<p>Kowloon,</p>
<p>I know you're Korean. I also never said that anyone reveres Berkeley over Harvard. I just think that you spoke too broadly and too positively for Harvard.</p>
<p>E-Land in Korea resells stuff that says Harvard on them. 'Nuff said.</p>
<p>Harvard is well known in Asia; but Berkley is equally as well known.</p>
<p>ilovebagels,</p>
<p>That's indicative of... what? I mean, other than consumptionism.</p>
<p>What's up with this prestige "Factor"? Doesn't anyone go to school anymore for what they have to offer in terms of what you want to study? Not to mention the lack of restriction placed upon your academic options and opportunities? </p>
<p>I am in no way opposed to the Prestige Factor. But rather see the discussion focused more on academic program content than anything else. This is what determines whether a school is good or not. Then again, different schools apply to different people.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Doesn't anyone go to school anymore for what they have to offer in terms of what you want to study?
[/quote]
In many cases this makes very little difference. The most popular majors are English, biology, psychology, and similar majors that can be studied pretty much anywhere.</p>
<p>
[quote]
What's up with this prestige "Factor"? Doesn't anyone go to school anymore for what they have to offer in terms of what you want to study? Not to mention the lack of restriction placed upon your academic options and opportunities?</p>
<p>I am in no way opposed to the Prestige Factor. But rather see the discussion focused more on academic program content than anything else. This is what determines whether a school is good or not. Then again, different schools apply to different people.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Is it really?</p>
<p>Let's peer through the looking glass from the other side for a moment. Let's assume that most colleges within the Top... oh say... 50 colleges / universities in the US provide you with a pretty decent education....OK. So, what separates them? Why are some colleges in higher demand vs. others? Why do some colleges have consistently higher yield vs. others? Why are graduates of some colleges better represented at the premier graduate schools and corporations? This is not even mentioning things such as endowment, alumni network, facilities, faculty-student ratios, etc... Besides taking your own criteria (things like "what a school offers" and "academic opportunities"), I think you will find that those "prestigious" schools discussed frequently on CC punch above their respective weight in those categories... I mean, its not like there are schools that are composed of smoke and mirrors and somehow get magical prestige raves either in CC or the real world -- as a a great president once quipped: "You can fool some of the people half of the time and half of the people some of the time, but..." sorry that was the wrong one, it actually goes "fool me once, shame on me, fool me twice, you can't get fooled again...", er, or something to that effect... I digress... you get the point.</p>
<p>Clearly there is SOME difference between, say, Harvard / Princeton / Yale / Stanford / MIT vs... say school no. 50. (which this year happens to be Syracuse and Tulane -- and nothing against those fine schools, they just happen to be ranked 50 this year by USNWR). Now whether you want to categorize some, all or none of that under "prestige factor" (as you call it) is really a moot point. Because the fact is, the elite schools DO have that something that the non-elite schools don't. And the best students from around the country (and indeed around the world) want a piece of that action.</p>
<p>Oh crap, there are only 50 schools that provide a decent education out of 3,000? Holy ****! What am I to do?</p>
<p>
Oh crap, there are only 50 schools that provide a decent education out of 3,000? Holy ****! What am I to do?
</p>
<p>You'll notice of course that not once in my previous post did I state that there are ONLY 50 schools that provide a decent education. Any reasonable person will clearly see that I arbitrarily chose the number 50 purely for illustrative purposes.</p>
<p>if johns hopkins is ever replaced by wustl in terms of prestige I'll die</p>
<p>To settle the Vanderbilt v. U of Chicago debate way earlier (I was too lazy to read and see where it ended up), I have found conclusive evidence that UC is more prestigious: In a google fight, UC gets 24 million hits, while Vanderbilt only gets 17.3 million. Harvard also beats Yale, Princeton, Stanford, etc., so maybe this method actually has a morsel of legitimacy...</p>
<p>Wait, are you google fighting UC or University of Chicago? Because if its UC vs. vanderbilt then of course UC would win because UC is also Unversity of California.</p>
<p>^^ no, it was University of Chicago.</p>
<p>But even then, results are skewed since it's often referred to as Chicago, UC, U of C, UChic, etc. Vanderbilt is also referred to as Vandy, though "Vanderbilt" might be referring to the person (or some other use) rather than to the school.</p>
<p>I've read the entire thread. Though they are not "universities" you'd have to argue that West Point and the Naval Academy are right up there in prestige along with any other school. My evidence:</p>
<p>I'll use Aurelius' criteria:</p>
<ol>
<li>Academic Reputation</li>
<li>Street Name Recognition</li>
<li>Selectivity</li>
</ol>
<p>To meet the criteria:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Many academy grads have gone onto great things (Nobel Prizes, Rhodes Scholars, U.S. Presidents, Cabinet Members, etc) The degree from an academy will take you a long way and will carry merit in most academic circles. Top 5 systems and electrical engineering programs AND both are top 20 LAC's.</p></li>
<li><p>People know these places. Unfortunately, many people on CC see the military as negative. Many of my classmates turned down schools like Harvard, Dartmouth and Princeton to come here because we believe in a cause greater than ourselves. There is no greater prestige than defending your country and having the history of the greatest military institution on Earth to reinforce it. You need a congressional nomination!</p></li>
<li><p>Selectivity. West Point and the Naval Academy are the two toughest public schools in the country to get accepted to. Admit rate is about 14% for both schools. Their acceptance rates are lower than half the Ivy League.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>You may see that these schools may get drowned out in the discussion because many CC'ers are not applying to the academies. Fact is, they should be mentioned because the undeniable evidence is there and it's hard to refute.</p>
<p>^ Go GoNavy! I hear you!</p>
<p>Thanks UCBChem, it always seems like you're there to back me up whenever I post something like this!</p>
<p>^ That's because my grandfather went to West Point...;)</p>
<p>Part of the beauty of West Point and Annapolis is that the students that attend there are extremely committed to their institution and, for the most part, display none of the insecurities about having to "prove" their school is one of the nation's most prestigious. If you know anything about these academies, then you know this. They are fabulous, fabulous places and graduates of either are among the most grounded, most fundamentally sound, and very finest of America's young. In the professional world, I think that employers know the quality of the students, appreciate the experience that they have undergone for their time at these academies (and afterward) and would gladly rank both in the highest tier of America's colleges.</p>
<p>West Point might have a claim to be in the top 15, but I don't see Annapolis making the list.</p>
<p>Not to mention they're not even universities (see the title).</p>
<p>
[quote]
Fact is, they should be mentioned because the undeniable evidence is there and it's hard to refute.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Hmm, by that logic, I should bring up Deep Springs in every discussion of selectivity, undergrad focus, etc. But why don't I? Because the overwhelming majority of students on CC don't want to go there. It's "alternative education," as are the academies (service).</p>
<p>I'd also like to say that Chicago > Vanderbilt. semiserious has no idea what he's talking about.</p>