<p>Capitalism sucks! Lets be socialist so we can all be equally miserable!</p>
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unless you actually grew up in a poor neighbourhood,
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I did. So it's you that should shut the hell up.
This is pointless. Liberals will never give up the idea of giving free money to poor, so i'm sure not gonna be the one who proves them wrong.</p>
<p>Not to mention that a lot of the "poor and lazy" are the ones who fight for our country. No, living in the slums or projects is not an excuse and the answer is hard work and dedication. It's not easy to point fingers unless you've constantly been put down everyday by your parents and even teachers. Or if you only have one parent in the house working three jobs and is never around. Maybe there are no parents and it's just you and your siblings or possibly grandparents. This isn't a problem of liberals and conservatives it's a human problem. Judging why or how someone is in the situation their in is pointless and doesn't say very much about the person doing the judging.</p>
<p>Do you even know what socialism is, brew?</p>
<p>Because I'm currently posting from a socialist nation - the Netherlands - where there are absolutely no beggars anyway. Of course, they get taxed like 50%, but few people are destitute - even in comparison with the poor of America. Socialism is NOT equivalent to communism, and is actually practiced in several European countries, including France, England, Sweden, etc. with what I would see as much success.</p>
<p>Capitalism is the choice of the wealthy. If you were poor - and not because you were dumb or deserved it - you'd understand. Instead, you're stuck in your selfish little bubble and can't even bear to contemplate the horrors and realities of poverties, much less sympathize with them.</p>
<p>First of all Northshorekaui, it is easy to point fingers -- look how little trouble so many of us seem to have doing it. That they're that way because their parents were mean to them or because their parents weren't around is of very little relevance to me. Its not my or the goverment's responsibility to make up for these people's bad childhood. However, we do have a responsiblity to try to stop this cycle of laziness, and that won't be accomplished by handing out free money which only enables these people to continue their unproductive lifestyle.</p>
<p>I am not against public education for the poor. It is what enables the not lazy among them to pull themselves up out of poverty. I am not against limited welfare either. We could go back to how it originally was where you had to work to get it. However, I find this practice of handing out free money either as wellfare to the poor or as aid to poor countries disgusting. That you liberals have the gall to cripple these people with your free money just to make yourselves feel better and think that you've helped someone and then tell me that your the ones that want to help the poor is maddening in its cruel hypocrisy. Maybe if you stop your knee jerking long enough to to figure out how to actually do something about the problem then twenty years from now we wont have to have this discussion.</p>
<p>ebonytear,</p>
<p>I recall when my cousin came over from Australia. He's a Dentist now; I didn't care, I was only curious on how much he was making. However, before I asked his pay, I asked his taxes. When he said 50%, I was completely shocked. At 50% - that means an entire half a year working for the government alone!</p>
<p>One thing I would argue is that Socialist countries have significantly more trouble competing with non-socialist countries. The examples of France's unemployment amongst college students is one that comes to mind.</p>
<p>I grew up fairly poor. But the few things I learned was how to conserve and maximize my opporuntities. However, I would love to keep the persevation of capitalism. Why? Because I know that this incentive and my work ethic will get me places. My American Dream is not to own a house, but is to own a corporation in the S/P 500. </p>
<p>northshorekau -</p>
<p>Believe me, I have the umost respect for anyone that decides to serve in our country. But let's be honest, except for the prestigious military academies, most view military not as an option of protecting America's freedoms, but the only option left aside from working at Wal-Mart. During their service, often the work ethic is built in the service that they perform everyday.</p>
<p>
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"I did. So it's you that should shut the hell up.
This is pointless. Liberals will never give up the idea of giving free money to poor, so i'm sure not gonna be the one who proves them wrong."
[/quote]
</p>
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"Capitalism sucks! Lets be socialist so we can all be equally miserable!"
