@oboemom65 Congratulations! Is that for U of MN TC specifically for music? We’re instate for that so I love to hear they might give more merit. I’ve heard great things from the locals about their music dept lately. My kid’s voice teacher did a MM there. I just have a junior so we’re taking notes. I am going to have him schedule an appointment there sometime after the audition/offer season is over.
@MusakParent yes, this is from the school of music. She was accepted for oboe performance and music therapy.
And yes, it’s Twin Cities
@SpartanDrew Purchase handles acceptances first through the conservatory, then through regular admissions. The conservatory notifies admissions that they have admitted your D and makes any scholarship recommendations to them, then admissions will look over the transcripts/essay/other admissions materials, consult with Financial aid and issue the formal acceptance. Congratulations!!
WP gave the greatest number of stackable scholarships and actually came in slightly cheaper than UNT for us. They stacked academic merit, music merit, and honors college merit - 3 separate pieces.
EDIT - I just realized we were talking about Purchase here, but I’ll leave this note on WP here anyway.
NYCMusicMan - here’s my sensitivity here to potentially criticizing kids who decide to focus on music to the exclusion of traditional academics. My husband and two of my kids have very different brains. If you met my husband, you would think that he is reasonably bright and worldly. He is an avid reader of world affairs. However - going through school his grades were not that great and he had to work very hard to pass. Turns out that his brain is wired very differently. He has a high verbal IQ and a low spatial one. That means that he just about flunked every math class he’s taken - and struggled in other classes as well. His mother (a teacher) told him that he was not smart. (image that being said to you as a child?). It infuriates me!
Well - lo and behold, 3 of our 4 kids have his same brain structure - with his ADD as well. 2 of them discovered the arts and never looked back because as our musican daughter said to me one day (just about broke my heart) - “well I might as well do music since I’m not good at school”. Confidence and self-esteem is built on being able to do something well. And if you are constantly hitting your head against the wall and struggling - it doesn’t build confidence and certainly doesn’t encourage kids to pursue a liberal arts education (which I happened to have loved with my own brain structure!) Now - a lot of this is how the American education system is structured - but I digress.
I completely agree that musicians would benefit from learning the historical groundings of music and things as they relate to their major. However, that is sadly not how the current high school system is structured. I think that leads to frustration. I was told that our daughter would really struggle with geometry (based on her brain structure) and likely a foreign language and sure enough, she did. Her distaste of the traditional academic world is completely understandable. So - why should I force her (or even enourage her) to seek a liberal arts degree when she doesn’t have the natural aptitude for it - let alone the time in the day to do it along with a total immersion with music. There are only so many hours in the day.
I would hope that conservatories offers classes that frame music - such as historical relevance, the sociology of music - and even how it can create social change - but beyond that - I sincerely hope that our daughter never has to take another math or science class ever again!
Respectfully, @tripletmama, I think you heard something a little different from what I said. I was not at all advocating that everyone should pursue a liberal arts degree, I was more discouraging a mindset of seeing high school graduation as an opportunity to drop the liberal arts (writ large) like a hot rock and just play my marimba all day (I’m caricaturing).
To be even more precise, I’d say I personally define keeping a liberal arts mindset quite broadly- really just as putting at least some effort into maintaining an interest in and awareness of the world outside one’s own narrow area of focus. That absolutely does not mean taking college level math or science classes, or any particular classes, really. Just keeping some breadth in your vision. The beauty of college and after is that what areas you choose to keep an eye on are much more in your control.
I’d never judge anybody’s individual choices, but I do wholeheartedly believe in the value of periodically engaging in at least some inquiry in areas outside one’s own silo. It doesn’t even have to be in a college class. It’s a lifelong attitude, ideally. Simple as picking up a book.
One of the most brilliant musician/songwriters I know only went to one year of music school, but he’s an avid reader of poetry, novels, etc., partly I think because he feels lacking because he left formal schooling to become an autodidact. But I’d absolutely describe him as a devotee of the liberal arts. And it enriches his work immeasurably.
Maybe it’s a natural progression. I’d imagine the average college freshman eats fewer vegetables than they did when they lived at home, finally liberated from parental supervision. Then as you get older you come back around and see that, properly prepared, vegetables are not only nutritious, but delicious.
And I’ll say it again, artists are not immune to the ills of society. Society needs educated citizens, now more than ever.
