University in Brazil

Applying to College
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Hello all, I am currently a senior in high school in the United States. My plans for the next two years are to attend community college. After that my goal is to attend a university in Brazil.

I am taking these next two years at the local community college because there is no tuition that I have to pay to attend or for books and it is a great community college, academically speaking. But also I am hoping to take these next two years at the community college to master the Portuguese language (I already know Spanish), to take classes that will prepare me for the Brazilian university entrance exam and to get a job on the side so that I can raise enough money to support myself in Brazil.

My intention is to start an environmental career in Brazil. To be more specific, I want to make Brazil my home country. After studying the history, culture, and talking to my Brazilian godmother and some friends from Brazil, I just feel so enamored by the country and I want to do what I can to improve the well being of the Brazilian environment and people.

I don’t necessarily plan on transferring from community college to a Brazilian university in the sense that I spend two years at each institution. Community college is just, in my mind, to prepare me for a Brazilian university. So I would likely attend the Brazilian university for 4 years, which isn’t a problem to me.

I would like to attend the Universidade Federal de Uberlândia, which is a public university that charges no tuition, even to foreigners. I would like to study Environmental Health Management.

I have hinted to my parents about my plans, which they aren’t thrilled about. With time, I’m sure they will come around. But my financial bearing will not be dependent on them. Because the Brazilian real is about 1/3 the value of the US dollar, the money I will earn from working during my community college years will triple in value when I take it to Brazil. Furthermore, I plan on getting the necessary permits/visas that will allow me to legally work in Brazil while I attend university.

Now I know many will think, why not just transfer to a US university and study abroad for a year or a semester? Well the truth is I have no interest in an American college experience. I don’t care for having a dorm or fraternities or football games or for a liberal arts education (I have nothing against liberal arts, it’s just not my interest). Plus, tuition wise, it’s cheaper for me to go to Brazil then to a top in state public university. Also, I don’t particularly want to start a career here in the USA.

Can I have your guys’ advice, opinions, constructive criticism? I would immensely appreciate it.

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I grew up in Brazil, and graduated from a Federal University there. Have you considered your admission path to the school you want to attend? The admission process in Brazil is very different than that of American Universities, and there is a lot of red tape and bureaucracy that you will encounter. Make sure that you research exactly what you need to do to be admitted before you assume you can attend.

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Oh honey.

That’s just as well, since there is quite simply no way to do that.

Nor will you be able to prepare for the Vestibular (entrance exam) through community college courses in the US. And, unless your Spanish is already super-proficient, I would be surprised if you can get to full academic fluency in Portuguese through community college/self-study- at least, at the level required to do well enough on the Vestibular to be accepted.

Well, that’s a good idea, but how are you going to do it? As somebody who went through the process of getting visas to live & work in Brazil, I can tell you that it is very hard to do - even with back up from a company.There are several types of visas, and I don’t see an obvious one that you qualify for. Pro tip: Brazil has a de facto policy of treating people from other countries exactly as their citizens are treated by that country. The US does not make it easy for Brazilians to visit the US, and makes it very difficult for them to work in the US.

Moreover, as @mardong indicates, red tape and bureaucracy are an art form in Brazil, and few of the people that you will have to work with will have had experience of bringing in foreign students, so even if they are trying to be helpful it will be difficult.

Have you ever been to Uberlândia? to Brazil?

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@mardong @collegemom3717 I want to thank both of you for your input, I sincerely appreciate it. Let me clarify somethings. Firstly, this is my ambitious plan, my dream. This isn’t the only option I am considering but it is the most desirable one for me.

Secondly, the community college classes are meant more so to master the subjects present on the Vestibular and ENEM, rather than the structure. I plan on taking chemistry, physics, mathematics (I am already at a calculus level) and other such classes.

As for the Portuguese. I am fully fluent in Spanish (my family is from Mexico) and I have been self teaching myself Portuguese for the past year and I have a basic understanding of the language. Furthermore, I will be taking classes by next year, working with a tutor, reading Brazilian literature from the local public library, and taking a CELPE-BRAS course online to prepare me for a fluency test.

For the Vestibular and ENEM, I plan to rely on YouTube videos books, and past tests to practice for it here in the US. As my friends in Uberlândia have told me, there are comprehensive courses in Brazil available in preparation for these tests, which I would absolutely be willing to enroll in.

For visas, I will be frequenting the closest Brazilian consulate/embassy (only about an 1 or 2 away) for detailed information. From what I understand, if I receive acceptance from the university I wish to attend and have proof of that, then I would be eligible to apply for a student visa. This would allow me to stay in Brazil to study for a certain period of time which I would then renew. Also, as I understand, once in Brazil I can apply for a work permit as an international student so long as the work pertains to the field in which I would study at university.

Yes, I am aware of the bureaucratic setbacks that can occur, as many Brazilian students have pointed out to me. I am willing to persist through this. Furthermore, I will be visiting Uberlândia during the summer of 2018 (before community college begins) where I will visit the university in person to decipher how I can make this all work.

