<p>blossom: I don’t have time to dig up the stats now…but I will tell you that I checked into it about a year ago. Don’t have to worry now since s is 21 but i did worry earlier since so many of his friends were nabbed.
First it, seems like they got serious about handing out citations around 2005. That’s when it started to approach 1000 per year. I remember looking up other big state schools and finding nothing like it. Anyway, PSU also does “pulse” surveys pretty regularly, measuring the percentage of kids who drink. It approaches about 85% and if I remember right, it hasn’t budged in years.
My point is that they should use their resources more effectively. Set up checkpoints and nab the drunk drivers. Arrest the kids who are making trouble. Busting a dorm party and giving citations to everyone is just stupid. Nabbing kids quietly walking home makes no sense.
Bottom line, the local practice of the cops combined with the strict judicial system can make it a nightmare for a underage student who drinks even just one beer or attends a party with beer in the room. Yeah, you say, just say NO, but that’s hard to do when over 8 out of 10 are taking part. So maybe, the answer is, just don’t go to PSU. That would be my take. I had NO IDEA that this was the scene there…I must say I really have a problem with the approach. Watching my friend’s kid play video games and mow a few lawns last summer because he couldn’t get a job (no driver’s license) sealed the deal. This doesn’t work.</p>
<p>My neighbor lost a daughter to a drunk driving accident. She’d trade places with your friend in a heartbeat. Watching your kid mow the lawn with no driver’s license sounds like heaven compared to the hell they’re in.</p>
<p>^^^
Drunk driving is not equivalent to drinking a beer and walking home. That’s my point.
I actually think drunk driving penalties should be toughened up. Take away the license for years. Lock em up. There’s no excuse. It’s a mistake…yeah…but one that can cause loss of life.
I repeat, busting a 19 year old for drinking a beer and WALKING home is stupid, IMO. Taking away his license for doing this makes no sense. (Next time, he might just drive to better avoid the police.).
Concentrate on the serious infractions…busting dorm parties just means there’s a few more drunk drivers out there that they’re not catching.</p>
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<p>There is a difference between busting a kid for drunk driving and busting them for underage drinking. One poses a direct threat to a number of people; the other does not necessarily. I had a friend who had been drinking a bit at a party and was waiting for a bus to take him back to his dorm. A supposed “college student” also at the bus stop approached him and started making small talk. They chit-chatted a bit and my friend mentioned that he was returning from a party. At this point the “college student” pulled out a badge identifying him as ALE (state alcohol agent), breathalyzed my friend and cited him for underage drinking. </p>
<p>Sounds crazy but this happens all the time down here. All too often the responsible drinkers are the ones that get penalized by the state…Prior to our prom when I was still in high school we had an assembly in which an ALE agent stated that anyone who served as a “designated driver” was liable to face criminal charges if they were pulled over by police. After prom, guess what happened? No one wanted to DD, and more people ended up driving after they had been drinking.</p>
<p>Been through this myself. Yes, those are the POSSIBLE consequences. Get an attorney, and if she has a clean record, it is likely that she will get some sort of a deal with the district attorney. Likely have to go to a alcohol program and do community service. I believe what you have there is the maximum possible penalty. </p>
<p>The attorney can tell you what the best way is to handle the situation. It is unfortunate but a number of these “minor in possession” charges are given without the evidence in force. The problem is that if it comes down to your D vs the police officer, the po wins out most of the time. It really depends on how that court looks at this. </p>
<p>I know of two cases (one of them my kid) where the citation was given when the kids were not drinking at all. They were at the wrong place at the wrong time which was what happened with your daughter, but she was indeed drinking. Even a trace of alcohol is considered underaged drinking, so she is guilty of that.</p>
<p>I agree that our society should separate the drunk driving (underage or otherwise) issue from the underage drinking (without driving) issue. Both are issues but they are separate issues.</p>
<p>I would caution parents and students to be aware of the local patterns by police AND the judicial system. The primary judge in State college was interviewed in the school newspaper a couple of years ago. While he is open to programs that seal criminal records for first offenders (ARD)- he is adamant that license suspension is “automatic.” Lawyer or no lawyer.<br>
Removal of a drivers license is a big deal. Regardless of the sealing of the criminal record, it goes on your drivers record for 10 years as an alcohol offense. Just like a DWI. This seems crazy to me but I’m not making the laws…or enforcing them. Again, beware. Local practices are very different…even within the same state.</p>
<p>May I add a situation, since the last posts? My daughter attends a large Virginia university. As she was approaching 21, but still underage, she was standing with some people at a tailgate in the crowded parking lot on campus and was approached by a plain clothesed police officer from a neighboring town. He cited her. He ignored the others. She looks young for her age. She was holding an empty cup. This was a first offense. Long story short: the court allowed her to pay a fine and sign up for several classes she would need to drive a distance to get to; she had to ask for them to be postponed, on account of needing to spend a semester at home; the following fall, she returned to the school and began attending the classes - but if you were a little bit late, they would not let you in and if you miss two classes, you have to begin all over again. She began all over again, but was late once or twice and had an exam to study for the one night… they would no longer permit her to go to the classes and sent her a notice that her drivers license is now suspended, along with a fine of 500.00. She tried to ask the judge for a re-hearing, but it was refused and he never even let her speak when in front of him. Like the previous poster, this did not involve driving in any way.</p>
