UCLA v Middlebury

Do those spring admits graduate in the spring…? From the description, it sounds like they graduate in the winter…

No, February admit means that you start school in February, rather than September. Midd has had a “Febs” program for about 50 years. There are usually around 100 Febs and 650 fall students per class. February Admission | Middlebury College

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Why so? Is it because of increased attention from professors in class?

Bluebayou touched on some of the relevant issues. To be blunt, top liberal arts colleges like Middlebury expend a lot more money and resources on undergraduates than most public research universities like UCLA. That’s not to say you can’t get an excellent education at UCLA, and it may well be a better choice for anyone interested in one of its small and extremely strong programs (e.g. Iranian studies), but generally speaking you have to be rather proactive to make the most of its resources.

As an example, Harvard and comparable private schools do not run circles around the UCs in producing winners of prestigious fellowships like the Rhodes because they have a greater number of high-achieving students (the UCs have quite a few due to their size), but rather because they have dedicated offices and staff who coach students through every step of the process.

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. After completing their four years, Febs take part in a unique ski-down tradition at the Middlebury Snow Bowl to celebrate their graduation.>>

This sounds like it happens in the winter.

I guess what I’m asking is…do you care about this.

Also, what would your plans be for that fall term.

ETA…I think both schools are great options for different reasons.

Yes, they graduate in February. They have a special ceremony that includes skiing, snowboarding, or somehow schussing down the college’s ski slope.

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I agree with your assessment.

My only point in raising this is that, at a big school like UCLA with big-time sports, if you are a non-athlete it really doesn’t matter … you barely feel it at a place like that. There are so many people and athletes at that level are a world apart from everybody else.

At a SLAC, OTOH, having a real sporty culture with lots of athletes on campus can make a NARP feel out of place. Obviously lots of kids who are NARPs attend Middlebury and find their people and it’s all good. But you can get lots of complaints too. I never hear anybody from a big flagship say they feel out of place because of big-time D1 sports. The athletes at those schools are a group of unicorns … pretty elite crowd.

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In a way (for me) being a February admit is almost more exciting than a regular admit. If I went to Middlebury, I plan to WOOF (free housing, accommodations, and food in exchange for labor) in Spain. I also am considering backpacking The Camino trail.

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Of course, this is one of the most contentious topics on CC and the subject of numerous closed threads. :slight_smile: But I agree with you wholeheartedly.

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Have you visited both schools? If not, I think it might really help you decide. They are vastly different in almost every way. Neither is going to be a bad choice, but they will be very different experiences.

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I have visited both! And I loved them both! :sneezing_face:

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It’s not $10K, it’s $12K, and multiplied by 4. That’s a nearly $50,000 difference.

I agree on your other points though. The experiences will be different. Better is in the eyes of the beholder.

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Is there any chance that either of the two safeties is a choice you like and that might still be worth considering?

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No, I do think that these are the two schools I would both enjoy and develop most as a person in.

Regarding undergraduate research opportunities, UCLA appears on this survey-based list from U.S. News, which may be of interest to you:

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/undergrad-research-programs

However, this doesn’t appear to comport well with personal experience as it has been expressed in your topic thus far.

Those are very different experiences! I can see the value in both–and you’re very lucky to have such amazing options.

One thing that’s interesting that hasn’t been brought up yet is your interest in biotech. LA, Orange County and San Diego are hot places for biotech companies. Internships and relationships with UCLA might be plentiful and worth researching.

Another thing that no one seems to have addressed much is the assertion that it’s harder to do outdoor activities at UCLA. Unless you mean skiing (which obviously Middlebury has an edge with a hill right on campus, though Big Bear and Mammoth are not far from LA) I would give the edge to year-round sunshine in LA for keeping you outdoors and active.

I absolutely buy that you will get more attention and closer relationships with your professors at Middlebury. But you might also learn how to hustle at UCLA. No one will hand you anything, but the ability to put yourself out there, ask for what you want/need, and deal with competition are priceless life skills.

(Full disclosure: My daughter just chose UCLA over Smith and Kenyon. I was leaning heavily toward Kenyon but UCLA stole her heart and she is beyond thrilled to be going. We are in state, so it’s a whole lot cheaper for us, too.)

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right, but if the OP was concerned about costs, OP would be looking at U-Illinois Chicago. (aka Circle Campus)

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Correct. I am in a very fortunate situation where, yes, I am considering cost but it is not restricting me in my decision.

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Thanks for your thoughtful response!!

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You took the words right out of my mouth. Sounds like full pay either way and UCLA is cheaper in that case.

Re: research and internships, I have a son who is a first year at UCLA (didn’t apply to any LACs), and from what I can tell TONS of kids are doing research internships. There’s a whole machine around research and internships. Lots of opportunities.

Re: a gap year, do you plan/want to take one? If that’s important then Middlebury is your choice. Can’t do that at UCLA unless you reapply. However you can take time off if you really need to later (health, family situation), and you can absolutely study all over the world for the same cost as attending UCLA (more or less).

Re: the outdoors — there’s endless outdoorsy stuff to do in and around UCLA, and kids go to Mammoth/Big Bear if they want winter sports. Maybe Middlebury has more physical space and woods on campus, you mean? At UCLA you can take a bus or a zipcar and do any hiking/biking/surfing/whatever. There’s intramural sports, but you obviously can’t probably walk onto the lacrosse team.

Re: social scene, UCLA is a big D1 school full of kids who sport UCLA spirit wear more than just about anything else as far as I can tell. School spirit permeates the entire campus (and don’t make the mistake of buying maroon sheets like I did for my kid — we forgot that’s the school color for that rival across town). The dining is a big part of the experience. Kids who want to be in the Greek system have ample opportunity to do that. Kids who don’t care for that have plenty of other options.

Re: the quarter system, I’ve been surprised how not terrible it has been for our son. It moves fast but you get more classes in that way, and nothing awful lasts too long. You are fully done when the breaks roll around (holiday and spring break). It does make it hard when your high school friends finish earlier than you do, but then you don’t have to start until a lot later.

All in all, these are two completely different kinds of schools, and one of them should probably “sing” to you a little more than the other. Go with that one!

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I think UCLA is calling you and LA might be a great city for you to explore.

You will find research opportunities in both places -in LA you are not limited by what is going on at UCLA.

Outdoor activities extend all year long in LA in a very different way than Vermont. Everything is outside in LA. There are parks everywhere, great places to hike, and the ocean. No need for a gap semester.

And distance is relative when you are depending on various modes of transport. You have two major airports in Chicago with direct flights to LAX all day and night. To get to Middlebury it will take you twice as long with planes,trains, buses, and/or automobiles. It is a 5 to 9 hour bus adventure to get to Tufts to see your brother - again - direct flight from LAX to Boston. And he will probably want to come to see you in LA.

The quarters may fit your adventurous and outgoing personality as it gives you more choices and some time to focus on the courses you have at that time.

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