U Mich or Northwestern??

Colleges and Universities A-Z University of Michigan
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<p>Hello Guys,</p>

<p>I have already been accepted to both Northwestern and U Michigan as a transfer student for Industrial Engineering! The question is, which university should I attend. Fortunately, cost is no problem, so that will not influence my decision. What I really want is to be immersed in a university that really wants to teach. I am frustrated of professors who do not care about teaching and would rather research. I also want to be surrounded by supremely intelligent students that will fuel my intellectual drive. Which university do you think that will be?</p>

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<p>I don’t know about Northwestern, but I think the IOE department here does a very good job of teaching undergrads I think. Many professors seem to really care about teaching the material rather than just doing research. Not all the departments here are like that but the IOE department is. The students aren’t all smart, it’s probably better at Northwestern in that regard, but there are definitely some smart ones if you pick your social circles to include them. There are plenty of research opportunities if you choose to do so. </p>

<p>Also, if you come here, take 310 in fall. It’s worth waiting a semester if you have to.</p>

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<p>Go for either school. Both are excellent in Industrial Engineering, although I would not expect a faculty that “really wants to teach at either”. It’s not like faculty does not care. They care a lot about students. You will definitely have caring and excellent professors at both schools, but they are primarily focused in research. That’s why they are ranked so high in your field (#2 and #7 at the undergraduate level). If what you want is a faculty that really wants to teach above all else, you should have applied to schools like Harvey Mudd, Kettering or Rose Hulman. </p>

<p>In other words, go for the school you prefer. Visit both campuses and go for fit. You cannot go wrong.</p>

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<p>Harvey Mudd and Rose Hulman don’t have Industrial Engineering.</p>

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<p>Good point Vladenschlutte.</p>

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<p>In industrial engineering Mich and Northwestern are ranked 2 and 7 according to USNWR, respectively. That being the case there’s no point in choosing one based on which is better, because the two are basically equally good. Northwestern is probably going to have smaller classes and an overal smarter student body. However, I’d imagine engineering majors at Umichigan would probably be equally as smart as engineering majors at Northwestern, so if those are the students you’re going to be around it probably doesn’t make a difference. </p>

<p>I think you should choose between them based on fit and social setting. Do you want a large public or a mid-sized private? Evansville or Ann Arbor? Near chicago or near detroit? Northwestern is also right on Lake Michigan.</p>

<p>I have a friend at Northwestern. He said it’s great but almost all the students are very smart and very ambitious, and sometimes the pressure to do well becomes overwhelming.</p>

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<p>“Northwestern is probably going to have smaller classes and an overal smarter student body.”</p>

<p>Similar courses will be of equal size. NU offers a lot of mandatory freshman seminars, and this really makes it seem as though classes at NU are much smaller, but if comparing classes of similar nature, they will be of almost equal size at both universities. Also, while NU may have the smarter overall student body, I am not sure this applies to the CoE. Regardless, at the rate Michigan’s applicant pool is growing, I am not sure how much difference there will be in the current (the one enrolling in the Fall of 2013) or future freshman classes. </p>

<p>“I think you should choose between them based on fit and social setting. Do you want a large public or a mid-sized private? Evansville or Ann Arbor? Near chicago or near detroit? Northwestern is also right on Lake Michigan.”</p>

<p>NU is in Evanston, not Evansville. And as far as college towns go, Ann Arbor is in a different class altogether. Evanston has a very suburban/residential feel, while Ann Arbor has a more urban / city feel. Evanston is essentially a quiet extension of Chicago, while Ann Arbor is a very unique and independent city on its own. </p>

<p>In many instances, the there is a definite difference between large public and mid-sized private, but Michigan is not a standard large public. It has the wealth and student demographics that resemble a private university. The main difference is size. NU has 8,500 undergrads while Michigan has 27,000 undergrads. Michigan feels smaller than it is for some reason, but you can still feel a difference in the size. However, the socioeconomic and demographic breakup of the students at both universities is very similar, as are the resources of those two universities. </p>

<p>Also while NU’s location on Lake Michigan may appear as an added plus to many, few people living in the area would view it as such. Students are on campus from early October until mid-June. During those 36 weeks, I would say temperatures are below comfort levels (under 70 degrees) for 25-30 weeks. For example, we are in late March. This week, the high in Evanston is expected to be 39 degrees, and the low at a balmy 16 degrees. This is fairly standard weather (below 60 degrees highs and below 45 degrees lows) from late November until late March. Most of October and April is also cold. You really only have May and half of June to enjoy reasonable weather (over 65 degrees highs and over 50 degrees lows).</p>

<p>“I have a friend at Northwestern. He said it’s great but almost all the students are very smart and very ambitious, and sometimes the pressure to do well becomes overwhelming.”</p>

<p>I also had many friends at NU. Engineers there are no more, or less, stressed than those at Michigan.</p>

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<p>Alexandre thanks for correcting me. I meant Evanston! :stuck_out_tongue: </p>

<p>Having been to both Ann Arbor and Evanston, I’d also like to elaborate on the difference between the two. Evanston is in close proximity to Chicago and NU students do often take advantage of that. It’s about an hour commute to Chicago on public transport, if I remember correctly. Evanston itself isn’t as lively or big as Ann Arbor, but it does have its own unique charm and there is a nice balance between students and residents. Students enjoy being in a smaller area, Evanston, but still having a big and famous city, Chicago, at their fingertips. The Northwestern campus is also is right in the middle of the dining capital of the north shore. This makes for a large array of dining options when you get sick of the dining hall food. Overal students like their environment and feel that few schools can rival Northwestern’s big 10 atmosphere and accepting, inclusive, and down to earth mentality matched with the academics of an ivie league school. </p>