Conservatories, including freestanding ones, certainly have classes on music history and other areas related to music, as well as gen eds in the liberal arts (often no math or science). It is important to note that no BM program leaves out other areas of study. The courses outside of music will be 1/4-1/3 of total coursework, versus 2/3-3/4 for a BA. Some will enjoy them and some won’t.
Conservatories also often require outreach activities, which require some skills in speaking and writing, and a career in music often means speaking in front of audiences. Many musicians today are not just aspiring to an orchestra chair but may be more entrepreneurial (entrepreneurship is also offered in many BM programs) which requires skills in marketing, writing, technology, fundraising and generally being able to present oneself as an educated person.
Music programs of all kinds are aware of these needs and prepare students for the complex life of a musician in these days of low funding, high competition for salaried jobs, social media dominance and conservative audiences in need of preconcert talks.
Personally, I have total respect for any choice a young musician makes. I do not view a conservatory/BM choice as an avenue to take because one is not good at academics, nor do I view a decision to attend college/BA program as a desire to pursue music less seriously.
Well we are struggling here in a big way. D is a decent student academically. “Decent”. Nothing over the top stellar. She loves classes like world religion, AP English, languages etc and despises anything STEM. That’s a check in the “con” column for a few colleges that require these classes but she may have to suck it up anyway.
All of the stress of travel and auditions finally caught up with her and she has a nasty cold virus. Put a check mark into the “bad mom” category for me, I gave her dayquil this morning and made her go to school anyway. I honestly can’t even bring myself to pick up the phone and call in one more absence. She is so behind and chose to clean her room last night versus do schoolwork that she is behind on. Classic avoidance tactic. UGH. At this point, I just want to get her through this semester with B’s and graduate. I don’t even care about A’s anymore. And she has another full week in April that she will miss school for YoungArts. Oy vey.
@SpartanDrew , I am sooo tempted to sacrifice an “A” in exchange for a cleaned up room! With two teenage boys, I am afraid to even go upstairs! Hope your D feels better.
I know kids who spent high school focused on a performing art and then in late senior year switched to an academic path, and vice versa. And kids who did music for undergrad then Medieval Studies or med school for grad, or did physics for undergrad and then music for grad. I know one kid with academic challenges who didn’t even attend senior year of high school, in order to perform, but then rejected her performing art path in favor of academics, despite the struggle.
I think the main argument for some kids avoiding specializing too much in high school is that their paths may hold surprises, zigs and zags. But prioritizing music does not always mean a narrow path, and the path is flexible over time.
It is also true that a kid can do fewer AP’s and maybe even not fulfill formal admission requirements in science or math, and still get into elite colleges- if they are doing music outside of school at a high level. Many of the assumptions about “either or” are not valid.
Spartan Drew, your daughter did a lot of auditions and a lot of travel. In a school that does not make allowances or make packages of work to take on audition trips, and a kid who is not into academics at this moment, it makes sense to really ramp down academics for senior year, maybe do some online courses for flexibility, and even seek some extensions/incompletes or withdraw from classes when it is possible. I know it is late in the game now, but just for others…and hoping you could maybe meet with the principal with your daughter to come up with a less stressful solution to her situation. Or perhaps a coach temporarily to organize the catch up. Good luck!
Oh @vistajay believe me…it’s not an A she is sacrificing. It may be a B or a C at this point. Or even passing a class. UGH. That being said her room was such a pigsty that she hadn’t even unpacked from our Boston and NY trip before packing for Memphis. She used another suitcase! Hubby had to go dump the content of her other suitcase out onto the floor when he traveled last week so he could have his suitcase back! The carpet wasn’t even visable in her room. Truth. So while I’m delighted that it’s clean I’m not happy it was at the expense of the work she really needs to do. I had planned to crack the whip on her over spring break in April to clean her room. Yikes. I just looked at her online grades and the one C moved to a B but she still has a D and an F. The F in French annoys me because she has tried to make up quizzes and presentations with that teacher and the teacher hasn’t been very cooperative according to D. Then again…that is “according to D”. Maybe time to email the teacher and intervene.
I wonder if you could meet with the principal (or guidance?) to come up with a master plan, that could be conveyed to teacher from above. And if a temporary coach would help, as mentioned above. With our performer, we met with the principal beforehand and then the teachers cooperated.
Yes. We went through the guidance counselor. It was extremely evident that S’ pursuits were legit, so it went smooth in that way.
