Transferring from Yale, in an atypical manner

Transfer Students
1

<p>Hello, all. It's been ages since I've used my account on College Confidential -- definitely has been amusing re-reading the posts and the worries of my past self. Anyways, I've returned to ask for the advice and (hopefully) to hear from the diverse perspectives of the denizens of CC. </p>

<p>I just finished my third semester at Yale and should be entering the second half of my sophomore year in two weeks or so. (Un)fortunately, I will not be doing so, as I am taking a semester off. Long story short -- I've abused alcohol and drugs over the past six or seven years, and this last semester was just the tipping point. I ended up spending a surreal week in the psych ward at Yale and haven been forced to take a semester off -- forced seems to be the wrong word, as I willingly obliged... but it was the university's decision, ultimately. </p>

<p>I'm trying to pick up the pieces of my life. For all of the ways that I have effed it up, it's not completely ruined, fortunately. I have been sober for three weeks now, which is the longest period of sobriety I've experienced since I was 13. I feel much more stable and clear-headed, so that's a plus. I'm also seeing a psychologist on a regular basis. (On a somewhat unrelated note, if anyone is going through anything like this and wants to talk, please do not hesitate to send me a message. I am certainly not an expert, but I do have my own experiences, which have to be worth something.) </p>

<p>Officially, I am taking a semester-long medical leave from Yale, during which time I am recommended to do something productive, reflect, etc. In order to return to Yale, I must take two courses at a different university and earn a B or higher in both of them. Then, some committee will review my re-application materials and issue a decision. </p>

<p>Over the past few years (I was accepted in '10 and then deferred for a year), I have alternated between loving and hating Yale, wanting to attend and wanting to leave and never come back. It truly has been a bad romance. I think the fact that these thoughts of wanting to leave Yale have persisted for so long indicates that maybe it isn't the right place for me. It is a wonderful environment for some people, but I just don't think it's best for me. I think I could be happy there to some degree, but I think I would be happiest elsewhere. (I do realize that, despite the messiness of the past few months -- perhaps even the past few years, this is a good dilemma to have.)</p>

<p>I'm interested in transferring to Columbia. I'll also most likely fill out an application to Penn, as one of my parents works there, and I could probably attend for a minimal cost. I'm also considering applying to school abroad, so if anyone has any information on universities in England or Ireland, I'd love to hear. </p>

<p>For practical purposes, here is a Sparknotes version of what my transfer application would look like: </p>

<p>Yale GPA: 3.55ish, I think, still waiting for the rest of this term's grades. (I've really exerted a minimal effort in my coursework over the past two years, for which I am kicking myself at the moment.)
Leadership position on the Spring Fling Committee, Associate Editor of a publication, writer for one of the newspapers, writer for a cultural magazine affiliated with the school, student manager in one of the dining halls, volunteer for a sustainability initiative.</p>

<p>HS: 3.9ish GPA at a private, competitive high school in a major city. 2310 on SATs, seven 5s and one 4 on APs (d'oh), 770 and 770 on SAT IIs, national recognition in a history competition a few times, captain of a team, some school-wide awards, class president, blah, blah, blah. </p>

<p>I'd love to be in NY, attend Columbia, and start anew, but I'm worried about the downward trend from high school to college. As many transfer applicants have stellar GPAs, will my mediocre GPA negatively affect my application? (I'm aware that 3.5ish isn't terrible, but Yale is known for its grade inflation. Informally, the general consensus is that the average GPA hovers around a 3.7. I don't think the university releases this information, but still.) </p>

<p>I could type paragraphs upon paragraphs about my situation and my dilemma and my problems, yada yada yada. What it comes down to is this: I am considering transferring from Yale, but I only have 1.5 semesters under my belt. I will not be taking courses during the spring semester, but I would like to go through the transfer process during this time. I plan to be completely forthcoming with my situation in my essays (I don't see how it could hurt me, really). Has anyone else done something similar to this? Does anyone have any anecdotes, suggestions, etc?</p>

