They did away with AP’s in his Senior year and, before that, didn’t offer many. He is taking college level in high school courses (3) and he can take the AP for credit at the end of the year, but they aren’t called AP courses anymore. In terms of rank, the school doesn’t weight the rank. If they did, he was told he would be in the top 5 of his class. It is noted as unweighted on his transcript, so I’m hoping that helps.
He is musically very strong. He has scored 100’s on the top level for both vocal and percussion NYSSMA solos. He plays in bands in school and chorus and performs in two bands outside of school. He produced and released an album with one of the bands. He played a lead role in the school musical last year, and designed the artwork for the brochure for the musical. His life has pretty much revolved around music and the arts.
I would look at Hobart and William Smith and Muhlenberg as possible safeties.
@nextstepcollege Probably not for visits, but if you are looking for solid match schools where strong music talent might translate into an admissions bump/merit scholarship consideration, he may want to consider some of the PA/midwestern LACs: St Olaf (MN) and College of Wooster (OH), and possibly Lawrence (WI) offer music scholarships as well academic merit scholarships. Dickinson, Muhlenberg, and Denison seemed to appreciate depth in performing arts when we were looking at schools a few years back.
Finally, he might want to consider Oberlin, which has both the Conservatory and the College. Music performance opportunities are opening up more to students in the College if he doesn’t want to go the conservatory route. It’s also possible to pursue a dual degree. The quality and variety of live music that is performed on a nearly daily basis (for free or nominal cost) is amazing.
Thank you for the suggestion. He has applied to New Paltz, UB, Albany and Binghamton. Geneseo would have been a good fit, but they don’t offer computer science, and right now he’s leaning towards a major in Music and CS. He has considered Hobart and William Smith. He has also applied to Ithaca and Oberlin and we are visiting Ursinus in December. The problem is, his father and I are divorced, but co-parent 100%. He gave me the NCP info for CSS no problem. I’m fortunate that our situation is amicable and we both support his higher education pursuits. That said, his step-father and I are more realistic and also want DS to be at a school that isn’t super competitive. His class in high school has always been competitive academically. I was actually hoping for DS to get away from that environment. I want him to be challenged academically, but also be able to relax and enjoy the next four years. We initially took him to Colgate, Hamilton, Vassar and Cornell, and planned to take him to Hobart & William Smith and some others as safeties. I’d love to see him at a small, private school that is very civic oriented, because that is what he is all about, but also offers excellent opportunities in the arts and job placement after he graduates. Well, his father insisted he apply to every Ivy League school. Why, I have no idea! DS obliged, but it was a lot of work. DS doesn’t regret it and said he knows it’s unlikely odds, but didn’t want to disappoint his dad and, I suppose you never know. I would be thrilled if he gets into an Ivy League school or Little Ivy, but honestly, I just want him to find a small school that’s a good fit for his personality—where he can pursue his talent and major in something else of interest.
He has applied to Oberlin and is visiting that one with his father. I wanted him look at St. Olaf, but he didn’t want to go that far away to school. I will take a better look at the other schools you mentioned. Thank you!! Do you think a trip to New England wouldn’t be worthwhile and we should instead focus on PA and Ohio? I was under the impression for him to have any chance at Connecticut College or Bates, we really needed to show interest. I would agree that the others are reaches and possibly Bates as well, but I thought he had a strong chance of getting accepted to Connecticut College. I certainly don’t want to waste the three days we have to look at schools.
Wait, wait, wait…he has ALREADY applied to 3 SUNYs, 8 Ivies, Oberlin, Ithaca, and Bard = 14 schools? And he is also planning to apply to at least some schools from among Colgate, Hamilton, Vassar, Haverford, Ursinus, Skidmore, Williams, Bates, Tufts? So he’s going to apply to 20 or so schools?
My daughter’s school caps the number of apps at 12, so I am having a little bit of a hard time wrapping my mind around the idea of 20+ applications when ultimately, he can only attend one college.
Given that he has already applied to so many schools…why are you chasing off to Maine to visit Bates? He already has plenty of reach schools on his list, and I thought the conventional wisdom was that no more than 1/3 of a student’s list should be reaches. If he is going to add to his list, I would focus on those match schools like Skidmore. (I love Skidmore. We went back for a second visit and saw their production of Cabaret. It was great! And its dining hall is one of the best we visited. My daughter–who has similar academic stats, and is only planning to apply to 8-9 schools–has Skidmore on her list.)
He applied to Bates as well. Yes. I know. The whole thing has been completely crazy. He did not apply to every Ivy. He applied to 5. That said, there were really only one or two I felt he should apply to and that he wanted to apply to. He hasn’t even applied to Ursinus yet, but our Guidance Counselor suggested it because she feels strongly it gives him a much needed safety option that he is currently lacking. His step-father and I would have been fine with him applying ED to Vassar, Colgate or Hamilton, even Cornell, but his father is convinced he can do better and that we should wait and compare options, although he would be ok with him going to any of the first four we visited. Perhaps 20 years ago that might have been true. I had him apply EA to several of the SUNY’s because his dad encouraged him to apply EA to Yale, and I want him to be receiving some good news at the time he is likely to get a rejection from Yale.