<p>Across Lake Michigan and a little bit inward you have Ann Arbor. Ann Arbor is regarded as a very quintessential college town. The school is very much integrated within the community and it’s often a challenge to tell where the school ends and where the city begins. Although Ann Arbor isn’t a huge metropolis, it is big enough and there is usually plenty to do and to explore on the weekends. Students call Ann Arbor liberal, politically charged, and artsy. The closest big city to Ann Arbor is detroit, but students seldom visit. This is both because Ann Arbor in itself provides students with more than enough to do and because Detroit isn’t all that desirable. Makes sense after all - why go to detroit when you live in Ann Arbor, a perfectly nice, and lively environment?</p>

<p>As for the intelligence of the student body, as I said in my first post - While NU has a stronger overal student body, in the college of CoE specifically students at NU and U of M are going to be equally intelligent. In fact, I’d imagine engineers at any school wont differ too much in this regard- they are all smart! :P</p>

<p>Oh another difference is that Northwestern is Quarter system. Quarter systems usually allow more flexibility and versatility in your schedule, but the downside is that everything is at a much quicker pace. Also, Quarter vs semester naturally have different starting and ending dates.</p>

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<p>Berkley is to Stanford as Umichigan is to Northwestern.</p>

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<p>@Mikejohnson1342 This is not at all the case in engineering. Michigan’s engineering programs are consistently stronger than Northwestern’s and Michigan’s College of Engineering has a better reputation overall.</p>

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<p>@mikejohnson1342 In general your comparison is arguably valid, but in engineering I wouldn’t agree. In engineering overal Mich has a slight edge, and in industrial engineering the two are equal.</p>

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<p>MikeJohnson, Northwestern and Stanford are not peers. Cal and Michigan are. Your comparison does not hold water. Stanford’s peers are Harvard, Princeton and Yale. </p>

<p>Academically, Cal and Stanford are peers. It is in other ways that Stanford surpasses Cal. Much of those things that separate Cal and Stanford do not exist between Michigan and NU.</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Institutional wealth. Cal’s endowment stands at $3 billion. But Cal also receives $350 million from the state annually. A private university would require an $7 billion endowment to general $350 million of annual revenue. So Cal functions as a private university with an endowment of $10 billion, or $275,000/student. Stanford’s endowment stands at $17 billion, or $1.1 million/student. The gap is significant. Michigan’s endowment stands at $7.6 billion. When you adjust for the $280 million in state funding that the University receives annually, Michigan’s functions like a private university with an endowment of $13 billion, or $310,000/student. Northwestern’s endowment stands at $7.1 billion, or $370,000/student. The gap is not at all significant, especially when you factor in economies of scale. </p></li>
<li><p>Networking. The socioeconomic and student makeup of Cal is not as conducive for networking as those you have at Stanford. That is not the case between Michigan and NU, where both universities have very similar student demographics. </p></li>
<li><p>Stanford’s reputation is extremely strong, thanks in part to its #1 or #2 ranked departments in Business, Engineering, Law and Medicine. Only Harvard compares. Cal has a strong reputation too, but not quite at the level of Stanford. Where reputation of the schools is concerned, Michigan and NU are equally respected.</p></li>
</ol>

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<p>I’d have to disagree. I’ll just leave it at that, to save us both hours of of tireless posting only to reach an inevitable impasse anyway.</p>

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<p>^ haha how very refreshing.</p>

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<p>Nothing wrong with disagreeing Mikejohnson, but I agree that debating this issue it will not change anybody’s mind. Might as well let the OP decide on the strength of her/his own research and gut feeling.</p>

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<p>Berkeley is to Stanford as,
Michigan is to Stanford as,
N’western is to Stanford…</p>

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<p>^Not quite, in my opinion. I think Berkeley is overal a small notch above Michigan.</p>

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<p>Interesting, as I am also considering both Northwestern and Michigan.</p>

<p>I would also point out, that if you’re interested in more of a business career, Northwestern offers a degree called Industrial Engineering & Management Sciences (IEMS). It’s pretty much an IE degree with some more economics and similar business-related courses. </p>

<p>Really can’t go wrong either way. Both excellent schools for IE. Go with fit/cost.</p>

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<p>I agree with reddog about Berkeley. Berkeley is pretty much regarded as the undisputed number one public. #2 public is debatable. </p>

<p>As for Northwestern vs Umichigan I think as far as your major they are going to be equal. Like others have said, go with fit and weigh the two side by side. I’d probably go with the cheaper option. If they are the same price I would go with Northwestern just because I prefer a smaller college setting, but that’s more of personal preference than anything else. </p>

<p>I noticed you mentioned that you are looking for a smart student body that will challenge you. I think this is sort of a nonissue for you being an engineering major, as all your fellow engineering students are going to be very smart and I’d imagine the caliber of engineering students at Umich and Northwestern are very much comparable. Yes, Northwestern may have a stronger student body overal, but it wouldn’t be that dramatic of a difference anyway. </p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

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<p>You’d be surprised. It takes very little to merely pass IOE classes.</p>