<p>Hey guys,</p>
<p>I was wondering if getting third party scholarships would reduce the amount of financial aid given. If so, are third-party scholarships worth applying for? Also, if the financial aid doesn't cover my full tuition, would applying for scholarships later and using them toward to cover my tuition further detract the amount of financial aid I can get?</p>
<pre><code> Thanks!!!
</code></pre>
<p>You have to go to your college’s financial web page and look up what their policy is regarding outside scholarships. Usually, if a college does not meet full need as defined by PROFILE if they use it or FAFSA if they use it, any outside money can go first towards that unmet need. A problem is that most of the time you don’t know what the PROFILE “EFC” is. A lot of schools just present the need package and you have no idea how much of your need is unmet by there definition unless the school is one that guarantees to meet 100% of need as it defines it.</p>
<p>The third party scholarship usually goes to reduce loans and work study first, unsubsidized if given as part of the package before subsidized. In some cases when that is done, a student can get the unsubsidized Staffords back to meet EFC.</p>
<p>To get very specific answers, you should call the financial aid director and ask specifically regarding your package and how an outside scholarship would be applied to it. </p>
<p>Most of the time, unless you have a full ride with no loans or work study, it is worth it to get outside money. But check because it does come down to specific school policies.</p>
<p>If so, are third-party scholarships worth applying for?</p>
<p>We can’t answer that question without more info. What schools are you applying to? Do they meet need? Will you have a high “family contribution”.</p>
<p>We have a very high family contribution, so any/all scholarships (private and school related) reduce our cost. However, everyone’s situation is different. </p>
<p>If your school meets need and puts loans in packages, then the private scholarship might reduce loans. :)</p>
<p>If your school does NOT meet need, then you may end up with a smaller gap or no gap. :)</p>
<p>Again, what schools are you applying to? And, if any are state schools, indicate OOS status. </p>
<p>Also, if the financial aid doesn’t cover my full tuition, would applying for scholarships later and using them toward to cover my tuition further detract the amount of financial aid I can get?</p>
<p>My son’s college will only reduce aid packages when students get outside scholarship if the total amounts are over federal rules that do not permit amounts of federal aid in excess of COA. So at a school like that, the first thing you would lose out of necessity are the work study and Stafford amounts. It appears that any need gramts given by the school will hold fast, but is also signals that the school does not give out those grants until maximum federal loans and work study are awarded. What the school would do if a student won a $50K grant, I would not want to hazard a guess. According to the wording on the site, the student would get to double dip with the school’s own money, but I would not want to bet on it. You really have to talk to fhe fina aid officers.</p>
<p>@cptoofthehouse
Thank you so much for your thorough response. I think I definitely have to do some more research before finding out the amount of financial aid I can get and whether outside scholarships will be necessary. </p>
<p>@mom2collegekids
Thank you! I’m going to apply to UPenn, Johns Hopkins, UChicago, Bryn Mawr(maybe), OSU(in-state tuition) and some yet to be determined admission/financial safeties. I’ve ran the FASFA calculator a few times, but because I’m uncertain what the assets should include(cars?houses?) my calculations have been ranging for around 8,000-20,000 for EFC. So I’m definitely going to need as much scholarships to cover the EFC because I want to spend the least amount possible for undergrad so I have more money for grad school.</p>
<p>*I’ve ran the FASFA calculator a few times, but because I’m uncertain what the assets should include(cars?houses?) *</p>
<p>First off, FAFSA doesn’t include the value of your HOME or cars, but will include the value of any other homes/buildings/rentals/etc that you may own.</p>
<p>CSS profile does include the equity value of your home…and any other properties. CSS also includes the value of cars.</p>
<p>The schools on your list are mostly CSS Profile schools. </p>
<p>And, if you have a non-custodial parent, then their income may need to be included for CSS Profile schools. </p>
<p>my calculations have been ranging for around 8,000-20,000 for EFC. So I’m definitely going to need as much scholarships to cover the EFC</p>
<p>I’m concerned about what you wrote there. If you have “need”, then your outside scholarships ARE NOT going to go toward your EFC. </p>
<p>Let me give you some examples.</p>
<p>Let’s assume that your EFC/family contribution is $20k and the COA is $50k…</p>
<p>Then, you have $30k of need.</p>
<p>So…the school may give you…</p>
<p>$21k in grant (free money!)
$6k in loans (student loans - stafford and perkins)
$3k in work-study (money for you to earn at a campus job)</p>
<p>So…then…if you were to get $9k in outside scholarships, then…</p>
<p>The school may likely change your package to this…</p>
<p>$21k in grants</p>
<h2>$9k in outside scholarships</h2>
<p>$30k need is met…loans removed…work-study removed…BUT…your “family contribution” is STILL $20k. 
