UChicago vs. UCBerkeley

Colleges and Universities A-Z University of Chicago ✅
1

<p>Hi everyone,</p>

<p>Currently, I am facing the hardest decision in my life -- where to go for college???</p>

<p>I'm an undecided major (leaning toward social sciences) admitted to both Uchicago and UCBerkeley. I live in the Bay Area, so Berkeley is familiar to me (and my friends will be attending there), but UChicago attracts my attention with its prestige and focus on intellectual life (the CORE!!!). </p>

<p>Here are some main points I am considering...</p>

<p>Berkeley: costs $10,000 less, more abundant social life, larger student body (25000), semester system, nice weather</p>

<p>Chicago: costs $10,000 more, "quirky" (not sure if i like it or not), smaller student body (5000), quarter system, harsh weather (esp winters)</p>

<p>Both schools are extremely competitive and difficult in their curriculums, so i guess I have little choice in that regard.</p>

<p>Another major concern is that I've spent a majority of my life in the bay area, where there is a totally different atmosphere of ethnicities and cultures, compared to chicago.</p>

<p>I understand that responses I get in this particular forum might be biased toward UChicago, but I would appreciate any advice/suggestions/comments on my dilemma!</p>

<p>Thanks~</p>

2

<p>I am currently attending UC Berkeley, and I just applied to transfer to University of Chicago, so I’m probably a good person to offer my advice! haha</p>

<p>I would suggest University of Chicago, for several reasons.</p>

<p>1) I went to high school in southern California, and I really regret not taking more of a risk and going to college somewhere out of state, somewhere out of my comfort zone. Do you think you might regret not leaving the bay area?</p>

<p>2) Berkeley is a lot bigger than U of C, and that’s one of the main reasons I want to leave. Many of the classes you’ll take (at least in the first two years) will be huge-I’m currently in two classes that have over 100 kids-which makes it really hard to interact with professors or feel engaged with the course material. The large student body can be frustrating socially, too… because the school is so big, it feels like everyone already has their own thing going on. You don’t really get a sense of community, unless you join a frat or sorority, or immediately find a club that you think you fit into.</p>

<p>3) The main social life Berkeley has is within the greek system, which gets really old really fast (or at least it did for me). I’ve been to my fair share of frat parties, and they weren’t fun- maybe I wasn’t drunk enough? If you want to party but hate frats, the co-ops offer a decent alternative. The parties they throw have less meathead frat guys and slutty sorority girls, and more hipsters & nature kids. Unfortunately, both of those groups annoy me. Obviously, there are exceptions to my exaggerated stereotypes… but you really have to seek them out.</p>

<p>As for the academic difficulty… I honestly don’t think Berkeley is thaaat challenging, but I don’t have a math/science focus. That’s another reason why I want to leave… I got a 4.0 last semester and will probably get the same this semester, while doing a 12 hour/ week internship, and I feel like I don’t do that much work! I’m definitely not at my full mental capacity, so I’m hoping U of C will provide more of a challenge, or at least a different type of challenge. I hate just sitting in huge lecture halls and passively taking notes…I’d much rather participate in interesting discussions and engage with my peers/ professors. I’ve been craving the type of interactivity and inspiration I can only get in small classes.</p>

<p>I guess the supposed ‘quirkiness’ of U of C is part of why I really want to go there and feel like it’d be a great fit for me… so if you aren’t sure if that’s your thing, and you feel like you could fit in with the greek life, then maybe Berkeley will be better for you.</p>

<p>Good luck with your choice!</p>

3

<p>"but UChicago attracts my attention with its prestige and focus on intellectual life (the CORE!!!). "</p>

<p>I think most people would say Berkeley is more prestigious…</p>

<p>IMO…
Pros for Cal: $$$ savings, prestige, dynamic campus experience, Pac 10 Sports, SF Bay Area</p>

<p>Pros for Chi: prestige (arguably less however), Chicago location, more focus on academics bc lack of thriving sports, frats, social scene</p>

<p>Anyway, I would save the $$$ and hang out on Telegraph ;-)</p>

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<p>not that the prestige thing is that important, but where in the world did you ever hear that Berkeley is more prestigious than U Chicago? Where have you been during last N years? U Chicago has an international reputation as a mecca of academic excellence. I have yet to see a SINGLE national or international ranking that puts Berkeley over Chicago. (maybe there are some, but not the well known, reputable ranking agency). Some international agencies, that are not so bound by the “mass brand marketing appeal” rampant in the US, put Chicago way over even the likes of MIT and stanford and most of the Ivies. But, the whole ranking thing is silly any way. I would choose Chicago for different reasons.</p>