We left our house at 5:30 this morning band are on our way to Skidmore for a campus tour. I am hoping DS likes it, and suspect he may. I will say that he spent a lot of time on every application and tailored all of his essays. He finished them this summer.
In your first post you described your S as lacking rigor and rank, but in subsequent posts after you describe the AP and ranking situation at his school it seems like his rigor and rank are actually strong. I think that’s what throwing some posters off. So if the high school has a good reputation then he should be fine in those areas. I agree Bates is a reach because in the past couple years the admit rate has gotten very low, but it is a reasonable reach. I would keep that one as they have a very holistic approach to admissions. You mention Holy Cross. They are big on interest, so a visit there is much more worthwhile than say a visit to Willams where they don’t track. And if you can’t visit Bates or HC perhaps your son can email a rep.
Thank you for this response and feedback. The school does have a good reputation and graduates do attend Ivy League and Little Ivies. The 2019 Valedictorian is currently attending Columbia. I guess I’m struggling with wanting to visit Bates, Connecticut College, and maybe Wesleyan and Holy Cross, but also really wanting to get him to Philadelphia to visit Haverford and Ursinus (one clear safety and one reach). I feel like Williams, Brown, and Dartmouth were possible visits based more on location and the fact that we would be in the area already for the other schools, which perhaps isn’t the best use of our time?
The rank and rigor I struggle with simply because of the recent changes to AP course offerings and the unweighted rank. I was assured by his counselor that most schools will unweight the rank first anyway so that they can better compare students from different schools. i certainly hope she is right. It is frustrating that we have encouraged him to challenge himself and take harder courses, and yet he has classmates higher in rank because they have taken easier classes.
Has he considered Muhlenberg? Has a creative, artsy vibe. Would be a safety and he’d likely get merit. Did you look at Rochester? Not a safety but very flexible curriculum and excellent music. Ursinus is a safety but it’s nice to have more than one option come April should all the reaches not come through.
I’d say that liberal arts colleges work best for students who are decisive in their preference for an undergraduate-focused environment. Your son’s father may also be recommending colleges based on limited statistical information. At Hamilton, for example, the middle-range SAT for accepted students extends from 1450 to 1530 (1410-1510 for attending). Note as well that Hamilton’s acceptance rate for students applying from the top 10% of their high school classes registers at only 17% (19% for unranked). Fortunately, however, your son’s ACT score along with other important aspects place him within range for the school.
I agree, and would much prefer DS attend an undergraduate college where he isn’t sitting in a large lecture class and then later meeting with a Graduate student (TA) for clarification. I have stressed that to DS, and his preference really is with a small college rather than a University. His dad wanted him to apply to the University of Michigan Ann Arbor where there is 30k students. So, I think he is just not understanding where we are coming from at all.
I’m hoping some more school visits will help him with his college decision.
If you are headed to Skidmore today, have you considered looking at Union as well? The campuses are very close and it seems like it would be another possible safety for your son. Obviously it would be too late for a tour, but you could just walk around and check things out.
Also, I agree that if you are going to Ursinus, you should also look at Muhlenberg. They are only about an hour apart. We toured both this summer. My D preferred Ursinus but liked Muhlenberg as well. Muhlenberg definitely had more of a music/artsy vibe to me than Ursinus but that may have been because that’s what our tour guide was really passionate about. Muhlenberg seems somewhat harder to get into than Ursinus but still seems like it would be a safety for your son.
Second Union. Worth at least a short walk through. My niece went there and had a great experience. Agree that Skidmore sounds ideal, but they will fill half their class ED (as will most small LACs) so it’s by no means a safety.
Make sure you see the music building at Skidmore. Don’t leave town without that.
We were impressed that the performing arts at Skidmore are open to all, based on qualities, no particular preference to seniors. At the time. Ask how that works.
@nextstepcollege It sounds like you are already begun your trip and you are favoring schools for which demonstrated interest is important, which seems like a reasonable way of prioritizing from among your many options. As you can’t visit them all, you can also view virtual campus tours via youtube videos to get a sense of the look and feel of a given campus and its student population. As others have mentioned up thread, there are other ways to demonstrate interest - contact admissions, get on a mailing list, etc.
Your son sounds very capable and I believe he will have many choices in the Spring, given the range of schools where he already has applied. Best of luck!
Haven’t read the thread. You’re in upstate NY, so do Skidmore alone as a half day trip.
Agree re PA schools. I personally think Tufts and Bates are doable in a day, and have done similar myself. It’s only a two hour drive between the two. One in the morning, the other in the afternoon. Or Williams and Tufts in a day.
The deciding factor should be which schools consider interest. Williams does NOT consider it. As it is also a high reach, perhaps your visit should be Tufts and Bates, both of which consider interest. Bates is also a little less selective than those two schools, and definitely cares about interest.
Again, interest is more than showing up. It shows in the app, or not. Whether or not you can visit a college, that’s where you prove out. Count on WIlliams to expect the right interest in any form of Why Us.
OP is 3 hours north of Albany. 6+ hours to Bates, 2+ hours down, depending on traffic, another 4+ hours back from Boston. Through VT and NH.
Then you have to fit their tour availability. The Tufts tour times on a Sat are 10:30am and 12 noon. The tours at Bates are 9am and 11am.
We enjoyed touring colleges, always included some fun or diversion in the area. But the coordination was the worst.