</p>
<p>However, you could then take out $5500 in unsub student loans and then your family would need to pay out $14,500 out of pocket. </p>
<p>Why are you getting huge swings in Family contribution? Do you have a more complicated situation?</p>
<p>Are your parents married to each other? If not, are they married to other people?</p>
<p>Is either parent self employed?
Do your parents own stocks, investments, property, or have substantial savings?</p>
<p>If so, then family contribution could be unpredictable.</p>
<p>However if your family’s situation isn’t complicated, and your parents don’t own much or have much in savings, then if you’re NOT low income, then you can estimate that your “family contribution” is going to be about 24% of family income (BEFORE taxes).</p>
<p>So, if your family’s AGI is about $100k, their family contribution may be about $24k or so.</p>
<p>How much will your parents pay each year? If you don’t know, ask them.</p>
<p>What are your financial safeties? Since money seems to be a concern, if your stats are high enough, be sure to have some safeties that will give you HUGE merit.</p>
<p>What is your major?</p>
<p>What are your stats?</p>
<p>ARe you a likely NMSF?</p>
<p>In your case, it would be to your advantage to apply for some outside scholarship. In most all cases, it would be, and you do not fall into the exception. I did not know if you were already accepted to a school, gotten the aid package and were wondering whether to apply for some awards this summer. </p>
<p>In your case, you have no idea what your aid packages are going to be. You have schools that will definitely have self help in their packages and some that do not guarantee to meet need. So it would be to your advantage to have some outside money that you can apply to the packages. If you get the awards early, you might even be able to see which accepted schools will let you keep the most of the awards. </p>
<p>Other than OSU, the schools you have listed are not FAFSA only school. They also want PROFILE and have very strict rules on how they look at assets and income on that application. So your FAFSA EFC will be what determines your eligibility for federal funds, and you are not PELL eligible, so that means is federal loans in the amount of $5500 is what is guaranteed, with $3500 of it maybe subsidized. The rest of the money has to come from the schools, and they will use PROFILE to get the need number they will support. </p>
<p>FAFSA does not include the value of your primary residence or your cars nor your non custodial parents (if divorced) in calculating the EFC. When you are using institutional methodology they can value the fillings in your teeth. Yes, they do want home equity and assets of all dependent siblings and sometimes will ask for the value of the cars. So your PROFILE “EFC” will probably be higher than your FAFSA EFC, but the private schools you have listed will use that PROFILE number in giving you aid. How they handle the gap between FAFSA and PROFILE need in terms of outside scholarships is up to them My son’s school uses the FAFSA EFC as the determinant, from what the website on financial aid and outside scholarships reads, but that is just one school, and this can differ widely. </p>
<p>Really, what it comes down to, is that the more funds you have, the more flexibility you will have. If you have a list of outside scholarships, by all means pursue them.</p>
<p>My S is going to UPENN and they gave him scholarship/grant money ($44K) and he has to come up with $2500 summer money and has $3400 in Work study. He got $2200 in outside scholarships and that can replace his summer money or reduce his work study. If he get more than $2500 in scholarships, it will reduce his work study or they will reduce his scholarship/grants. Outside scholarships do not affect our family portion ($8K). But we could have him take out an unsub loan (deferred) for $5500 of that if we wanted to. Or we can take out our own loan or pay it.</p>
<p>What about this scenario? Say my son gets a full tuition ride at a school but our EFC is about 10K which is around the cost of room and board. If my son were to get outside scholarships, this would be a win-win situation, correct? Basically, if my son goes to any school that gives a grant for all the cost except what our EFC says we should pay would be a school that would apply outside scholarships towards reducing our EFC, correct?</p>
<p>sbjdorio - Check the colleges website for info. Depends on who is giving the “full tuition”. At UPenn, if they are giving the money, outside scholarships don’t reduce family contribution.</p>
<p>sbjdorlo, UPenn is a meet full-needs school. There will be no unmet need. Also, in your scenario, there are no loans or workstudy. So, no, they will likely take the outside scholarship and you will still have to pay the same $10K.</p>
<p>Oh man, so then we’re still left with trying to find some way to pay our EFC. Ugh. We know we can squeeze maybe 5K a year but no more than that. So what’s the point of my son going for a 6K NMS or entering his research in a competition or his applying for any scholarhips really? His schools are a mix of financial safeties or ones that claim to meet full need but we definitely don’t have money for our EFC.</p>
<p>Every school seems to handle it slightly differently because packages are unique and there is some kind of rule around fed funds and how they’re used (eg. no one can leave fed funds in and go over a COA). One way or the other the EFC usually comes from parents and students in terms of saving or loans. </p>