<p>To the OP: I am deciding between U Chicago and another elite private school, but if the choice is between Berkeley and U Chicago, it would be HANDS DOWN U chicago. No matter how good the public flagship university is, the state school has to accept a lot of in state students, and therefore cannot put together a uniformly intellectually gifted student body. Nor can they uniformly maintain a small class environment: they have to rely on many mass lecture style classes with over supply of graduate TAs, as opposed to real faculty, teaching the classes. The quality of education simply can NOT be maintained at a level that can match that of an elite private school like U Chicago with small classes taught by world renowned faculty (not all, but many). To this, add the uncertainly of the CA budget situation. It becomes worrisome. Furthermore, if whatever you want to do post graduate requires pretty chummy relationship with the faculty, Chicago provides a much better venue: due to the small undergraduate size overwhelmed by the abundance of world renowned graduate level research faculty, you are much more likely to be part of research or other activities that involve faculty interaction. I doubt you will have a similar level of interaction at Berkeley. I also heard that at a big state U like Berkeley with impending budget cuts, some students may not be able to graduate within 4 years due to the difficulty of getting all the requirements for the major without scheduling and class overcrowding problems.</p>

<p>Everybody to his own. If you value big sports, golden california girls/guys, the perfect weather, etc over the quality of education, go to Berkeley. (by the way, academically, Berkeley is a very good school, just not as good as U Chicago). Of course, if the finance is an issue and there is a big difference between the two, then it’s an entirely different story.</p>

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<p>Um, where have you been for, like, the last century? Berkeley is a world renowned school with incredible cache–here in the US and abroad. As for rankings, it seems to be doing pretty good–despite the fact that it is just a plain old “public” school. [National</a> rankings & faculty honors - UC Berkeley](<a href=“http://www.berkeley.edu/about/rank.shtml]National”>http://www.berkeley.edu/about/rank.shtml)
I also know that Berkeley and Chicago law schools are tied for 6 in US News. </p>

<p>I love how folks love to try to dump on public schools, as if that is a bad thing. I also love the ignorance of statements like “the state school has to accept a lot of in state students” and therefore can’t have a uniformly intellectual student body. What a stupid statement. Do you not realize that California has 40 million people, and of that big pool of people, there are tons of brilliant folks who want to stay in the Golden State??? By your logic, an ‘elite’ private school that accepts the top student in each of the 50 states offers a more intellectually gifted student body…what if the smartest kid from North Dakota got a 1500 on the SAT but the average Californian got a 2000 on the SATs? Total rubbish…</p>

<p>You are right, however, about the state budget. Budget cuts do make public schools vulnerable.</p>

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<p>UC Berkeley and UChicago are both excellent schools that are greatly underrated. I don’t know why you guys are fighting. I understand that state schools are not at the same level of many private schools, but UC Berkeley, UVA and Michigan are the three public schools that compete and are many times better than many private schools.</p>

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<p>Pretty much everything said thus far in this thread is somewhat true, except for the part about Berkeley having a clear prestige advantage over Chicago, and the part that implies that Berkeley classes are inherently worse than Chicago’s. They are both great, world-famous universities. Berkeley faces some challenges on the state-funding front, and has for some time, but it’s not going to turn into a second-rate institution any time soon. The issues about huge introductory classes at Berkeley and, with some majors, the difficulty of completing requirements within four years are real, but mainly require planning and some aggressiveness in looking out for yourself if you are in a huge major like Economics. Berkeley will cost the OP meaningfully less, but he should make certain to compare living expenses, too. (When I did that a few years ago, I thought it added $2,000+/year to the cost of UC-B vs. UChicago.) And at the end of the day, it all comes down to whether you like Chicago more than Berkeley at any price, and if so whether you are willing to pay $X/year (and to give up Berkeley’s comparative advantages) for whatever it is you like better about Chicago. </p>

<p>There’s no right or wrong answer to those questions. Both universities are more than adequate; both universities are in fact great, although they may have relative greatness differences in particular fields/majors. Each offers a completely different blend of extracurricular factors, and for California residents a meaningfully different price tag.</p>

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<p>“Anyway, I would save the $$$ and hang out on Telegraph ;-)” ahh, I hate telegraph! I always feel so sketched out when I walk around there! The only good thing about telegraph is Cafe Intermezzo… and North Oakland/ Temescal, but few Berkeley kids venture into Oakland anyway.</p>

<p>I don’t think Berkeley is inherently worse/less prestigious/ whatever than U of C because it is a public school, but the problems I have with Berkeley (academically) would definitely not be a factor if the school had more funding, or if monies were allocated differently. I feel like a LOT of the budget goes toward simply maintaining appearances, ie investing in athletes with state-of-the-art athletic centers, building flashy new department headquarters that attract media attention, etc etc. I’m sure this is the case with most schools, maybe even more so with private schools, but it’s extremely frustrating to me when departments I really value get cut 50% (that happened this year) because of budget limitations… while the school just announced flashy additions to some football training center.</p>

