<p>The violin comparison only goes so far. Revenue athletes are completely different. See: tv contract money. See: Espn. See: the reason there is pressure to have these huge leagues like b1G</p>
<p>There are many men and women making very large incomes administering, coaching, training and overseeing these kids. It’s very complicated to me, anyway. </p>
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<p>Students who need that much remediation can start at a community college, since community colleges typically offer substantial remedial courses to prepare students for actual college-level work.</p>
<p>Exactly. No one is saying they don’t deserve an education, they just don’t deserve one at UNC or whatever big D1 school.</p>
<p>The big time college sports situation is scandalous in two different ways: first of all, some athletes who are supposed to be students are not students, but IMO worse is that top athletes are making spectacularly large amounts of money for their colleges, and they aren’t getting any of it. The NCAA should just get rid of phony student-athletes, and instead football and basketball should establish minor leagues. If colleges want to own a minor league sports team, that’s OK with me, but I see no reason to pretend that professional athletes are students.</p>
<p>But @beachlover. The D1 schools do not agree with you. Or with @cardinalfang</p>
<p>Why is it that there is no path to professional football other than college football? Why can’t young men who have no interest in academics have a path to professional football? Even if you say that a young promising player is getting a valuable education, what if they don’t want an education, they just want the money? In hockey, if a player doesn’t want to go to college, they play minor league hockey until they are ready for the NHL.</p>
<p>Because the colleges want D1 football </p>
<p>And we see what comes of wanting D1 football: fraud and scandals. Time to stop pretending that athletes with an SAT-CR of less than 400 are students.</p>
<p>On the sports side, at least vacate all wins where a player was taking the false courses. And forfeit any revenue from post-season play by teams where a player taking the false courses either played in the post-season, or played in the regular season that qualified the team for the post-season.</p>
<p>On the academic side, can the faculty members who aided and abetted the fraud lose tenure?</p>
<p>Mostly the faculty members who aided and abetted the fraud did so by looking the other way. Even though I think that’s culpable negligence, it would be hard to punish the faculty members.</p>
<p>And who is going to pay for the community college? If we want to continue using the stereotype of the students who can’t read well enough to pass the SAT, they are poor and are only in college on a full ride scholarship. Not available for community college, and usually there are not dorms, tutors, mentors available for the dumb jocks like there are at 4 year colleges. There are a few community colleges with sports teams, but I’m not sure what scholarships and support is available. There are 2 year junior colleges, but not very many any more.</p>
<p>Basketball players can go right into the NBA, or play in Europe, China, etc., until they make the NBA. Baseball and hockey players can go to the minors or jr hockey. Football players don’t have many options, and not many can sit out 2-3 years, either at community college or just waiting for the NFL draft eligibility.</p>
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@CardinalF, this is what I’ve been pointing out. As long as college football is the ONLY viable path to an NFL career, these scandals will continue. But I guess revenue hungry colleges want to be the only game in town, even if academic cred gets thrown by the wayside.</p>
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<p>Are you concerned about students in general who got terrible K-12 educations? Because it sounds like you are only concerned with students who can’t read and are excellent athletes; the other students who can’t read can starve.</p>
<p>My solution is more general: excellent athletes who are uninterested in academics or are unqualified for college can play minor league sports. Young people who can’t read, but who want to learn, can get remedial education at community colleges, using Pell grants, while holding down part-time jobs. Young people who are both qualified for college level academics, and want to do college level academics, can go to four year colleges, where they can find the time to do sports if they want to.</p>
<p>Nice thought, but never gonna happen. Ever. Also,.I am concerned that students have affordable education available and have repeatedly stated on this board that state schools should be limited in.charging Pell.eligible students the amount of Pell. </p>
<p>I don’t think it’s possible for someone who has somehow been graduated from a public school but who can’t read or write to take $5600 in a Pell grant and somehow find a community college, somewhere to live, something to eat, buy books, and take remedial classes at that cc. This student didn’t learn in grade school or high school, and is somehow supposed to figure this all out in 2-3 years so he can transfer to a school on an athletic scholarship? So I don’t think the plan to just have unqualified student athletes go somewhere else for a few years until they pull themselves up to snuff will work. Rich unprepared kids can go to prep school, but poor ones just won’t be able to do it, even with a Pell grant. It often doesn’t work for well prepared poor kids using a Pell, and an unprepared one, IMO, has no hope.</p>
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<p>People do it at my local CC all the time. They live at home, get part time jobs, and take remedial courses at the CC in the hopes of getting a two-year degree, a certificate, or a transfer. Who do you think takes those remedial courses at CCs?</p>
<p>As to athletic scholarships, well, I think the promising revenue-sport athlete should be in minor league sports if they can’t hack academics. Some community college teams have sports teams, though. My local CC has a football team, mens and women’s soccer, swimming and some other sports. I believe that some football players go to CC and then transfer to San Jose State, though I can’t swear to it. Some of them intend to, I know that, because I’ve met athletes in classes I’ve taken.</p>
<p>On edit: [Junior</a> college transfer for football players is a thing](<a href=“2014 Top Football Recruits”>2014 Top Football Recruits)</p>
<p>Now I see that it’s very possible for a promising football player to do two years at community college and transfer to a four year school. </p>
<p>[Long</a> list of students who transferred](<a href=“http://www.ccsf.edu/en/educational-programs/school-and-departments/school-of-health-and-physical-education/physical-education-and-dance/athletics/football/transfers.html]Long”>http://www.ccsf.edu/en/educational-programs/school-and-departments/school-of-health-and-physical-education/physical-education-and-dance/athletics/football/transfers.html) from the Community College of San Francisco to various name football schools: Hawaii, Kansas, Tennessee, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, Penn State, Florida, Oregon… I’m not a college football fan, but I’ve heard of those teams.</p>
<p>That’s great! I like that a lot. </p>
<p>Unfortunately, the big money stars ? I just don’t see how that happens. But, you know, maybe it changes slowly instead of overnight </p>
<p>College football is the only de facto minor league sport that can sell 80,000 tickets, and it wouldn’t so without the school affiliation. That creates a lot of perverse educational incentives and deep resistance to reform. </p>
<p>Yes. I think it really is big business. I think it’s hard for schools to give up the revenue or the advertising </p>