<p>I apologize for the lack of structure and general scatterbrained nature of this post. It's pretty laughable that I consider myself a writer!</p>

<p>Thanks in advance for the help, and I hope everyone is having a lovely end of the year.</p>

2

<p>Columbia says it wants a 3.5, and that they wouldn’t look at your spring semester grades anyhow. The issue I think you’ll have is with the Statement of Good Standing (<a href=“https://www.commonapp.org/CommonApp/Docs/DownloadForms/2013/2013CollegeOfficialsReport_download.pdf[/url]”>https://www.commonapp.org/CommonApp/Docs/DownloadForms/2013/2013CollegeOfficialsReport_download.pdf&lt;/a&gt;). If you’ve had any interaction with the Master of your College, that’s probably the best person to fill it out - and they’ll be able to tell you what the answers would be.</p>

<p>Columbia’s only got a 5.6% transfer rate, though, so have a backup plan.</p>

3

<p>You are the reason why most people trying to transfer have little to no chance at top 14 colleges. Even with a 3.55 GPA at grade-inflated Yale, you have a good chance to transfer anywhere except Harvard, Princeton, Dartmouth, Duke, and all the other “do not apply” colleges. Current university prestige is a damn huge factor in transfer applications. You are more competitive than a perfect student from a college ranked below 25.</p>

<p>And yes, your life is still fine. Taking a semester off could be a good and necessary experience.</p>

4

<p>Hm, I see. Sorry for being that guy – i.e., “the reason.” </p>

<p>I appreciate the response and all of the time, effort, and thought you’ve put into demystifying the whole transfer process – I saw your thread about transfer admission rates at top universities. Enlightening, both the figures and the analysis. Do you know how many of the top 25 schools aren’t need-blind in their transfer processes? </p>

<p>Additionally, why do you think schools emphasize prestige over college performance in the transfer process? For advertising purposes? What’s attractive about an applicant that has ostensibly peaked in high school? I’m not being facetious – I’d like to hear your thoughts. Like I said before, you seem to have thought about this at length, and I’m interested in hearing any more reflections that you might have.</p>

5

<p>It’s difficult to tell how qualified sometransfer is to say that (likely he is not at all). </p>

<p>This is what Michele Hernandez, a former Dartmouth admissions officer has to say:</p>

<p>“To generalize, most of the transfer admits **do not ** come from other Ivy League schools. I was always pleasantly surprised by the wide variety of colleges from which Dartmouth accepted applicants. Here’s a sampling of some of the schools from which Dartmouth accepted transfer students: Bostun University, Broward CC, NYU, Ohio State, Penn State, Rockland Community College, UTexas Austin, [etc.]”</p>

<p>Good luck, and I applaud you for making efforts to turn your life around.</p>

6

<p>Fair point. He is, however, probably more qualified than I am, since I know nearly nothing about the process. </p>

<p>The quote you’ve provided is pretty interesting… but how many students are applying from other Ivies vs. non-Ivies? It does not surprise me that >50% of transfers are from non-Ivies. That would be a little ridonk. But what percentage from Ivies are we talking about here? 30% from Ivies? 20% from Ivies? 10%? 5%? </p>

<p>Thanks for the input, though. I guess when it comes down to it, I don’t really know what I want – maybe I’ll end up taking over one semester off.</p>

7

<p>I just want to make sure that there is no misinformation. Perhaps he has studied the Ivy League transfer process extensively, but without knowing his sources it is better to trust verified ones. Hernandez also stated that they do not want too many Ivy League transfers admitted because they want a diverse group of transfer students.</p>

<p>Yale is one of the places I am applying to for transfer. I am not expecting much, but getting accepted to Yale would probably be the best thing to happen in my life at this point.</p>

<p>I definitely agree that you should take one semester off, but you’ll have to decide what is best for you after that.</p>