[/quote]
</p>
<p>LMAO@ you two tools. There's nothing more pathetic than seeing people reduced to name calling the other side because they've run out of counterpoints. Anything that implies government funding to the young neo-conservatives in the making is immediately discredited as communism and liberal brainwashing, while anything that does the same for the military to the left is fascism. You guys aren't Bill O'Reilly, alright? You don't have the reach that he does and likely never will so don't be afraid to voice an actual opinion over the internet it's not like you have ratings or public opinion polls to worry about, you're all nobodys at this point. When you run for office or something, then you can spew the rhetoric.</p>
<p>I did not make ONE point where I asked the government to give lower income families more money, except for the part where the PUBLIC schools needed more funding for textbooks and supplies. I was simply illustrating that it is a lot harder to make ends meet living in a lower income household then you people percieve it to be.</p>
<p>I don't understand how people can continually rag on poor people for being lazy and stupid while they happily cut the social programs that are supposed to help them out of poverty. I'm not even talking about welfare or food stamps (which by the way is a stupid idea). I'm talking about BASIC public education.</p>
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Socialism is NOT equivalent to communism, and is actually practiced in several European countries, including France, England, Sweden, etc. with what I would see as much success.
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</p>
<p>How are those nations having success? All I can see is the European countries quickly losing power (economic, political, and miitary). Aslo, all the countries have horrible health care. There may not be beggars on the streets there, but there are plenty of people dying as a result of the horrid health care (including 10,000+ in that French heat wave a few summers ago). I'm really sick of people acting like Europe is some Utopia. Everything going on in Europe screams losing power and desparation.</p>
<p>While, on the other hand, countries like China are having great success. I don't think it's a coincidence that as China gets closer and closer to Capitalism, it gains more power and becomes a better place to live.</p>
<p>Whether they are doing it to stay out of walmart or not they are. It's beside the point. Everyone says how important it is but they want to leave it to the poor to do. At least it's done. I never said to give "your" money away to the poor or said that the welfare system is perfect. It's just easy to point fingers at how "lazy" someone is while mommy and daddy are taking care of everything for you. You say that it is easy to point fingers because so many people have ease doing it. That's not so. It is easy when you live in suburbia. JoMo I doubt you have any idea what it is actually like to live that way day in and day out other than just driving by a slum area. TuftsPlease I do agree with you but it's better than a draft.</p>
<p>This lazy poor person has to go to work have a good one all.</p>
<p>Wait what the hell. I grew up in the time when my parents were students pursieing their masters. And then their PHDs..For the first 8 years of my life the 3 of us lived under $1400 a month! Only after my Dad got his PHD did we get out of the apartments and into another set. 6 years after that we got our first $500,000 house. So it's definetly possible to become wealthy from extreme poverty. I was that kid who never asked or recieved the fancy video game systems when I was a kid when my friends got them, at the age of 17 I make more than my parents did when they were working back then and my parents are in the top 1% now, so it's definetly possible to rise through society provided you have the work ethic and drive.</p>
<p>Now that my parents have wealth, they donate it and share it. But considering that they worked their tails off for it, I don't think that its their DUTY but their CHOICE</p>
<p>A great one at that, but the notion that the rich HAVE to give to the poor is kind of ridiculous</p>
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[quote]
Wait what the hell. I grew up in the time when my parents were students pursieing their masters. And then their PHDs..For the first 8 years of my life the 3 of us lived under $1400 a month! Only after my Dad got his PHD did we get out of the apartments and into another set. 6 years after that we got our first $500,000 house. So it's definetly possible to become wealthy from extreme poverty
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sounds like the story of my life, except, substitute 3 people for 5 people and PhD for MBA...</p>
<p>This thread is ridiculous. No one here, conservative or liberal, is against the idea of capitalism. Social darwinism is a fact, whether anyone likes it or not. What ignited the flame war were the absurdly sweeping comments like "all poor people are stupid and lazy", which are quite hypocritical consideirng that the majority of the wealthy and elite's fortunes are inherited one way or another. Just realize that not everyone starts off at the same rung on the ladder of life, and that there are social obstacles that prevent people from the lower ones from ever reaching the top.
