior year. The best are in the 7:20’s senior year. That said, if you can pull sub 7:50, you are in the ballpark.

Some guidelines from experience at our club that sends many rowers to these schools:

Stanford: Minimum academic standards: all A’s (1 or 2 Bs may fly) 32 or 2150, many challenging courses, and 7:35 or better by the end of your junior year. They will have 4-6 spots (at least a couple will be locked up in the summer).

Harvard: Top academics. Same academic standards as Stanford. Harvard gets more international student interest. Harvard also seems to attract rowers with small boat experience. (1X, 2X)

Princeton: same as Harvard.

For MIT: Perfect Academics. A’s in advanced everything and top test scores. A slower erg score will be OK. Probably sub 8 to get a look and sub 7:50 to get them excited.

For Georgetown: strong academics, but not like Ivies, Stanford, or MIT. Sub 7:45 and good race results at big regattas will get their attention.

For BU: Average+ to good academics. Sub 8 will get a look. Sub 7:50 will garner interest. Sub 7:45, you’ll be a hot recruit. Good race results at major regattas also gets their attention. Go to Crash B’s if possible. The BU coach will be allowed to speak to you because it is held on BU’s campus.

Wisco: similar to BU but lots of spots available. Huge team and lots of walk ons.

Bucknell: good academics, sub 8 should get you a look.

Tulsa: average+ to good academics. Sub 8 gets a look. Sub 7:50 and you will be a top recruit and they have scholarships for Lwts.

  1. Your club team is important and also not important. If you have an amazing erg score or you are very athletic, you need not have come from a great club. That being said, coaches do like to see major race experience like Youth nationals, SRAA, club nationals, canadian Henley etc. If your club does not go to these regattas, maybe you can find a strong program to row for this summer. Small boat experience also impresses.

  2. Princeton, Harvard, and Stanford will get the rare student athletes with exceptional academics, erg scores, and race results. There aren’t many student/athletes that have all 3, but there aren’t many spots at those schools either. Also, check out the athlete bios at those schools. Many of their rowers were some combination of captain/MVP/stroke of open weight nationals boats etc.

So much of the recruiting process varies from year to year and depends on who else is in the recruiting class and a million other factors.

Another good option for smaller rowers, sub 8:00 with strong academics are D3 schools like Williams, Wellesley, Trinity, Bates, Tufts etc…

Best of luck to you!

55

My daughter is not a lightweight at 5’10 and 160 lbs. She has great academics as well but is looking at schools that offer scholarships because we don’t expect to qualify for much, if any, need based aid. At this point she is interested in going to medical school so we need to plan financially for that. Lovesrowing do you know if Georgetown offers rowing scholarships? She is also interested in Boston College, Villanova, Northeastern, Notre Dame and North Carolina.

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All of those schools(Big D1) should offer large rowing scholarships with fully funded teams. Good luck.

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Hi @SusannahH,

Your daughter has checked 2 boxes already, great academics and size. How are her erg scores/race experience? There are many scholarships available at a variety of great schools. The amount of reward is sort of a dance between the team’s ranking and your daughter’s erg score/academic stats.

The higher ranked teams (not the school rank, the team rank) will have lower erg score thresholds for scholarships. So an erg score of 7:30 and good race results might get you only a nominal scholarship award at a top team like UVA (maybe nothing, maybe $2,000), whereas a 7:35 might earn you a full ride at a lesser ranked program like SMU. You mentioned Notre Dame (a top 20 team). Their scholarships offers may start at 7:30 and might increase $10,000 for every 10 or 15 second PR after that. Coaches can give you specific benchmarks, which are constantly changing and dependent upon the applicant pool.

Academics come into play in a different way. Top ranked academic schools like Georgetown and Notre Dame are filled with kids with terrific stats but if you look at schools that are ranked a bit lower academically, they may add academic scholarship to their athletic reward if your daughter is more academically qualified than the average applicant.

Check out some of the college polls that rank all the D1 teams, not just the top 20 (you can find some college poll rankings on the Row2k site). The exact rankings aren’t important, you are just trying to get a general idea where a school falls. You can put together a list of a few schools that match up well with your daughter’s academic criteria, rowing ability, and financial need.

Of the schools you specifically mentioned, Notre Dame and Northeastern are among the more competitive rowing programs, followed by BC and Holy Cross, then Georgetown, followed by Villanova and UNC. Specific rankings can change year to year, but you can get an idea of the program’s competitiveness.

There are so many D1 programs for women it’s hard to be as specific about their standards as it is for women’s lwt programs.

Twoinanddone is correct that most big D1 schools will have large scholarships available.

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Thank you for the helpful advice Lovesrowing. My daughter had some great results this past fall in the 4x boat (she loves sculling) but will not do another 2k for a couple more weeks. Her last 2k was last winter (7:50) but I think she has improved considerably since then. We will see.

At what point in the process should she discuss specific erg benchmarks with the coaches without seeming overly concerned about scholarship amounts? She has exchanged emails with a few coaches so far but realizes it is very early at this point

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I think she should see if she’s right for the team, and if so not be shy about scholarship amounts. We kind of tiptoed around asking, and I don’t think it did anyone any good. If a coach came right out and said “This is how much we can offer” then we could compare. When it finally came down to it, I just said we couldn’t do it for that amount and she came back with more. We later found out one other kid got more. We need more, and this year will just ask for it.

If you need it to make that school work, just ask. All they can say is no, or offer less.

60

you can also ask for a financial aid pre-read once the OVs are being arranged.

And just to be clear in case visitors jump in on this thread without reading all the way through, athletic scholarships pertain to female rowers only…
Men’s rowing does not offer athletic scholarships. Male athletes can look to need based aid (primarily the Ivys) and merit if they have stellar grades.