University of Michigan or Northwestern?

College Search & Selection
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<p>I am from the Chicago area and attended one of better high schools in the area, if not one of the top two or three. Virtually no one from my high school went to Northwestern straight from high school, although a number did end up transferring to the school after being disappointed somewhere else. At that point, it was a good close to home option. Many, however went to Michigan right our of high school, which was and is quite a draw because of its competence in so many varied fields and of the nature of its college experience. Evanston can't compare to Ann Arbor as a college town. Illinois is an excellent school, so for student in the top 1/5 of a competitive Illinois high school, drawing students to either Northwestern or Michigan is not an easy task. But Michigan did attract quite a few - again, it is the more quintessential college experience, and has an incredible alumni network. I now live in the east coast and Northwestern is quite a draw, but in terms of resources and the opportunity for a college experience, Ann Arbor continues to hold all sorts of appeal. I trained for my sport at Evanston high school and at Northwestern often (and with kids from neighborhoods in Evanston not inclined to be on College Confidential), so I have more than a casual acquaintance with Evanston. </p>

<p>And by the way, the business school rankings are meaningless at the level of Ross and Northwestern (my father teaches at NU's business school). Graduates of either program currently enjoy outsize salaries not in any way justified by their skill but rather as a manifestation of the filtering for intelligence process that these two excellent and competitive schools provide. Bottom line is that either place are in the top 5 schools in the midwest - make a choice on where you would be happy.</p>

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<p>^^Theres also, you know, the - must "get the hell out of here" syndrome. I mean, one of my good friends is from Michigan, could have easily gotten in, but didn't even chose to apply. He did NOT want to spend more time in Michigan. I'm sure for a certain number of your classmates, Michigan had an extra appeal over NU because they couldn't virtually see their house from their dorm window.</p>

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<p>mam1959,</p>

<p>Your experience or claim is interesting. Are you sure your opinion isn't clouded by your affiliation with Michigan?</p>

<p><a href="http://www.imsa.edu/learning/cac/academics/profile/profile2008.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.imsa.edu/learning/cac/academics/profile/profile2008.pdf&lt;/a> shows where graduates from Illinois Mathematics and Science Academy (IMSA) mostly went for the past 3 years (see the last page). Northwestern has the second largest IMSA graduate enrollment (behind the flagship state U, Illinois). Michigan isn't even on the list. IMSA has the highest SAT average in Illinois (#3 public in the nation based on 2004 data (average=1395)).</p>

<p><a href="http://www.collegeboard.com/prod_downloads/about/news_info/cbsenior/yr2007/IL_07.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.collegeboard.com/prod_downloads/about/news_info/cbsenior/yr2007/IL_07.pdf&lt;/a> shows that Northwestern is the 2nd largest recipent of SAT scores reports from Illinois students. Michigan is a distant 5th. </p>

<p>Hmmm...maybe your school is just very different and I am afraid your experience just isn't representative, assuming you haven't even been misinformed. :rolleyes:</p>

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<p>Good find Sam BUT most Illinois kids take the ACT, by far. As UM has no problem using the ACT perhaps the data is a bit skewed for just the SAT.</p>

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<p>Northwestern has no problem using ACT either; in fact, >50% of their class submit ACT.</p>

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<p>My point was that only 11,000 took the SAT while over 140,000 took the ACT. The score recipient distribution could be far different for a number of reasons.</p>

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<p>^Thanks..I didn't know there's such a huge difference. But I actually just found that the Illinois students who took SAT are of higher caliber (the SAT average is higher than what one would expect based on IL ACT average and the largest out-of-state recipents are mostly top-50 schools, including Yale, Stanford, and Harvard). That makes sense because if the ACT is their default test, then the ones taking SAT are probably the more ambitious or high achieving group--the very group that mam1959 was referring to.</p>

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<p>mam1959:</p>

<p>I'm personally a big fan of Ann Arbor and believe it’s one of the great college towns out there. But Evanston (like Chicago) is not now what it was when you were a student 25, 30 years ago. Back then, Evanston was a pretty sleepy suburb best known for not only NU but also for headquartering the national Women’s Christian Temperance Union. But the town is certainly no longer dry. The “Dining Capitol of the North Shore” now sports more than 80 restaurants. Brand new, gleaming high rises have transformed the downtown. Another 49 story building was just given town approval. Stores, coffeehouses, nightclubs have moved in to fill this huge new need.</p>

