@PurpleTitan - Thank you very much.
Yes, we are very serious about Canada / UK. Oxbridge is a dream, but LSE (London School of Economics), McGill or St. Andrew’s looks like valuable choices.
<“Have you seen those Ivy-students during the last year protests?”
Protests happen at schools across the selectivity spectrum, not just Ivies. >
Of course, I agree. I certainly understand why people protest in Ferguson / Baltimore. However, I was expecting more from Ivy students … at least in terms of intellectual self-expression.
I’ve found book smarts and emotional maturity often don’t go hand in hand.
@californiaaa, just keep in mind that LSE would still be tough and not a sure thing even with a bunch of 5’s.
May want to add Edinburgh, Toronto, and UBC (and Waterloo if the interest is CS) to the list as well. None except Waterloo are as cheap as McGill, though. And you probably know that while the Canadian unis offer about as much flexibility as American flagships, in the English unis, you’re restricted to taking the courses in your field(s) of study (and the Scottish unis are only slightly more flexible).
<can you="" offer="" us="" top="" sat="" scores?="" can="" ethnic="" diversity?="" money,="" either="" through="" full-pay="" tuition="" or="" substantial="" donations?="" what="" are="" going="" to="" do="" help="" curate="" the="" image="" of="" this="" university?="">
Exactly. It is so sad. Maybe i am naive, but I thought that universities shall be interested in education of the brightest and most enthusiastic kids. Nurture students that will be the future Profs. at these universities and keep the traditions.
Like Hogwarts. Imagine that on the first day, the Sorting Hat asks “Can you offer us top scores? Can you offer us ethnic diversity? Can you offer us money, either through full-pay tuition or substantial donations? What are you going to do to help curate the image of Hogwarts?”
Well, Draco Malfoy was definitely a legacy. 
It has to be a good thread when I will read through 5 pages of posts and feel disappointed when the posts end. There’s always tomorrow!
Let me add my thanks to @Lindagaf for posting this thread. While going through the admissions process for my older daughter this year, I had independently come to much the same conclusions but its great to see it all spelled out so clearly. This is definitely going to shape my thinking next year when my younger daughter gets into high school.
Yes @Lindagaf you hit the nail on the head! This thread should be required reading on CC.
You know what’s cracking me up? I reposted this over in the college admissions page, for students to read, and no comments! I will bump it later, because the kids need a reality check:-)
Yes.
Magnet programs are very educational in this way. They show both parents and students that there are many other equally qualified students out there.
As well as the TIP program and the others, where SATs are given in MS.
@CT1417 , I tried using Naviance, but in our school Naviance will only show scattergrams for schools that many students have applied to, for privacy reasons. And most of the colleges my D applied to had few or no other applicants. I relied on the website college data and college niche as well as others to see how her stats compared.
We paid attention to this advice when my youngest was applying. She did not want to go to an Ivy, but top LACs, so she applied widely. She was a typical excellent student, good grades, ECs, and test scores, was accepted to all 6 of the schools on prezbucky’s list in post #21 to which she applied, plus Northwestern and U Chicago. I can only attribute her results to her essay and recommendations. She had a few admissions directors write notes on her acceptance letters, one said ‘Come here!’ another said he loved her essay. For a couple of these schools she was the first applicant ever from her HS, some others had never accepted any of the few who had applied before.
So while it is difficult, it is not impossible for unhooked excellent students to be accepted. She had match schools and an early admit to her safety, so while it is good to be realistic, I wouldn’t discourage some reach applications either.
Note: was working on this when @mamabear1234 posted very similar sentiments.
I endorse @Lindagaf’s message almost entirely, but want to also offer that you don’t want to swing so far toward staying “realistic” that you stray all the way into defeatism. I entirely agree that there’s two important budgets that you want to spend wisely and not burn too much on reaches: time/money spent on visits, and time/money spent on apps. But depending upon how strong a particular kid’s resume is, I want to push back a little on the notion that it’s virtually impossible for unhooked kids from over-represented demographics to get into elite schools (depending, perhaps, upon one’s definition of elite).
