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Uhm...because you're not a student there?
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<p>Only by the grace of God. The entire SEC makes me sick...</p>
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Take a look at this below...the 70,000 starting salary (low end) is more like 88K in the North East... not bad.
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<p>I was looking for BBA salary info for UF and I just happened to find this little tidbit. It looks like most MSF students at UF must come directly from undergrad:</p>
<p>MSF "Average Starting Salary: $50,000" </p>
<p>Source: <a href="http://www.cba.ufl.edu/docs/deansreport.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://www.cba.ufl.edu/docs/deansreport.pdf</a> (page 31)</p>
<p>On the good note, I noticed that the avg starting salary of people in the MSRE program was 75k, which is better than I expected. I plan on looking into that further.</p>
<p>If you want to make the argument that UF is a top 25 program but isn't based on GMAT scores, then many other top 50 programs with similiar profiles should be given the same consideration.</p>
<p>Take for example based on full time program:</p>
<p>UC Davis (46):</p>
<p>Fall 2008 Admissions Information
Application deadline: 03/12
Application fee: $100</p>
<p>Fall 2006 Admissions Statistics
Average GMAT: 671 (full-time), 610 (part-time)
Acceptance rate: 28.2%</p>
<p>Starting Salary
Average starting salary: $73,028</p>
<p>Rochester(36):</p>
<p>Fall 2008 Admissions Information
Application deadline: 06/01
Application fee: $125</p>
<p>Fall 2006 Admissions Statistics
Average GMAT: 667 (full-time)
Acceptance rate: 36.2%</p>
<p>2006-2007 Expenses
Tuition: $35,760 (full-time), $1,192 per credit hour (part-time)
Required student fees: $375</p>
<p>Starting Salary
Average starting salary: $79,104</p>
<p>U of Washington:</p>
<p>Fall 2008 Admissions Information
Application deadline: 03/15
Application fee: $75</p>
<p>Fall 2006 Admissions Statistics
Average GMAT: 679 (full-time), 669 (part-time)
Acceptance rate: 30.2%</p>
<p>2006-2007 Expenses
In-State Tuition: $17,300 (full-time), $14,805 (part-time)
Out-of-State Tuition: $27,000 (full-time), $14,805 (part-time)
Required student fees: $525</p>
<p>Starting Salary
Average starting salary: $84,089</p>
<p>Or even new programs like </p>
<p>UCSD Rady (started in 2003):</p>
<p>Full-Time MBA Profile
Entering Fall 2006</p>
<p>MBA Students enrolled: 58
Women 33%
International 34%</p>
<p>GMAT average 671 (Ph.D.s and M.D.s waived)
GPA average 3.2
Age average 29 (range 20 - 42)
Work experience average 5 years (range 0 - 14)</p>
<p>or unranked UCI Merage:</p>
<p>Fall 2008 Admissions Information
Application deadline: 04/15
Application fee: $150</p>
<p>Fall 2006 Admissions Statistics
Average GMAT: 670 (full-time), 571 (part-time)
Acceptance rate: 44.3%</p>
<p>2006-2007 Expenses
In-State Tuition: $25,175 (full-time), $22,167 (part-time)
Out-of-State Tuition: $36,450 (full-time), $22,167 (part-time)
Required student fees: $0</p>
<p>Starting Salary
Average starting salary: $72,263</p>
<p>None of these programs are ranked in the top 25 but all have similiar GMAT scores. Some even have lower acceptance rates than UF but that isn't what we are discussing here. The main difference between top programs H/W/S from other top 15 programs isn't really GMAT scores. These rankings can't assess leadership potential and quality of work experience quantitively which is why these rankings are so subjective. The best way to judge any program is where previous students have gotten jobs and how that fits with your career path.</p>
<p>I would bet that the reason that these schools aren't ranked so highly is that their starting salaries aren't so great RELATIVE to their region. Florida MBA's have the highest starting salary of any MBA in Florida, so relative to it's region, it is king. So, taking into account GMAT scores and regionally adjusted salaries, UF is easily a top 50 MBA. I never said it was top 25 YET. However, if UF grads start popping up in I-Banking jobs, don't be surprised if they are top 20 in the next 10 years. If you actually look at the number of "slots" (knowing that many schools are tied in a particular slot) they would have to move up, it would be only 8. I do agree, however that in order for this to happen, the career services will have to get in gear and start marketing the quality of students that UF is pumping out. If (and big IF) that happens, watch out. If I were in charge of the UF MBA's I'd look at beefing up career services like it was a sports program-I would scour the market for a proven career center leader at a top 15 MBA program and throw bags of money, steak dinners and hookers his way; whatever it takes to get him to Gainesville ;)</p>
<p>By the way, I wouldn't have a problem with U-Rochester being a top 25 MBA</p>
<p>I think that a more likely explanation is that the average GMAT score is a nearly meaningless statistic for comparing MBA programs.</p>
<p>670 is below the 90th percentile. Even if GMAT scores were meaningful for this sort of comparison, how could one argue that an <em>average</em> score below the 90th percentile for such a widely taken exam would confer some sort of elite status?</p>
<p>Also, what is it that you believe that the GMAT measures that would improve an MBA program through selecting students with higher average scores? Once one can comprehend the relatively plain English used in business writing and do the relatively simple quantitative methods taught in an MBA program, isn't it the things not measured by the GMAT that really matters?</p>
<p>On a related note, how much do you think that rankings must differ before there is a meaningful difference in program quality? Is this linear? That is, is the 5th program meaningfully better than the 7th? How would you evaluate the difference between numbers 37 and 39?</p>