8

<p>I transferred into a top 20 college last year, however I do not believe I would be more qualified to give advice than any other transfer student who applied to them. Even so, the verified sources you speak of like to manipulate words and statistics to encourage all students to apply in order to gather as many application fees as possible. By the end of my mammoth post, I hope to raise a greater appreciation for the complexity of the transfer process.</p>

<p>I think I overstated my words earlier and got misinterpreted. Although transfers coming from top 20 universities make the application pool much more competitive, the vast majority of transfer students come from colleges ranked below 20. I was trying to show you how much of a competitive edge you have over said majority.</p>

<p>My objective in posting here is to guide potential transfer applicants to get into the best colleges they can. To do so, I simplify a lot of concepts about college admissions. However, Dartmouth lies in the “do not apply” tier of colleges, where the chances are too low for admission to be reasonable. Each of these colleges have to be examined on a case-by-case basis.</p>

<p>Athletic transfers. [One</a> such transfer moved from Clemson University to Dartmouth.](<a href=“http://thedartmouth.com/2011/05/27/sports/anthony"]One”>http://thedartmouth.com/2011/05/27/sports/anthony) Clemson is a school less known for their academics and more known for their athletics, I would argue. Then, I would suggest some of the transfers from lower-ranked schools are accepted for their athletic merit, and account for some of the schools the Dartmouth representative listed. Indeed, you will see Clemson on [Dartmouth’s</a> sampling of colleges](<a href=“http://www.dartmouth.edu/admissions/facts/admissions.html]Dartmouth’s”>http://www.dartmouth.edu/admissions/facts/admissions.html), along with Cornell, Rice, Williams, Middlebury, Berkeley, and Lehigh. Just one is an Ivy League but the others are rather prestigious as well. We are talking about one applicant here, but Dartmouth accepted just 30. Indeed, there are lower-ranked colleges there as well. Athletic transfers have to be less than everyone accepted, so some more analysis is needed.</p>

<p>Prestige is multi-dimensional. Here is a key difference between high school and college. Certain universities may be ranked low overall, but be ranked very high in a particular field or major. Take UT Austin, as your example, ranked 46 on USNews but 25 by ARWU and 1 in accounting and petroleum engineering. Someone majoring in accounting at UT Austin with a 4.0 would be super competitive at all accounting programs, except for schools like Dartmouth where admission is almost impossible.</p>

<p>Needed diversity. Here is where my argument becomes based in conjecture rather than evidence. How would having everyone accepted coming from colleges like Cornell and Williams look on the transfer website? Then no one from any college ranked below 50 would even bother trying, and Dartmouth would lose out on all the potential application fees. Therefore, as a means of bringing hope to prospective transfers, they throw in some community college students, in addition to the ones who would have been accepted from top 20 or 30 colleges. On their website, Dartmouth states 38.8% of 2012 transfers had a perfect 4.0, while 22.2% of applicants had less than a 3.6 GPA. Again, nobody would apply after seeing more than half of the applicant pool having a 4.0. This is by far my weakest and most preposterous argument, but I believe in what I say. Transfer students are meant to fill voids. For need-blind schools like Dartmouth, they might seek racial diversity to compliment their majority white student body, or diversity of majors to balance their many liberal arts students. And they can take as many as they want from community colleges.</p>

<p>And then there are the reasons unknown to me. Why Dartmouth hates taking students from other Ivy Leagues is outside of my knowledge. However, at colleges with double-digit transfer acceptance rates, you can be sure coming from a top 20 school adds a massive competitive edge.</p>

9

<p>My best advice would be for you to concentrate on developing the skills needed to maintain your sobriety. Don’t take any academic coursework just yet. Allow yourself at least a semester worth of time off from schoolwork. Then, next fall (at the earliest) enroll in those two classes Yale requires of you. Do it at your local community college, or as a “visiting student” or “non-degree student” at a cheap public U. When Yale lifts its restrictions on your re-enrollment, you will be considered to be in good standing. That is the time you will be able to begin to apply for transfer. If you have used your year or so off from Yale well, you will be sober and you will know if you do indeed want to return to Yale.</p>

<p>Wishing you all the best.</p>