<p>Really, I believe the formula for being a top 20 public is to attract great students, improve facilities, hire great professors, engage in meaningful research, slowly increase admissions standards. Other things that don’t hurt…having a beautiful campus, great big time athletics, nice weather, passionate alums. Sound familiar?</p>
<p>When you look at the Top 20 publics, they’re not accepting that many OOS students…they don’t need to. They have the instate population for their seats. </p>
<p>The UCs, UVA, UNC, UMich, UIUC, UTexas, UF, and so forth don’t really have that many full pay OOS students. </p>
<p>Because Alabama is a lowish population state, (with a highish number of public U’s) Bama will always have to enroll 40-50%+ of OOS students.</p>
<p>M2CK, completely vaild points. </p>
<p>But to clarify, UVA (29% OOS; State pop of 8.1 mill) and University of Michigan (37% OOS: 9.9 mil) depend on OOS tuition as part of thier buisness model. Unlike a UF (6% OOS; 19.1 million). (Alabama has a pop of 4.8+ million)</p>
<p>In fact, UVA is partnering with Harvard and Princeton to do a series of road shows in my state (Florida), in Octorber. UVA really, really, wants those full pay OOS students…and can get them from the same pool of students as the Ivy schools.</p>
<p>Yup. UVA, UNC-CH are traveling all around the south with Emory and Notre Dame. They definetly pull the same quality OOS kids as those prestigious privates.</p>
<p>Also, remember that Virginia also has William and Mary, another highly prestigious public.</p>
<p>UNC-CH is unique in that, through its insanely high requirement for in-state students, less than 1/5 of the student population is out of state. Not only does this limit diversity, but it also narrows the OOS applicant pool to the point where UNC seems more selective than it actually is. This odd mix of decent in-state students paired with incredible out of state students (paying out of state tuition, no less) always seemed odd to me, no doubt caused solely by UNC’s need to keep NC funding rolling in.</p>
<p>Ya. I think North Carolina would do better to steer the average in-state kids to the other state publics like UNC-Willmington for example thus opening up more OOS slots at Chapel Hill. But what do I know?</p>
<p>two words: Tobacco money</p>
<p>The state legislatures set the OOS caps, where they exist. In my state, WI, the university periodically tries to get their cap lifted so they have access to more of those OOS tuition $, and with more urgency as years go by and state funding for the U dries up. Here is an article about the most recent attempt: [Proposal</a> to raise UW out-of-state enrollment cap sparks debate - JSOnline](<a href=“http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/news/182233051.html]Proposal”>Proposal to raise UW out-of-state enrollment cap sparks debate) UW would love to have Michigan’s business model, if only they weren’t hamstrung by our legislature. UNC has similar problems, can’t get legislature to raise the cap. I googled and read through years of articles last year when D was applying and got interested in why the cap is set so low.</p>
<p>*UNC-CH is unique in that, through its insanely high requirement for in-state students, less than 1/5 of the student population is out of state. Not only does this limit diversity, but it also narrows the OOS applicant pool *</p>
<p>Yes, and while Calif doesn’t have laws (I don’t think) that limits % OOS to low numbers, there are only a small % at Cal and UCLA (didn’t check the others, but likely similar). We keep hearing that Cal, UCLA, etc want more OOS students to pay the big money, but those two schools have less than 10% OOS.</p>
<p>two words: Tobacco money</p>
<p>To fund FA? I see nothing wrong with that. Would the FA then be distributed %-wise by how many Pell students on each campus or what? </p>
<p>Heck, I wouldn’t care if packs went for $10 a pack. The higher the better. 
However, there are enough Alabamians that live close enough to state lines that buying over state lines would then be an issue. Heck, in Ttown, it’s not too far to Miss. In Huntsville, I can get to Tenn in about 20 minutes. Those who live on the east side can get to Georgia easily.</p>
<p>I think a lottery would be a quick fix. People wouldn’t be buying them over state lines like they do now.</p>
<p>^What’s funny is that these rules promote a unique sort of brain drain. The students with high enough stats to go to ivies go to ivies, and the students who can choose between UNC at full price or go to UA for free (like me) often choose the latter. If schools like UNC accepted more OOS, they would have to accept less lower stat in-staters, but they could also offer more merit aid to the high stat kids. </p>
<p>Interesting predicament. Unfortunately, even if lowering the in-state requirements were the most effective option, it will never be politically viable.</p>
<p>*fewer lower stat in-staters</p>
<p>UC has a systemwide cap of 10%, but they have debated legislation that would force each campus to meet the 10% cap, bad for Berkeley and UCLA. That is what we have already in WI, a cap that each campus must meet. Sometimes the efforts to lift the cap have taken the form of pushing a UC type arrangement, so that Madison could have a higher cap, while the other schools would have lower caps. But that has not made any headway.</p>
<p>[Birgeneau</a> condemns new legislation limiting out-of-state enrollment - The Daily Californian](<a href=“http://www.dailycal.org/2012/05/25/birgeneau-condemns-new-legislation-limiting-out-of-state-enrollment/]Birgeneau”>http://www.dailycal.org/2012/05/25/birgeneau-condemns-new-legislation-limiting-out-of-state-enrollment/)</p>
<p>^^^
ahh…thanks. Didn’t know the 10% number was legislated.</p>
<p>When you say “must meet”, do you mean that a school MUST have at least 10% OOS or that they must have at least 90% instate?</p>
<p>UC-Berkeley is 14% OOS but 15% International, that 10% limit (combined for both) would hurt…since you know almost all are full pay (at what? $35K a year for Tuition? ouch)</p>
<p>At least 90% in-state for the UC’s</p>
<p>UC-Berkeley is 14% OOS but 15% International, t</p>
<p>?? Are you sure? for undergraduate?</p>
<p>On Collegeboard, Cal reports only 7% OOS.</p>
<p>mom2collegekids. UW-Madison has a 25% cap on OOS. They must have at least 75% in-state(they count Minnesota residents in this figure as our states have reciprocity.) Last year they miscalculated and got too many OOS 25.8%, so now have to work hard to get the OOS number enrolled back down. I read in NC the universities have to pay a penalty to the state for each OOS kid they enroll over the limit. Don’t have link right at hand. I don’t know that they do that here, but there is a lot of pressure to stay to limits.</p>
<p>Reading celesteroberts link, this has to be my favorite part…</p>
<p>“But Charlie Eaton, a UC Berkeley Ph.D. student and financial secretary for United Auto Workers Local 2865 a union which represents nearly 12,000 graduate student instructors, readers and tutors…” </p>
<p>The Auto Workers union? Does the Teamster represent the faculty? Where’s Ucbalumnus, I need answers!! (unless it would upset the Teamsters, in which case I’m good…no questions here…).</p>