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While, on the other hand, countries like China are having great success. I don't think it's a coincidence that as China gets closer and closer to Capitalism, it gains more power and becomes a better place to live.
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Are you joking? You are an epitome of a subject under media influence. Just because a country moves closer to Western ideals doesn't necessarily make it a good place to live. It just bears more similarities to the United States, where the elite are rich and ignorant, and the poor majority are left to fight amongst theirselves.</p>
<p>only in the united states poor people have the opportunity to be fat.</p>
<p>You know, for a while my family of 4 lived on $12K a year, yet we managed to have our own house and not get any welfare or foodstamps or anything like that. Now my family's income, in about 12 years, is 4x that and climbing fast thanks to developing some land outside a national park into a motel. You couldn't do that in communism. We'd stil be at $12K a year</p>
<p>Just playing the devil's advocate here... but in a communist society, either you wouldn't be making 12k a year in the first place, or 12k a year is more than enough for a family of your size to survive</p>
<p>hobofromdowntown: that's not true. cheap fast food/processed food are infiltrating and fattening other societies too</p>
<p>Yeah we survived (obvisoulsy), but isn't it good that were moving up?</p>
<p>anarcho-syndicalism for the win.</p>
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</p>
<p>And I see that America is prospering very nicely, what with our dwindling economy, unhealthy addiction to oil, and some of the worst education and high school drop-out rates of the developed world. The only reason we have a powerful military is because we spend $335 billion a year on it, pushing our nation even further into debt. Our jobs are being outsourced to India and China (a nation which oppresses its people--and America doesn't care) because we are "lazy" and "stupid" and demand a decent living wage. To top it all off, we also happen to be involved in the most ridiculous war in world history and our alienating our allies. We have lost practically all respect in the international community. We are using our people's tax dollars to buy bombs to give as presents to Israel (I don't have anything against Israel, but I don't want my money funding their war). The only way we have control over others is by holding the threat of nuclear weapons over their heads (and, of course, it is just fine and dandy for AMERICA to have nuclear weapons, just nobody else). Nice job, America. I am sick of people acting like America is some Utopia.</p>
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While, on the other hand, countries like China are having great success. I don't think it's a coincidence that as China gets closer and closer to Capitalism, it gains more power and becomes a better place to live.
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</p>
<p>Yes, China is certainly a much better place than Europe to live in, considering all power resides with the wealthy while much of the rest of the population is incredibly poor. The average salary is about $3000, the government stomps out opposition groups, and much of the population works en masse in factories where they are underpaid to produce Wal-Mart products. The rich are getting richer, the poor are getting poorer, and the middle-class is disapating. Of course, America isn't concerned that China doesn't have a democracy: we just want to get rid of dictators in the Middle East because there is not enough oil left to feed our addiction.</p>
<p>Oh yes, and Exxon-Mobil has reported the biggest profits in history. So much for the rich all being unbelievably hard-working. Just jack up the price of an inelastic commodity such as gas and you're all set. And I'm sure that everyone who inherits moolah is also hard-working. It's not possible for everyone to be rich. Some people can work their entire lives and never get there. Some people will just walk into a pile of money ala Paris Hilton. Life is not meant to be a power struggle, in my opinion.</p>
<p>I don't believe in a communist society, but I don't believe in a capitalist society either: communism because it will never work because someone will always be greedy and take advantage; capitalism because it is a horrible system. Oh yes, let all the companies dump chemicals in the rivers, burn down all our rainforests, and work people to death in the unlivable conditions of the Gilded Age. Screw the ozone layer! Global warming? A myth concocted by godless liberals to get us all to hug trees! Sweatshop workers? Well, they get paid, don't they? Never mind an early death, ripped off fingers; let them drink sewage, as long as we have money in our pockets!</p>
<p>I'll wait for you redneck neo-cons to commence the swearing. :)</p>