<p>Her license was issued from our home state, not in Virginia. Does this mean it is suspended in our state, as well? Since, unlike the OP, our daughter’s license was suspended, will this also mean her driver’s insurance shoots through the roof? We cannot afford an attorney to help get this off her record so it doesn’t haunt all her job applications for years to come. So, from what I read above, from an emplyee background check, she might as well have had a DUI??? And this is a state where I read that college newspapers are not permitted to refuse ads from alcohol sellers to protect freedom of speech.</p>
<p>Much as it might sting financially, I think she needs a consultation with a local lawyer.</p>
<p>She also needs a pretty harsh talk. You don’t come “late once or twice” and skip court-ordered sessions. That’s a great way to end up in jail. Short of ending up in the hospital, there isn’t much in the way of an excuse. “I had a test the next day” doesn’t cut it. She needs to understand that judges are serious and most don’t have a lot of tolerance for this kind of behavior. This isn’t like skipping a yoga class.</p>
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Was she, or had she been, actually drinking alcohol? It’s not clear from the post. </p>
<p>If she was and simply failed to meet the strict criteria for the court’s compromise sentence (ie the classes) then there isn’t much ground for her to stand on. </p>
<p>The court isn’t required to be lenient and could have just issued the fine and licence suspension up front in the first instance. If they gave her a break, she failed to uphold her part of the deal, and then the court simply turned around and gave her the original full sentence them I’m not sure you’re expecting to happen here…</p>
<p>If her license is suspended in Virginia, she may not drive in the Commonwealth. They will report it to your home state, but until they do and the state takes the action to suspend as well, her license is still valid in your home state.
Check the home state laws, some states will not impose a suspension that extends beyond the suspension of the issuing state. Which could mean no effective suspension in the home state if the notification and subsequent action are at a snail’s pace.</p>
<p>in high school its the same way. if you are at a party where there is drinking then you get cited for underage drinking.</p>
<p>no matter what. sometimes they will do breathalyzers but the fact that you are knowingly at a party with alcohol does it for cops here.</p>
<p>(its happened to my friends)</p>
<p>I’ll also say that virtually every kid so ticketed around here insists that they had just gotten to the party.</p>
<p>I have to say, I think the underage drinking penalties for college kids are WAY out of proportion ( assuming they are NOT driving - then, throw the book at them), but at the same time, I think it’s interesting that all of these tales involve the “kid who had 1 beer” or the “kid who just happened to be there.” I just don’t buy it. Regardless, for a first time offender who has a clean record, judges will usually reduce a sentence to a small fine and, potentially, some alcohol edu. classes. </p>
<p>On a separate note to the poster complaining that her child was kicked out of alcohol ed classes and ordered to pay a $500 fine - c’mon. Your kid was already given a break and couldn’t manage to make it on time. And the kid had two chances. Unbelievable. It’s the real world. In many workplaces multiple late arrivals could mean dismissal.</p>
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<p>I had two drinking tickets in high school and probably consumed a total of three beers between them when I was cited. It happens-a lot.</p>
<p>I didn’t read the whole thread but I could only assume the school must be located in PA. There are so many kids that are facing these charges and it is occuring much more frequently in the past year or so. I would consult with an attorney to see what could be done but the PA law is pretty clear on where they stand with minors being in the presence of alcohol. The law is ridiculus and should be ammended…but then again I also think the drinking age should be lowered to 20.</p>
<p>I am right up there with anyone opposed to drinking on college campuses. But, call me cynical, but I do think that if there was no drinking on college campuses, the revenues of those towns would go down quite a bit. There would be less alcohol sales - heck we had to go in a grocery in this town on a Thursday night and there were kids lined up at customer service waiting to get their pre-ordered kegs… govt. income would go down because police would have less people to ticket. They use these kids for income and act like they are cracking down - but don’t REALLY. Just like towns who use gambling for revenue. They love that these colleges have football games with parking lots filled with tailgaters. This town does not just let the college handle it. They make revenue for the town by sending plain clothesed police to go after anyone who looks under 21. The fin adult citizens of the town still serve up all the alcohol by making it available easily. I was disgusted to read that a judge in the state refused to let the college newspaper block ads promoting alcohol in their publications and use free speech, once again, as an excuse. Of course kids should use their own self control to abstain from drinking. But society encourages it and we all know that. </p>
<p>The lesson learned for any of them is that a judge’s word must be taken seriously and, of course, a class mandated by a judge should not be attended late. Good lesson for future employment and life.</p>