Can I get your guys’s advice on the visa process, life in Brazil, what Federal University experience is like, etc? I would greatly appreciate it and I greatly appreciate you all taking the time to offer constructive feedback. It means a lot to me.

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@AOGFRMSB I wish you the best of luck! I graduated from a federal university in Brazil about 30 years ago, so obviously things might be somewhat different now. A couple of things: International students are not as common as they are here. For several reasons, one of them being the vestibular, as previously stated. I am an American citizen, who grew up in Brazil. I went to a “college prep” school in Brazil which had the sole purpose of getting the students through the grueling exam. It might have changed by now but back then, the exam took place in 4 consecutive days. You would have separate exams for physics, chemistry, biology, math, history, geography, Portuguese (grammar and literature -including an essay) and foreign language which you should do great, as English is an option. Here in the USA History and Geograpghtvare not emphasized, so I would make sure I study that, including Brazilian history and geography. Skip US history as it will not be relevant. Think world geography and history, and Brazilian geography and history. The questions on the exam are written in a way as to “weed out” most of the students. They are tricky and require lots of preparation. Back then, all questions would have several multiple choice answers. They would have numbers in front of them: 1,2,4,8,16,32. You then needed to determine which answeres were correct (likely more than one answer would be correct), add their respective numbers, and then enter their sum in a grid. Your answer could be anywhere from 1-99. That means you have a 1% chance of guessing the correct answer. See what I mean?
I love Brazil, and have lots of friends there. I agree with you, the people in general, are to fall in love with! Always optimistic and happy. But there is the other side too… red tape, bureaucracy, things don’t happen seemlesly like they do here. It can be a great point of frustration. Changing a major or tailoring your curriculum (like you might do here) would be extremely difficult, to give you an idea. People are easy going, rules are very hard to bend (the legal way).

I would never suggest my children to go pursue a degree there. I know the “free” tuition is tempting. If it was a doable and practical thing to do, Brazilian universities would be flooded with kids from all over the world attempting to get a free education there. The reality is that only a very small percentage of the local population has access to that free education. You practically have to be prepared your entire school life to take the entrance exam. The ratios for entering college are on average 10:1, meaning only 10% of test takers get admitted. In some instances , you might be looking at 20-25:1. That is Ivy League acceptance rates for a mediocre education!
My parents are Argentinian, so I am fluent in both Spanis AND Portuguese. The languages ARE NOT the same. And knowing Spanish will not help you with the Portuguese (grammar, literature and essay)part of the exam. Sure it might be easy communicate with Brazilians if you know Spanish, but it is absolutely a completely different language.
As far as working in Brazil, salaries there are not great at all, especially if you do not have an advanced degree. So, IF you are allowed to work there, you would not be making enough money to support yourself by say, working retail or at a restaurant. That is a very American thing to do, In Brazil, your classes will most likely be all over the place (morning, afternoon and evening classes are common), and your course load will be heavier than the typical American course load. Finding time to work might be a struggle, and employers are not flexible like they are here. Labor laws are rigid. They are meant to “protect” the worker, but their unintended consequences are lack of flexibility.

I hope I gave you some food for thought. Do visit Brazil if you have a chance. Tour the university that you want to attend, their labs and infrastructure. Make sure you visit some schools here too to get an idea of the difference. Talk to college students there and ask them what they think of your plan. I am willing to bet most of them would like to have the opportunity to come to the USA for an education. In my opinion, you can still work with Brazil without going to school there. You have lots of opportunities here that you might be overlooking.

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One more thing regarding the value of money in Brazil. Even though the US dollar to Real value is 1:3, it does not mean that you will be tripling your purchasing power. Food MIGHT be cheaper in Brazil, but that’s about it. Goods are really expensive. I am not sure about housing. It will all depend of where you choose to live. Brazil is not a cheap country to leave in. Make sure you understand the value of money before you assume your money will somehow triple its value. It does not work that way.

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@AOGFRMSB, @mardong gives really great info & advice.

A student visa is just ordinary-level bureaucratic painful- there are a number of steps, but there is good information on them.Check to see if the prep courses qualifies for a student visa (not all short courses do)- you might have to go in on a tourist visa and then convert it; either way, you obviously won’t be eligible for a student work visa during that period. If your friends (or their contacts) are able to give you a job relevant (or relevant enough) to your course, that will make a big difference. Otherwise, I would not count on getting a student work visa anytime soon.

Visiting Uberlândia & UFU is a really good idea (see if you can find your way into sitting in on a class).

As @mardong says, you need to look at the cost of living & wages. On the income side, identify what degree-relevant jobs there are in the area for somebody with your qualifications, how you would get the job, and the gross/net pay. On the expense side, get info on costs for housing, food, transportation, utilities, socializing, health insurance, etc. It’s all very well to say that your money will ‘triple in value’, but 1) conversion rates change and 2) what will matter is how much things actually cost- if your money ‘triples’ but if the price in reais is 2-3 times higher, you haven’t come out much ahead. Brazil is not a cheap place to live.