Our principal is useless. The guidance counselor is great and very supportive. D wants to email the French teacher herself. I will give her today to try to get something handled on her own and if Mademoiselle (French teacher) isn’t cooperative or communicative I will intervene. D texted she is miserable and can be more productive at home so I called her out. Put a check in the WIN column for her. #MomFail
SpartanDrew - try not to sweat it. I know it’s hard - but stop looking at her grades! (easier said than done). Will it matter in the end? (I guess she has to graduate so that F needs to come up to a D, right? What’s wrong with a D? Will it matter in the long term?
Now - having said all this - like you, I’m going to have to fight our D’s school. Ever since our D bowed her bass for 7 hours a day (no lie) at Brevard 3 years ago - she’s had chronic shoulder pain. She tried everything…PT, Alexander Technique, more PT, strengthening exercises - you name it. It only happens when she sits and bows and not when she stands and plucks for jazz.
Not sure if it’s the reason why - but she decided a few months ago that she wants to focus only on jazz going forward. She asked her school if she could drop classical - and they said “no”. (they need another bass for the orchestra). We went to an orchestra performance about a month ago and I could see our daughter grimmacing from the shoulder pain on stage. At that moment - I got truly upset and decided that I was going to force the issue. I emailed them the next day and said that she is not going to do classical bowing for the unforeseen future. They asked for a doctor’s note - which I provided. Then they told our daughter that they thought she was making it up to get out of classical. (which angered me!). They have since asked for another note with the exact time she needs to be off of bowing and also why she can still lift her bass - so the war seems to be on. It’s just crazy. She has an “F” in orchestra right now because of her absences - and not sure if they will budge on this. Not sure if I have the energy to fight this - but I suppose I must. Our daughter is really concerned what will transpire if she sends in her transcripts next year with an “F” in orchestra. (she is doing well in jazz). Any advice would be appreciated. BTW - no one else in her school has a double major - so in addition to it hurting her shoulder - she was burning the candle at both ends trying to keep up with a double major - and studying at another conservatory in the area at night.
Tripletmama is your daughter in high school or undergrad? If high school you could get a 504 plan for her shoulder which has some legal clout. If college, she could visit the office of disabilities and get accommodations- such as not bowing in classical!
I don’t know if you have heard of prolotherapy or PRP but one of my kids had a miracle cure of a similar issue with PRP. That is platelet rich plasma. They take blood out in a large syringe, spin it to concentrate the platelets, and then inject in the troublesome joint or area. It regenerates and heals. After 10 years of physical therapy and pain PRP was a miracle- with almost total healing in a few days. It is offered through mainstream places like Spaulding Rehab, part of Mass. General Hospital, but we paid cash for it (and are submitting a claim). Dr; Borg Stein did it for us.
@tripletmama I love that you have such great insight about how each child learns. Knowing this will help you chose college programs. I might add U Arts in Philly is one of those places that offers arts infused gen ed classes. Not sure what they offer for Bass.
As for the current issue with your DD shoulder. It is crazy that your DD is the only one with a double major. I might suggest that you call any schools that you know DD is interested in applying to and see what they say about the situation. I would start keeping records of the Dr’s Notes and anything that can help you explain the situation to a college.
Compmom - thanks for the tip. I will definitely remember this treatment for the future. It’s not a huge issue right now since if she doesn’t bow - it heals (it’s just about healed from her performance). Of course, as we know, kids do change their minds - so good to know if she goes back to classical and bowing. The way she puts it - if she truly loved classical (like she did the past) she would put up with it (she did that for a year or two) - which I’m sure is not a good idea. A 504 Plan is a great idea!!! I’m sure that’s why they asked if there are any other concessions that she needs to have (e.g. in terms of lifting her bass). I did just email them and ask why she has a D (checked it - and it’s not an “F” in orchestra as I had thought) in Orchestra considering that she can’t play. I hope to God that they don’t expect her to sit there and listen to everyone play. (she has been going to study hall).
@dlglass - great idea about saving doctor’s notes. I’m hopeful that they change her grade - but if they don’t - it will be helpful to explain the situation. U Arts sounds amazing!!!
@tripletmama You need to fight the good fight, but your daughter will have such great fodder for her college essays. And she will be able to explain her situation in the process.
If you have provided documentation in the form of doctors’ notes, it is actually illegal for them to penalize her for not playing in orchestra. We ran into this too, with a clarinetist kid. You may not want to consult a lawyer ($150.hour) though I did end up doing that for something else. There are advocates who can help with this or you can call the Office for Civil Rights at the Federal Dept, of Education. This does not have to be a complaint but the OCR will “educate” them. If she suffers physical problems from playing they cannot make her play or penalize her for not playing.