<p>It seems disingenuous to argue that there was no special benefit to athletes because just over 50% of the students were not athletes. Yet, there are other spheres in which the NCAA uses exactly that standard. Housing is one example. A school can provide the most lavish housing imaginable to its football and basketball teams as long as at least 50% of the residents are not athletes. </p>
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<p>Offering a benefit to athletes which is fraudulent and corrupt (fake grades for fake courses) must be outside NCAA rules, even if 51% of the fake grades go to non-athletes.</p>
<p>“Yeah, our defense is that even though these fake courses were cooked up specifically to inflate the GPAs of athletes, some frat guys found out about the courses and signed up for them also. So you shouldn’t punish us, NCAA.”</p>
<p>Well, it might work.</p>
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The Jim Harrick Jr. case at Georgia is on point (although the sanctions were self-imposed).<br>
<a href=“http://www.nytimes.com/2003/03/11/sports/college-basketball-georgia-suspends-harrick-and-withdraws-from-postseason.html”>http://www.nytimes.com/2003/03/11/sports/college-basketball-georgia-suspends-harrick-and-withdraws-from-postseason.html</a>
Here is the final exam. <a href=“USATODAY.com - Ex-Georgia assistant's exam laughable; can you pass?”>USATODAY.com - Ex-Georgia assistant's exam laughable; can you pass?;
<p>"Yeah, our defense is that even though these fake courses were cooked up specifically to inflate the GPAs of athletes…</p>
<p>This is from the Wainstein report:</p>
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[quote]
During this review, the Internal Working Group and NCAA investigator gained an
understanding of the broad outlines of paper classes. In light of the fact that these classes were
available to – and used by – students as well as student-athletes, the NCAA apparently concluded
that there was insufficient evidence of an athletic purpose behind the classes to establish an
academic integrity violation under the NCAA by-laws.</p>
<p>So, your argument (and apparently NCAA’s) is that UNC is off the hook because they failed in their efforts to restrict this “benefit” to athletes? Hey, maybe they can avoid sanctions if they give free cars to athletes AND members of the chess club.</p>
<p>On a slightly more serious note, this “argument” simply shows the lengths NCAA will go to avoid sanctioning big-money programs. This situation calls for very big sanctions, which I very much doubt will be forthcoming.</p>
<p>Haven’t read the entire thread but just wanted to note that the high and longstanding involvement of fraternities in this scam is clearly at odds with the “Greeks are good because they maintain a high GPA” argument being put forward on other threads.</p>
<p>After the publication of this report, nobody at UNC or the NCAA can say the classes had no athletic purpose. Not when Crowder, the person who started the scam, is right there saying she cooked up the courses to benefit underprepared athletes. </p>
<p>And take a look at Jan Boxhill, an Ethics professor! There are her emails, telling the grader what grade an athlete should get-- a D is ok, even though the paper has nothing whatever to do with the assignment and was recycled from somewhere else. And there’s Boxhill again, writing the conclusion for another athlete’s paper. Was Boxhill writing papers for non-athletes? Nope.</p>
<p>This is one very wayward school. Not typical in any way.</p>
<p>8-| </p>
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<p>But how do you know that? How does anyone know unless a school gets caught?</p>
<p>I don’t know, my experience at a middling to low state school is that they cook up courses for a lot of kids, not just athletes. The push for graduation rates is very strong. They have things like “Engineering technology” four-year degrees that are really associate’s degrees. They have classes worth three credits that are HS classes. They have classes worth three credits that cover half the material of other classes that are also three credits.</p>
<p>Higher education is a scam for a lot of schools, and that is one reason I will never ever support the DREAM Act in its current form, making believe that a college education can substitute for military or civilian service.</p>
<p><a href=“In wake of scandals elsewhere, UW experts weigh in on lucrative college football”>http://host.madison.com/news/local/education/campus_connection/in-wake-of-scandals-elsewhere-uw-experts-weigh-in-on/article_cf250abe-d34b-11e0-b342-001cc4c002e0.html</a></p>
<p>What’s your point?? Nothing there had anything to do with frat academics or even athlete academics. </p>
<p>rhandco - I think there’s a big difference between having programs that aren’t all that rigorous and probably shouldn’t be enough to get you a BA and essentially falsifying grades in what would appear to be a legitimate course.</p>
<p>If you went to Eastern State U, in the first place, whether or not the general population knows the specifics of the curriculum, people evaluating your resume know that you went to a mediocre state school that likely was not highly competitive and had lower expectations than the flagship. That isn’t - and shouldn’t be - the death knell of your prospects, as there are any number of ways one can distinguish him or herself at any college. But if you took a really easy schedule, that will be apparent as well. If Mr. Engineering Technology didn’t take any math after calc I and filled his semesters with courses like “Calculating Construction Costs,” it will be fairly apparent that this was a practical, VoTech kind of degree with some liberal arts courses thrown in for good measure. Whether that kind of program belongs in a four year college or not, there’s no deception involved.</p>