You might also review the course you are applying to study closely- your post talks about an environmental career, but afaik, Environmental Health Management is more of a public health course (see course description: http://www.ig.ufu.br/gestao-em-saude-ambiental/conheca-o-curso), as seen in the course structure: http://www.ig.ufu.br/sites/ig.ufu.br/files/media/arquivo/matriz_curricular_gestao_em_saude_ambiental.pdf.

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@mardong @collegemom3717 Thank you! Thank you! I am so happy and grateful for all the advice.

For the past couple months I have compared the cost of living in Uberlândia (housing, utilities, food, etc) to the cost of living in other Brazilian cities. I have also compared it to the cost of living in my city. Uberlândia is far cheaper than my city and cheaper than most other Brazilian cities of its relative size. The type of apartment I am looking at is around US $200 to $500 a month (here apartment prices average to $1500 a month!). Utilities add another $100 to $200. Food (I am a vegan) would be very cheap as I see that meat and dairy are the most expensive foods and everything else is relatively cheap.

The salaries are

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@mardong @collegemom3717 Wow! Thank you all so much for all the detailed tips and advice! I am finding it immensely helpful.

I am aware that this plan of mine is very ambitious, risky and the odds are probably more against me than for me (but I will not give up), so I do have back up plans. They include attending other universities in Brazil, university in Uruguay, university in Europe in countries like Spain, Portugal, Germany, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Norway and university in New Zealand. As a student in the AVID program for 5 years now, I have had the opportunity to visit, explore and observe classes at countless universities here in the USA. But to be honest, universities here in the USA are not as appealing to me as universities in Europe or Latin America. American universities feel like expensive boarding schools to me while European and Latin American universities feel like independent learning centers with a foreign and new culture to me (which makes it all the more appealing).

For the past couple months now, I have examined the cost of living in Uberlandia and have compared it to the cost of living in Belo Horizonte (capital of Minas Gerais), the cost of living in other Brazilian cities similar in size to Uberlandia and the cost of living in my city here in the US. From what I have researched, the cost of living in Uberlandia is extremely cheaper than my city here in the US, significantly cheaper than Belo Horizonte, and slightly cheaper than a lot of Brazilian cities of its size. Food, to start with, is quite cheap and from my research will be even cheaper for me since I am a vegan because meat and dairy are the most expensive foods in Uberlandia while fruits and vegetables seem to be the cheapest. To rent a modest apartment in Uberlandia is about US $200 to $500 a month. Utilities add another US $100 to $200. Public transportation is cheap and according to my friends in Uberlandia, pretty efficient for mid size city standards and particularly efficient in the university area. I have money saved up now and will continue to earn more money during the next two years here in the USA. However, I will definitely do more research on employment for foreign students in Brazil in order to create a more succinct plan for a means of income while in Brazil.

As a result of self teaching myself Portuguese since the beginning of the year, I have most certainly come to realize that Portuguese and Spanish are not the same and have incredible differences. However, my self taught Portuguese studies, listening to Brazilian music, watching Brazilian Youtube content, and reading Brazilian poems has allowed me the ability to have a simple (albeit SLOW) and basic conversation with my Brazilian friends. While this is not sufficient enough for studying at a Brazilian university yet, it is a head start in my mind considering the fact that community college is still six months away (when I will start my formal Portuguese training).

Regarding Environmental Health Management, I precisely chose it because I felt that it was a nice amalgam of Public Health and Environmental Science. Looking at the specific courses, the Environmental Health Management program offered by UFU is most similar to the type of program I will be studying while at community college and while I expect their to be differences between the programs, I also know that there will be some level of continuity.

You guys have offered very poignant and informative criticism and advice, which I respect and I have taken into great consideration. Your advice has made me reflect, in particular, on the weaknesses of my plan (namely the visa process and foreign student employment in Brazil). I have taken the road less traveled by and your persistence and valuable advice has made me realize that although it is indeed a rare path to take as an American student, I am not alone in terms of help. So thank you very much!

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I am Brazilian and I studied in Universidade Presbiteriana Mackenzie for 3 semesters before transferring to a university in United States. UPM is a very good university, and even though it is not free, the tuition is not expansive, it could vary from 1,000 to 4,000 reais depending on the major and how many classes you register to. From my experience, Brazilian students usually take 6 to 8 courses per semester (I always took 8), but you can take less if it gets stressful for being in a new language.
I don’t think it will be sufficient for you just to prepare yourself by going to a community college, much less if it is not focused in getting you to be accepted in a Brazilian university. Good universities in Brazil, mainly the public ones, are pretty hard to get into. Maybe you could consider attending a “Cursinho” (a program that prepares their students to do the “vestibular”/ Brazilian SAT). This program can take 6 semesters, 1 year or more. You choose.
I hope you are able to study in Brazil. Studying abroad is amazing!
“I just feel so enamored by the country and I want to do what I can to improve the well being of the Brazilian environment and people.” Very sweet of you to say that!

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