<p>Berkeley is a lot cheaper than U of C, but I still feel like for the amount of money I’m paying, I should be getting more attention. The faculty I’ve had the opportunity to interact with at Berkeley has been BRILLIANT… but so inaccessible! I hadn’t even met my adviser until I needed her to fill out a form for my transfer applications 2 months ago. If money isn’t an issue for you, I’d go with the education that offers more individual attention from actual professors.</p>

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<p>Just be aware that Chicago isn’t necessarily paradise on the “individual attention from actual professors” front, either. You have to work at it, especially if you are in a popular major. My daughter is in a large department. She has good relationships with a couple of professors, but her relationship with her B.A. thesis advisor is quite formal and distant. (By luck, her first four choices for advisor were on leave all or part of this year, and she didn’t actually get an advisor assigned until December – when it should have been August.) By far her most important relationship is with the fifth-year PhD student who is serving as her “preceptor”, and whom she has known since the woman TAed a class my daughter took as a first year – that is a very close, valuable relationship, from which she has learned a lot. And also with her classmates – she talks a lot to two or three other students who are interested in the same set of problems she is.</p>

<p>This isn’t a knock on Chicago at all, just pointing out that elite research universities are more alike than different.</p>

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<p>I agree with JHS. Both schools with the right effort / strategizing can afford you a fine education that will be externally recognized as top notch by graduate school adcoms and choosier employers, but there may be a real difference financially that could be worth exploiting. This is one instance where chasing money may not mean giving up much, if any, quality. </p>

<p>Given UC Berkeley’s departmental strengths across the board, I cannot imagine paying 10K more a year (if that is what you mean) to attend UChicago, especially when one takes into account some of the quality of life factors that comes with it (atrociously bad weather by bay area standards, safe but undeveloped campus area, more mundane adjacent city, weaker array of extracurriculars due to its smaller size). For the record, I had a better financial aid offer in favor of Berkeley for college, and regret not being able to take advantage of it (conservative parents irrationally feared the University of California - Birkenstocks). </p>

<p>As for the professorial interaction alluded to in this thread, I am not certain why people think you will get more of this at Chicago. Two reasons. First, a lot of professors at Chicago (and Berkeley) are famous, and as a result don’t want to spend a good portion of their class entertaining relatively underdeveloped commentary from gunner students. A good clarifying question here and there is all fine and well, but attempting to lay out your intellectual position time and time again is normally not appreciated. Especially by your classmates who are there to learn from Dr. XYZ, not you. In some ways, there is almost no worse college fate than to be labeled as “that kid,” who always has to ask a question. Second, why you can make use of office hours you are unlikely to ever get more than 10-20 minutes a week with a moderately popular professor - if that. They need to reserve the bulk of their time for the PhD’s whose dissertations they are overseeing, as well as their TA’s who have questions about grading, sections, and such. If you really want professors to fawn over your “insights,” or to hold your hand through term papers and such, then you will need to attend a true liberal arts college or a markedly lesser ranked research university.</p>

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<p>I agree with most of what people said. Berkeley and Chicago are on par academically, IMO. And I can totally understand spending $10k more, because I would not want to be miserable for the next four years of my life… From what I saw/gather, Berkeley and Chicago are quite different in setting, environment, etc.</p>

<p>So it comes down to what environment you like. I can’t believe someone would label Chicago “mundane,” especially when compared to Berkeley. (I’ve spent a few days in both cities.) Chicago-only fifteen min from the Univ-has a lot more to offer.</p>

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<p>go to chicago. being far away from home will help you become a stronger person.</p>

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<p>Berkeley is more prestigious when it comes to rankings other than US News</p>

<p>University rankings (overall) for Cal
ARWU World 2nd
ARWU National 2nd
Times Higher Education 8th
USNWR National University 22nd
(Cal is 3rd in undergrad business and engineering, thats awesome!)
WM National University 2nd</p>

<p>Berkeley is also only the BEST public school in the world with a greater diversity of people – different economic backgrounds, etc. They say Berkeley is more “real.”</p>

<p>Anyway, Uchig is a great school with an excellent academic reputation, tough choice indeed. Uchig students are known for their intellect, and it is a common generalization that Uchig students are “nerds.”</p>

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<p>You should go to UChicago so that you can do [Scav</a> Hunt](<a href=“http://scavhunt.uchicago.edu/]Scav”>http://scavhunt.uchicago.edu/). The only way to truly comprehend the transcendent awesomeness that is Scav Hunt is to be a Scavvie oneself, but you can get a taste by watching [Mama</a> Shaq, Mama Shaq, Shaq’s your mom, that’s a fact](<a href=“- YouTube”>- YouTube), produced and directed by the Burton-Judson team. Another good thing to watch is [Mama</a> Shaq, Mama Shaq, Shaq’s your mom, that’s a fact](<a href=“- YouTube”>- YouTube), directed and produced by John D. Rockefeller and the Captains of Injury. Good luck with your decision!</p>

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<p>You do realize this thread is two years old, right?</p>