Transfer from community college to save money.

Parents Forum
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<p>[FinAid</a> | Other Types of Aid | College Partnerships and Articulation Agreements](<a href=“Your Guide for College Financial Aid - Finaid”>Your Guide for College Financial Aid - Finaid)</p>

<p>If you scroll down the page, it has a relatively comprehensive list of articulation agreement, by state, though it is not fully comprehensive, as states are moving in this direction very rapidly, now, and all students should find out which schools are currently involved. I can see, at least, that the Illinois list is very imcomplete.</p>

<p>However, there isn’t one state not listed.</p>

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<p>giterdone–our kids won’t graduate early, some kids do, but most don’t. What the dual classes allow for is “easy” double majoring for most kids. The Spanish example above, friend of our kids’ is at S’s #1 choice, she was able to test into the junior year Spanish classes there and by the end of her Sophomore year (this year) will have completed the requirements for a second major in Spanish to go along with her math major, at no extra cost and will graduate in 4 years. It’s a great plan and DS is planning on doing the same.</p>

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<p>poetgrl–our kids are not looking at state schools in our state, mostly private schools in our state and in other states. I don’t understand what you are missing in this discussion. Please tell me one good reason kids in our state should take CC classes vs the University classes??</p>

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<p>SteveMA-the classes you describe would not get credit at DS school, but a lowly CC class would. No matter how amazing the professor, because it is taught at the hs setting with only other hs students, it wouldn’t get credit. It sounds like the clsses are worthwhile themselves, but I think it is a bit short-sighted for a state to put all that money into the hs system unless a large portion of students in your state go though the state system (which I don’t think is the case). A good CC system would open up these courses to those in your state that didn’t have it all together at 16.</p>

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<p>SteveMA, while I always enjoy the opportunity to discuss the children of individual posters on CC with them, your kids aren’t really the topic of this thread.</p>

<p>Nor are mine, in fact.</p>

<p>The community college systems are the topic. why your kids would do what they would do, or what they do, finally do, is not really the topic here. This seems to be what YOU are missing.</p>

<p>But thank you for the anectdotal argument: sample of one family.</p>

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<p>"Merit money conversations don’t apply here. With the state tightening up funding to the bare essentials? there is only “need based” aid of any consequence… and that is "</p>

<p>-Big surpize to me. Merits are preety much alive in our state and of course privates are awesome, you can get it really cheap at some great schools in our state, both public and private. Most of them are coming from private donations though, have nothing to do with state taxpayers’ money. Our state is in such shambles economically, probably one of the worst in the country. Maybe you did not check closer. It is worthwhile to check. Not all CC classes will OK with whatever future plan after graduating from UG.</p>

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<p>@SteveMA - I can tell one; if your kids are NOT taking the dual enrollment courses to satisfy progress on their 4 year track? and the only advantage is a double major? then the CC route, in most states, allow you to satisfy the fresh and soph more req’s at 1/3rd the cost of the state flagship U, any satellite, and a growing list of privates. That is the real, tangible benefit.</p>

<p>@MiamiDAP; We did check, and apply actually - My 33 ACT, 4.0 gpa DD didn’t receive one iota of merit money. But like I said, our state flagship is almost half the cost to attend, as other BIG 10 schools, so that’s what they cling to.</p>

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<p>Yes, Miami, Ohio has a very bad community college system. This is kind of shocking, given the blue collar nature of the state and the way all of the cities are just dying. Investing in a community college system would be an excellent start to turning around a rust-belt state, as Pennsylvania has found out with their gaurantee of admittance to a four year state school for anyone with an AA or AS from a CC.</p>

<p>From my link:</p>

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<p>So, while it is not state-wide, as it is in the best states, this is much better than it was in your state, and getting better, which is excellent given the demographics ohio has. So, that’s progress.</p>

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<p>Let me add my .02 cents as the parent of S1 who went this route. I wouldn’t recommend it for everyone - my S2 is going the 4-yr route - but it worked well for S1. We live in NoVa, which is known for good academics & challenging HS curriculums. There is also an articulation agreement between the CCs and the 4-yr universities. My S1 took full advantage of this articulation agreement & transferred to our state flagship, where he graduated in 2010. </p>

<p>All of his CC credits conveyed & he entered the university as a junior. He graduated in 2 years, on time, with his 2006 HS cohort.</p>

<p>As noted earlier, there are advantages to this route, which more & more kids from uber-competitive HSs in NoVa are taking advantage:</p>

<p>1) There is still money left in our college savings for S1 to attend grad school. Right now he is working in his field, but eventually he will need to attend grad school to remain competitive. There is still money earmarked for his education.</p>

<p>2) The maturity factor: S1 had mediocre grades & SATs in HS & would not have been competitive for our state flagship out of HS. CC allowed him a chance to mature & succeed. He had instructors who previously taught at Ivies or held positions in the government. He learned how to efficiently manage his time while going to CC and working part-time at Big Bucks coffee. He succeeded in his grades - went from being a ‘C’ student to an ‘A’ student & graduated from CC with a 3.6 gpa. (He is a smart kid who is also a ‘late bloomer.’)</p>

<p>3) Along the same lines, S1 also commented that students who transferred from CC to the university tended to be more mature, having had to balance work & college & perhaps help support their family.</p>

<p>Now, someone upthread asked about the disadvantages of going the CC route. Here are a few that S1 experienced:</p>