If an unhooked kid’s stats put them in or near the top quartile at a selective school, I think it’s perfectly reasonable to give them a shot. It’s still imperative to spend a hefty portion of the aforementioned budgets on schools were the odds are even more in your kid’s favor, but even at some pretty darned selective schools hookless does not equal hopeless. I think perhaps the most important thing is just to try to manage expectations - merely being above the 50th percentile mark does not make admission to a highly selective school anything close to probable.
My D, an unhooked, white, female, New England prep school kid (NOT a favorable demographic), did get flat-out rejected from Stanford and waitlisted at Williams. But she also got into several of the LACs on the list in post #21, as well as Olin (where she is now). It can be done.
I actually look at your journey, @Lindagaf, and find little to find fault with. You came up with a balanced list, and despite some disappointments, have an admirable collection of admissions to choose from. The fact that your D got into places like Kenyon that are just a smidge below some of her dream schools in selectivity means she was probably close. It was worth a shot! I always try to remember that just because a particular decision doesn’t lead to the desired outcome doesn’t mean it was a bad decision. It’s heart-wrenching to see your kid disappointed, but that doesn’t mean you did something wrong.
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@rayrick , absolutely! Every kid must have reaches. But what many “novice” parents don’t understand is what I failed to understand: on paper, my kid had decent stats, even for Brown, and we knew it was super selective, but we didn’t know all the other stuff. I really wish I had read my own advice before I took her to see Brown on our first ever college tour. I also took her to visit several other colleges she had no chance of getting into. Those visits were really a waste of time and money, but at least they were mostly all combined with visits to match and safety schools too. And of course, we were able to visit most of the schools she applied to, so she knew she liked them. She really is not upset. When March 31 rolled around, she knew, 100%, she wouldn’t get in to the two dream schools, and was indeed far more disappointed with not getting into the “realistic” reaches.
I am still thanking my lucky stars that D fell in love with a “match” school, applied ED, and received merit aid that made it surprisingly affordable. Especially because a death in the family would have made preparing RD applications all but impossible for her.
But, without all those visits and all that comparing of programs and lurking on CC for years, she never would have found that school or made some seemingly contrary decisions that actually worked for her. (Her decision to apply ED at Rochester instead of Brown because she liked Rochester better was a shocker for me! But with about a month to go until the end of her freshman year, she still feels she made the right decision.)
Not every kid. Some don’t bother applying to reach schools at all.
@Lindagaf: I concur with others that this is a really useful thread!!
About visiting schools, we started our plans to visit with a visit to our very knowledgeable school college counselor. She helped us with realistic lists. All of our visits included a variety of schools, she had ideas of reaches that my kids would have more of a chance of acceptance than others.
I saw your D’s list of acceptances, is Whitman one of the favorites? One of the val’s from my kid’s school a few years ago, super smart talented girl with lots of options chose Whitman and I heard a whole spiel from the mom about what a great place it is. The girl has since graduated, had a fantastic experience. I was just curious what your D thought about it.
@Lindagaf - A very good thread with lots of great advice. Our D’s sound very similar. Mine is going to wind up at a top 15 school and is very happy, but did not get into any of the 3 Ivies she applied to. I admit that I think I was naive in thinking she had a chance. She had very high grades (no B’s at all on her transcript at a well-regarded private school in a large urban area); and SATs above 2300. Some awards, but nothing particularly spectacular, decent but not a ton of ECs and very little community service. She has always had amazing teacher comments (I have other kids so I know these were different) - class leader, great thinker, etc. I think these clouded my judgment in what was capable. She wound up with excellent results (also got in early on to Rochester with good money); her list was good. Her counselor said she would get a “hard look” at all top schools but no guarantees of admission. I think she’s going to exactly the right place for her and it will be fantastic. But, yesterday, she admitted that - because she’s very competitive - she feels a tingle of regret that she worked so hard, did so well and yet other kids who don’t have the grades and scores she has are either going to the same school or got into slightly higher ranked ones. I know this is ridiculous, but it’s what she feels.