<p>Maybe Machen just knew that under Florida law anything he wrote would be a public record and therefore subject to public disclosure if asked. In that case, doesn’t it make more sense to give your school a high mark rather than a middling one, so if and when it is disclosed no one can accuse you of having a low opinion of your own school?</p>
<p>You know, that may be true. At first I hesitated to pass judgment on the guy because I wondered about his frame of mind and motivations when he did the report. Then I gave in to my sense of indignation about the process.</p>
<p>Well, whatever we think of President Machen, I think most of us can agree that “distinguished” is the wrong answer for this school. Sounds like the best that can be said is that it does not matter, all the outliers will come out in the statistical wash.</p>
<p>I wonder how would these affect the students there before and after graduation…</p>
<p>midatlmom wrote:
“…as I have said before, the 5 for UF seems unwarranted. However, Machen could legitimately feel that UF is the best school in the state–in fact, I think that many many people would agree with that. It has a higher rentention and graduation rates than University of Miami, its board scores are fairly comparable, it has excellent research facilities and it’s much cheaper. If Machen had ranked UF as a 4 and Miami as a 3 probably we would be having a discussion, but it would not be as heated.”</p>
<p>However, Machen felt his school was two spots ahead of Miami?!? Go here and put in both schools<br>
[College</a> Navigator - National Center for Education Statistics](<a href=“http://nces.ed.gov/collegenavigator/]College”>College Navigator - National Center for Education Statistics)
OK, Miami has a lower admission rate, higher average 25/75 test scores and other comparable measures. In USNWR the are seperated BY ONE POINT in scoring. Bernie Mac new exactly what he is doing…either that or is the UF president a fool? A victim of a New York Times, Orlando Sentinel. St Pete Times, UN Blue Helmet conspiracy?</p>
<p>^ Yes, but the University of Miami has half the research expenditures, weaker graduate & professional programs, and a less distinguished faculty.</p>
<p>The truth is UM and FSU should be about tied for peer assessment score.</p>
<p>Bick,</p>
<p>For the last time, Bernie Mac was filling it out for UNDERGRADUATE programs. Other than HYPS, I would expect less research spending at a school which UF is THREE TIMES LARGER than. Weak graduate programs? Gee, even after Hough poured his money in, the MBA program and UMs MBA program are the same in Biz week (UMs higher in undergraduate) Law? Levin should be cleaning UMs clock right? Bar admission rates are comparable and 20% more of UM law graduates are with private firms than UF. You really want to go on record about Miller? Bills’ Kevin Everett (UM guy, no less) would not be walking without The Miami Project on Paralysis. Bascom Palmer? WEAK? How about #1. The Dean of the Business School came from Wharton, Faculty WEAK? The editorials about UF arrogance are all around the state and people are becoming aware of the UF Big Lie</p>
<p>Your are the biggest UF booster on CC. No UF press release, Talking Point or Spin goes wanting for a post. The whole PA portion is flawed because Bernie (like others) is human and flawed also. I know that one point separation is a thorn given the amount of money UF consumes, its double (funding and tuition) legislature support and its size. Still that one point glares like the brightest star… it is decreed that Supreme Leader Machen and Most Glorious State University Factory be the best…sorry the truth is not the same.</p>
<p>Heh… I would also rate Brown, Georgetown, Dartmouth on the level that the UF President did…</p>
<p>I’ve lost some respect for Barron’s with this post…cooking the books? Please. Machen’s ratings for Fla schools are, at best, +/- 1 point from mainstream opinion (which by no means can be taken as absolute truth). With 2000+ respondents in the poll, he has influenced the PA results 1/10,000 from the mainstream. Not to mention his responses may have been sincere. I think Barron’s is far more guilty of ■■■■■■■■ than Machen is of “cooking” anything.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Very well said.</p>
<p>
Baghdad - you called the man (TK) out for [having</a> issues with integrity](<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/1062765282-post134.html]having”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/1062765282-post134.html). Bernie Machen had his personal integrity questioned by the St. Pete Times and you made the issues the same because some athletes cheated on an online test on TK’s watch. That is just ridiculous.</p>
<p>Using your logic President Obama should be fired or resign in disgrace (as you also suggested TK is doing with his retirement) because some federal trainees cheated on an online test, or that President Donna E. Shalala, of the University of Miami (whom you strongly support on CC) should resign when some athletes get in trouble at Thug U. </p>
<p>You do have a point, however, in maybe questioning how US News ranks schools. Why compare the UF and FSU with U Miami in a general sense? I am beginning to think it makes a lot less sense. Perhaps birds of a feather should be ranked together.</p>
<p>P2N,</p>