<p>1) Catching up with his cohort: it’s hard to transfer into a university where students have already bonded & been together for 2 years, especially for a kid who is very shy. He missed out on 2 yrs of the 4-yr experience.</p>

<p>2) Declaring a major: he entered as a junior & immediately had to declare a major. Fortunately he already had a good sense of what he wanted to do. But for some kids transferring from CC to a 4-yr school, declaring a major is not always a clear path.</p>

<p>3) Letters of recommendation: S1 initially wanted to apply to a 5-yr Master’s program in Public Policy. The application deadline was February. He had only been on campus 1 semester & was not well-enough acquainted with the university professors to ask for LORs. Nor were they familiar enough with his work to write them. Asking his CC professors for LORs did not carry the same weight as LORs from the same institution within which he was applying for the Master’s program. He ended up not applying.</p>

<p>4) Lack of merit aid.</p>

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<p>For the record, you need to have financial need to be eligible for this scholarship, and you also need to be nominated by the JKCF faculty rep at the CC to even be considered. At my CC, in order to be nominated you need at least a 3.5-- participation in PTK preferred, have at least 30 college credits, plan on transferring to a “selective university” and plan to enroll fulltime, and you must have unmet financial need. It’s only partly a merit scholarship and it is exceptionally difficult to even be considered for it even if you meet the qualifications. At my CC, I was in competition with at least a hundred other individuals just for the nomination needed to be considered, and financial need is a huge factor. At my CC in particular, this and the PTK scholarships that are available at SOME universities were more or less the only scholarship opportunities offered at all for students hoping to transfer, the exception of course being scholarships offered by the transfer university itself-- but those are not any more prevalent.</p>

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<p>poetgrl–when I said “our kids” I meant kids in our state in general, not specifically my kids.</p>

<p>MizzBee–these courses come out on a university transcript for transferring to various schools. We have had no issues what so ever getting classes to transfer to schools that accept community college credits. These classes show up like they took the classes on the campus (which is an option and some kids do that). S’s #1 choice, a highly selective LAC, in the info session said that they do not accept any dual enrollment credits from any state. When we questioned her further about our state’s program during the interview, she said we were the one exception because they use the university program not the CC program. The kids are looking at 2 state schools out of state, they both accept those credits and give AP credit (not just placement). The other private schools we are looking at a few of them will give placement, just like they do for AP’s, one school will transfer the credits in non-major areas (but for a second major will give credit). It’s confusing, I have a spreadsheet to keep track of it but basically, if a college accepts CC credits or AP for credit they take these credits. There are thousands of kids that have graduated from high school with these credits and no issues.</p>

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<p>giterdone–the state university system does take these credits, they transfer over just fine at any state school and for kids that choose that route, they “start college” as a junior if they have taken all dual classes as a junior and senior, for free so at 1/2 the cost–and better since they don’t pay for books either. For OUR kids personally, they are not looking at state schools in our state and that is where the double major comes into play.</p>

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<p>SteveMA wrote:

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<p>SteveMa wrote:</p>

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<p>What??? Do you even know what you are saying?</p>

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<p>poetgrl–look at post #43</p>

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<p>Your post #43</p>

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<p>As I said, upthread, you are talking about YOUR kids as if they are ALL kids. They aren’t.</p>

<p>My kids will not be attending community college, either. But, what the heck does that have to do with this thread?</p>

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<p>Well, poetgrl, this thread is about going to a community college to save money and I relayed how our state runs this program and how it saves kids millions (I think almost 3 million last year for the kids that went to our state schools alone). It’s very relevant. You took off on that stating how pathetic our CC system is and how we should conform to what you think is a good system and I simply asked for one good reason why kids in our state should go to the CC vs what they are doing now?</p>

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<p>Even though it is waaay off topic, I’m just really curious -</p>

<p>SteveMA: Do all kids at all public high schools in your state have access to these university classes? Are they at every HS? Does every student qualify? Are they available only to those with certain prerequisites or GPAs?</p>

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<p>alh–yes, “all” kids have access to these classes. There are classes taught at the state universities as well. Not all schools have the classes in the high school, many do though. It’s more of a matter of having a professor willing to teach in the school. We just happen to have a few that live near us and it works. Prerequisites are that they have to be B students or better and in “good standing” with the school. For the math classes, they would have had to had the underlying math classes, for example, which makes sense. It’s nice for some of the smaller districts that can’t offer extensive class offerings and can then offer, say multi-variable Calculus at the college level. The kids can take any University class on campus for free, transferring those credits depends on the accepting college/university though. Only the core classes count as dual enrollment though. These classes are available to all students in the state, public, private and homeschooled. It is really the same as any other state that offers dual enrollment, just that the program is through the university vs the CC system.</p>

<p>For kids that want to go the tech/CC route, they can take their core classes at the high school and then go to the CC for the “tech” classes. Some kids do this and end up with their certification/AA/whatever by the time they graduate–for free.</p>

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<p>I know at least one private that would give a ton of Merit for such awesome stats as your D’s. Did you check Case? I am sure there are many more that would cover close to tuition or whole tuition for 33/4.0. Sorry for being repetitive, but it is a shame not to get anything for such a hard work.</p>

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<p>Oh, I’m sorry I wasn’t clear. We are extremely happy with DD’s choice and she received much merit aid from an instate private that brought costs inside of what any of our instate public options would have been.</p>

<p>We aren’t CC candidates for DD’12, but I am a proponent and will advocate its merits, in due time, for DS’15.</p>