<p>The case of UNC is very different, because the transcripts will reflect a level of achievement that doesn’t exist and the courses were, in some cases, not just easy, but practically non-existent, as far as any real learning was concerned. </p>
<p>Yeah. Before I saw this report, I would have thought that someone who had completed three semesters of Swahili language, could, y’know, speak some Swahili. But those athletes getting As and Bs in Swahili 3 couldn’t even say “Hello” in Swahili. That’s not an easy course. That’s no course at all.</p>
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<p>Engineering technology is described here: <a href=“http://www.rit.edu/emcs/admissions/academics/majors/engineering-tech-or-engineering”>http://www.rit.edu/emcs/admissions/academics/majors/engineering-tech-or-engineering</a></p>
<p>Yes, many colleges have remedial course work that is high school level. An example would be Princeton’s Math 100: <a href=“https://www.math.princeton.edu/undergraduate/course/MAT100”>https://www.math.princeton.edu/undergraduate/course/MAT100</a></p>
<p>Yes, many colleges have courses that cover the same material at a slower pace. An example would be Harvard’s Math Ma and Mb, which cover the same material over two semesters that Math 1a covers in one semester: <a href=“Harvard Mathematics Department Administration and Finance”>http://www.math.harvard.edu/courses/index.html</a></p>
<p>But none of this is the same as completely bogus courses which require no attendance and no significant work at all.</p>
<p>It would have been quite easy for these athletes to have gotten into all these classes if they were AFAM majors. At my daughter’s school the theater department holds spots for all the majors and if there are spaces available, then others, even frat boys, can take them. My daughter was in the second to last orientation group, and when I looked online before we went I thought she might be in trouble as there were very few spots left in any course, but when she met with her adviser, he released all the spots she needed. The school is complying with NCAA rules as the course is open to all students on a similar basis - majors/minors get priority in courses offered in the major. Another option would have been for the AFAM department to open another section of the course. Most departments want people in their courses, they want them all full.</p>
<p>Those really hurt by this are not the athletes or the frat boys, but those who truly wanted an AFAM degree from UNC. No one will ever look at that degree now and think it has much value. </p>
<p>What are you talking about, twoinanddone? The rest of us are talking about phony courses that didn’t exist. If you have a phony course, it can have as many students in it as you want, majors and non-majors. There would be no restriction-- it’s not like the professor would have more work with more students, because there was no professor and no work, and it’s not like the class had to meet somewhere, because these phonies never met. The way advisors tried to keep frat boys out of the classes was by not telling them about the classes so they didn’t know to sign up for them. That’s all. </p>
<p>But the classes were in the catalog, had course numbers, and were signed up for like regular classes. There were a certain number of spots in the class, probably to keep in line with the certifying authority (~40 for a writing class, but maybe 60 for a lecture classes) requirements. The frat boys registered for them, and actually got minors in AFAM studies. The classes were recorded, with course numbers, on the transcripts. They did exist, just didn’t require any class time. If they let 100 sign up for the course, then they’d have to report the student/teacher ratio at 100:1, and that may risk accreditation. </p>
<p>If your view is correct, that these were secret classes only for athletes, how would the frat boys have ever signed up? How would the course with no course number or description show up on the transcript? If there was no limit on space or number of students in a class, wouldn’t the department have wanted all the non-athletes they could get? Wouldn’t it look good that only 10 athletes were in a class of 200? Surely that would show everyone that this wasn’t a perk for athletes but a true class offered to all UNC students. The department was trying to balance the number of athletes and non-athletes, to make it look good enough for the NCAA, but still stay within the requirements for accreditation of class size, number of courses offered, number of professors available.</p>
<p>My daughter has a class with an assigned meeting time, except after the first meeting they never have to go. The course is a requirement, but the class is working on plays and theater productions and the times for those vary. They received the syllabus, and have to check in periodically, sign up for backstage duties, work, report again. Still has a course number, classroom, time, and it’s in the catalog, but almost all spaces in the class are reserved for majors.</p>
<p>It’s common for art, music performance, theater, independent study courses to be in the catalog and have a classroom and assigned time, with everyone knowing that the actual class or work will not be done at that time.</p>