<p>You can think I am suggesting all I want, but to resign or to have trustees suggest it privately on their own accord, as other CC posters have also alluded to, is their own business. However, the timing is very suspect, don’t you think? I know you would even like a more "academics’ focused president, especially with the number of recent “Criminoles” far outstripping “UThugs” (Oh, I am sorry, Marve did bust a car mirror…but then was late for class. He is off the team). TK could have stayed, but what he did when the facts were presented is not to be emulated. </p>
<p>Play what would the President do? OK. Our President: “The administration’s investigation into the USA JOBS rigging scandal with the further root cause findings of the independent CBO inquiry panel need to addressed. The investigation revealed Office of Personnel Management staffers did enable cheating on federal tests. I will accept the findings of fault and put in place procedures to prevent re-occurance”</p>
<p>Harry S. Truman had a sign on his desk “The Buck Stops Here” that meant HE WAS RESPONSIBLE for his administration’s faults. “I Didn’t Know” was tried in Watergate, but then there were those tapes… </p>
<p>President Shalala has not had an NCAA investigation, however the FIU/UM brawl was on her watch…Did she handle that correctly? No, in the initial stages she didn’t IMO. However, in the aftermath, from the firing of the announcer to Coker to the players subsequent careers, she put the word out that no coach or sport or players are bigger than the university. </p>
<p>T.K. could have left it at an appeal and made it public…No, it took a Sunshine Law (see Bernie Mac) request to open the whole thing up and show the whole pattern of conduct behind this “self-reported” issue. Now, TK still won’t accept the truth:</p>
<p>[NCAA</a> intends to take away Florida State victories - College Football - Rivals.com](<a href=“Rivals.com: Rivals Football & Basketball Recruiting”>Rivals.com: Rivals Football & Basketball Recruiting)</p>
<p>What does he mean by “before going anywhere else.” Sue the NCAA, of which FSU is a member? Didn’t Gov. Rob Bogovich in Illinois try that trick, report the governor’s office for for ethics violations …oh, there were tapes there too. TK could have just left it at “Yes, we made mistakes in this university and we will fix them” and left it at that…and would be commended by me for doing so. Why does he keep fighting and making it look like all FSU cares about is Bowden’s victories.</p>
<p>The comparision is because USNWR follows to the Carnegie classifications of universities…like it or not they are stuck together aling with 250+ other schools</p>
<p>Please post your sources about TK’s lack of integrity vis a vis Machen’s issue with the St. Pete Times. You called him out, please support your charge with references.</p>
<p>Please refrain from smearing the man without facts.</p>
<p>Obviously the local paper found some problems with the UF’s approach on this and I reported it. Was he less obvious than the Clemson guy, certainly.</p>
<p>I used to like the rankings, but after viewing the first poster’s links, I think they are a joke… This UF president is a pompous a$$. Georgetown rated below Purdue??? US News needs to change the way they rank schools.</p>
<p>Barrons,</p>
<p>How many times have you slammed the south in previous posts? </p>
<p>Also I have been to UW-Madison and it seemed kind of cool I guess. Neat little college town and state capital.</p>
<p>Georgetown is basically a Liberal Arts College with a few professional programs. They are not a research powerhouse, and they have no desire to be.</p>
<p>I don’t think I have generally slammed the South at all. But the South is given to some foibles–like trying too hard to climb rankings without paying their dues. I think bending rules to win at sports and now in academics is more endemic to the South. I like the South and plan to live there for its many good points but it does have some weaknesses too.</p>
<p>What constitutes “paying dues” barrons? While I think Machen was properly criticized for this error, it is likely more evidence of the problems with US News ratings than southern universities or UF and Machen in particular. UF has done some good work and currently they lead Florida in ratings. </p>
<p>You can criticize Florida’s funding system but it reflects the preferences of our population, much as I’d like much better funding for FSU, especially. I am tired of what well may be northern bias against southern schools, especially public universities. The US News PA may well be an executable of northern universities bias against other striving and credible schools.</p>
<p>The south has grown for years in population and industry-business based, among other things, on it’s so called lower tax rates/spending. Either the south spends a lot on public education or it doesn’t. You can’t have it both ways.</p>
<p>Paying dues means developing your own topflight faculty and research programs. Not poaching a few programs and declaring yourself an academic star. FSU faculty on average win about 7 major awards per year. Top state schools win 40 or more. It takes more than using political influence to steal one national lab (which lead to a major review of the rewarding of such contracts) and program away from MIT/Wisconsin for FSU to be MIT/Wisconsin.</p>