<p>I realize that lots of people seem to assume that program #28 is better than #29, but 70% of MBA wannabes are scoring below 600 on the GMAT. It might be that many people lack the skills needed to critically interpret the rankings.</p>
<p>
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If you want to take Floyd down you have to catch him,
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<p>I think the GMAT is mainly used to gauge how dedicated an individual is and how much time a person is willing to put in to studying. It also gives them an idea of the individual's aptitude for each section (quantitative and verbal), but I don't believe that to be the main focus. Most of the actual content is rather unimportant (IMO).</p>
<p>Personally, there wasn't much on the GMAT that I had used since high school. I was really surprised when I saw a GMAT type question on "Are you Smarter than a 5th grader". While smarter individuals will tend to score higher, the people that usually score the best are the one who study their butts off for it.</p>
<p>I am not a fan of standardized tests myself. I took the GRE, not the GMAT so I was granted a waiver (already have an MS in chemistry). I scored a 1230 GRE and 660 on the GMAT Prep I took online from the ETS web site and I know I should have done better. Havng said that, GMAT scores are as valid for MBA's as SAT's are for college...not perfect but a "good" indicator. These are the reasons, specifically why I think gmat scores should be used</p>
<p>*They are the ONLY standardized metric available
*GMAT score is correlated to IQ. Not that this is by any means a perfect measure, but in general, a school with an average GMAT of 700 has smarter people than a school with an average GMAT of 640-in general. The caution to that is the part time numbers where students are busy with life, kids, work, etc and can't focus on studying as much so the scores don't correlate as tightly.</p>
<p>At Florida, interestingly enough, the scores for the MBA students are
~680 for full timers
~610 for part timers who are successful in their jobs already
~600 for Exec. MBAers- Proven successful leaders and managers</p>
<p>I agree that GMAT score doesn't = success, but in general, it's a good indication of either raw smarts or dedication.</p>
<p>As far as looking at the rankings, I completely agree that when looking for an MBA program, one must look at "clusters" of potential schools rather than absolute rankings.</p>
<p>Really Old School,
The Median GMAT for Florida is 680 or ~90 percentile. On raw intellectual power, we compete with the best. Period. I wouldn't doubt for a minute that this was a target score, 90th percentile sounds better than 89th. Any school with an average GMAT of 640+, in my pinion admits very bright students as a general rule. Brains does not guarantee success, but when coupled with a proven track record of career success, I'd say that High GMAT + accomplished applicant = great potential. The degree of accomplishment, once a threshold GMAT score is reached is what separates the top MBA programs from each other, in my opinion. U-Florida, really being the ONLY Major player in the state, will continue to attract better and better students. Like I said before, I would replace the career services with a team having a proven track record and the indiustrial ties of a top 15-20 MBA school. I honestly think that this is the only missing piece of the puzzle.</p>
<p>As far as Florida receiving the largest gift in school history ($50 million--see post #15), there must be something good going around.</p>
<p>See this message out of the University of Virginia:</p>
<p>From: John T. Casteen III, President
April 17, 2007</p>
<p>I write to share some good news. Earlier today, Frank Batten Sr., one of the University's most loyal supporters, made an extraordinary gift of $100 million to create the Frank Batten School of Leadership and Public Policy. This is the largest gift in the University's history, and it has been committed for a most ambitious new venture.</p>
<p>U.Va. began with one man's vision of a great public university as the 'bulwark of the human mind' for our state and nation. It has from its earliest days sought to educate young people in the knowledge and skills -- what Jefferson called useful science -- that sustain individual liberty and our Republic's freedom. Mr. Batten's gift, intended to help cultivate future generations of leaders dedicated to the common good, will both preserve our democratic traditions and inspire the next generation and those that come after to live up to the vision that gave this place its first breath.</p>
<p>The Batten School -- the first new school to be established at the University since the Darden Graduate School of Business Administration was established 53 years ago -- will join a distinguished list of 10 University schools, many of which are ranked among the best in the nation. The intent is for the school to be closely aligned with many of the University's schools, including law, business, medicine, engineering, and education, as well as with key programs such as politics, economics, and applied ethics.</p>
<p>As a fellow member of the University community, I knew you would want to know about this transformational moment in our history.</p>
<p>John Casteen</p>
<p>To read more about today's announcement, go to:
<a href="http://www.virginia.edu/uvatoday/%5B/url%5D">http://www.virginia.edu/uvatoday/</a> </p>
<p>P.S. I was forwarded this by someone I know who goes to Virginia</p>
<p>Fact: Public flagship universities are on the rise. It will take about a decade for the general population to appreciate it though.</p>
<p>-UVA, UF, UGA, etc...</p>
<p>It was confirmed by the state. During the 2007 Session they matched the gift, and made it a grand total of $50 million. This is going to be invested into a world class facility, and many eminent scholars.</p>