<p>However, from the sound of your post you are operating from projections of finaid calculators right now, right? Just to make sure you have your eyes wide open, remember that the EFC according to FAFSA is the MINIMUM you’ll ever pay. There really is no guarantee how the CSS schools will interpret your assets/capability to pay, or how much the traditional state/out of state schools might “GAP” you. So look for scholarship resources where you can nonetheless.</p>
<p>sbj…Say my son gets a full tuition ride at a school but our EFC is about 10K which is around the cost of room and board. If my son were to get outside scholarships, this would be a win-win situation, correct?</p>
<p>What do you mean by a “full tuition” ride? Do you mean a full tuition MERIT scholarship? Or do you mean that your child got a “need based” grant that essentially is covering tuition only…leaving you to pay for EFC?</p>
<p>If the “full tuition ride” is “need based” then likely that will get reduced.</p>
<p>However, if the “full tuition ride” is a MERIT scholarship, then likely any new scholarships would reduce your EFC.</p>
<p>However, if your child’s school gives only “need based aid”…AND…it doesn’t package any loans in the FA Package, THEN you can have your child take out a $5k per year federal student loan to reduce your EFC.</p>
<p>So here are a few schools from a best case scenario (accepted and receiving top scholarship) just for the sake of my understanding:</p>
<p>Harvey Mudd-top scholarship is a full ride which leaves us room and board to cover to the tune of 11K. If my son got outside scholarships, would those go towards reducing our EFC?</p>
<p>UTD-My son’s financial safety. Based on his chess rank, PSAT, and academics, he would get (remember best case scenario) all costs covered and we don’t need to worry about EFC.</p>
<p>Princeton-According to their calculator, our EFC is about $6500. This is the best I’ve seen and we could handle our son taking out $1500 a year in loans.</p>
<p>UPenn-If they use federal EFC, our EFC (with income of 78K, family of 5, and no assets or savings) is arout 10-11K. All aid is need based. So, in UPenn’s case, outside scholarship would only reduce the grant and thus, we would still be stuck coming up with 10-11K, correct?</p>
<p>Other schools on list with merit and need based aid but ones that I don’t know about their policies: WUSTL, Davidson, Vanderbilt</p>
<p>Other possibles on list that meet full need: Harvard and MIT</p>
<p>Others that have little aid, either merit or need: UCSD</p>
<p>Based on this list of schools, is it worthwhile for my son to pursue outside scholarships? I’m particularly interested in knowing about Princeton, Penn, Harvey Mudd, and Vanderbilt since those are my son’s top schools. (Followed by UTD and the other schools and possibly Baylor and U of Rochester)</p>
<p>Should we just go down the list and contact each school and ask the question?</p>
<p>Harvey Mudd-top scholarship is a full ride which leaves us room and board to cover to the tune of 11K. If my son got outside scholarships, would those go towards reducing our EFC?</p>
<p>Just so that everyone is on the same page with terminology, a “full tuition” scholarship is not a “full ride” scholarship. It’s a “full tuition” scholarship. A full ride scholarship covers tuition, room, board, etc. </p>
<p>So, you’re saying that HMU has given your son a “full tuition merit scholarship” based only on his stats and not on need? if so, then it’s very possible that additional private scholarships can go towards room and board. But, check with HMU.</p>
<p>Or…is the money that you’re getting from HMU “need based” determined by financial need?</p>
<p>None of the Ivy League schools give merit based scholarships, only need based aid. Therefore, outside scholarships will not reduce your EFC. For instance, Yale will first reduce the student’s expected contribution and then work study. Then it will apply any remaining funds to their need based grants.</p>
<p>If your son applies to schools that give large merit based aid, then it is very likely that outside scholarships will reduce your EFC. My daughter received only merit based scholarships, so all of her outside scholarships reduce our EFC. And I think someone mentioned that if full need is met without loans, your son can still take $5,500 in Stafford loans to help with the EFC.</p>
<p>Sorry, mom2collegekids, I am still not being clear. No, my son has no offers from any school as he is a rising senior. I’m just putting out best case scenarios. And sorry about confusing “full ride” with “full tuition”.</p>
<p>So, Harvey Mudd has one type of scholarship (obviously extremely competitive) that covers tuition. It is merit based and not need based. If my son somehow got that, he could then reduce his EFC by getting outside scholarships, correct?</p>
<p>OTOH, schools like Princeton, Penn, etc., who offer no merit aid but all is based on need, if my son were to get outside scholarships, that would only decrease his need-based aid and not his EFC. Is my understanding clear on that?</p>
<p>sbjdorlo - since you mentioned chess and UTD, you should also be aware of the USCF Chess Player Scholar Award ([The</a> United States Chess Federation - 2011 Chess Player Scholar Award: Call for Applications](<a href=“The United States Chess Federation”>The United States Chess Federation - 2011 Chess Player Scholar Award: Call for Applications)). It’s a $1500 one-time scholarship awarded to 5 college-bound students each year that excel in chess. If your son has a rating of 2000 or higher along with stats to get into the schools you have mentioned, he would be competitive. Not a ton of money, but every little bit help, right.</p>
<p>Hey, thanks for the tip! This one I didn’t know about. Yes, my son’s rating is over
2000 and he does have excellent stats. Thank-you so much for the lead!</p>