<p>If I had to choose between Evanston and Ann Arbor, I’d personally choose Ann Arbor. But because students have to choose between Ann Arbor and Evanston/Chicago, I’d certainly change my vote. Chicago offers phenomenal opportunities to NU students. And within a 20-40 minute El ride from campus, you can reach all it has to offer.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
That makes sense because if the ACT is their default test, then the ones taking SAT are probably the more ambitious or high achieving group--the very group that mam1959 was referring to.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>yes, kids who know they are going to stay in-state for school are not going to take the SAT. the top students who are going to be applying to east coast schools (where the SAT is the predominant standardized test) are going to be taking the SAT, and more of these kids are also applying to northwestern.</p>

<p>negating what you claim, mam. but we would have taken what you said with a grain of salt, anyway, because it was based on personal and biased observation</p>

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<p>By the way, if you go to new trier, which can strongly make the case for "best public school in the chicago area," you might want to check out this article:</p>

<p>"New Trier's favorite early decision schools are still in: University of Pennsylvania, Northwestern University, Washington University in St. Louis, Cornell University, and Dartmouth."</p>

<p>"Some schools, like New Trier early decision favorite Northwestern University, make it more difficult and stressful for students ready to hit the process early."</p>

<p>"Northwestern University, which saw 132 applications from New Trier and doled out 44 offers"</p>

<p>132 applications... that's effectively over 12% of the graduating class of the arguably best public school in chicago applying Early Decision to northwestern.</p>

<p>Early</a> decision: pros and cons :: Schools :: PIONEER PRESS :: Evanston Review</p>

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<p>Data for ACT score sending by state. Pretty interesting. UM not even on the list which surprised me, while UW is pretty well up the list for Illinois.</p>

<p>ACT</a> National and State Scores for 2007: Average ACT Scores by State</p>

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<p>I second Bala. Evanston is more interesting and happening than it was 10 years ago, let alone 20-30 years ago. I went back in 2006 and I saw a lot of stores and restaurants in downtown that weren't there in 1999; I got kinda jealous. ;) The theatre complex in the middle of downtown was also new to me. From what I gathered, Evanston's home price in Aug-Oct 2006 was up 20% from the year before, unlike most other Chicago suburbs where it stayed flat. Now, it's a buyer's market just like the rest of the nation but the price hasn't really gone down much. I don't know what the rent is now but according to <a href="http://www.colfaxrealty.com/colfaxrealty/guides/ColfaxGuideEvanston.pdfin%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.colfaxrealty.com/colfaxrealty/guides/ColfaxGuideEvanston.pdfin&lt;/a>, even a studio went for $700-$1500 a month in 2006.</p>

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<p>^barrons, i was trying to look for that. you beat me! ;)</p>

<p>i am looking at the illinois table now. what is "college readiness standards ranges"? is that ACT score range? i thought i was until i saw the numbers for uchicago. they seem surprisingly low and makes no sense.</p>

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<p>I think it is similar as it tracks the ACT range. </p>

<p>I used to live in Evanston back in the 80's and loved it there. First place was near Dempster L stop and then moved out to a home in Northwest Evanston.</p>

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<p>by the way, for those who have said the michigan budget cuts aren't hurting UofM, check this out:</p>

<p>"This occurred during a year when the institution’s state support was cut 10 percent and when it was forced to make $37 million dollars in cuts that included layoffs and restrictions on faculty hiring."</p>

<p>page 7: <a href="http://www.ilr.cornell.edu/cheri/wp/cheri_wp49.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.ilr.cornell.edu/cheri/wp/cheri_wp49.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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<p>
[quote]
How expensive it is to judge individuals as individuals, rather than to use ... the now prohibited University of Michigan undergraduate point system, became evident to the University of Michigan this past year. Michigan spent $1.8 million more dollars evaluating applicants for undergraduate admissions than it did the year before, an increase in cost of 40%.11 This occurred during a year when the institution’s state support was cut 10 percent and when it was forced to make $37 million dollars in cuts that included layoffs and restrictions on faculty hiring.

[/quote]

He was talking about what happened back in the year 2004. That's part of the reason why Mary Sue Coleman kicked off the Michigan Difference Campaign.</p>

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<p>$37 million dollars in cuts sounds like a lot, but U-M worked hard to do it in ways that impacted students as little as possible. In a place as big as this, there are loads of ways you can realize cost savings.</p>

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<p>^^^ like american airlines eliminating one black olive from their first-class salads to save $50,000 a year</p>

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<p>I knew something was missing on my salad. No more AA for me.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
I have many friends at Mich that chose it over Northwestern because its considered more prestigious (they're international kids though). So your claim is false. Both are equal prestige wise.

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<p>Int’l “prestige” is largely predicated on graduate research programs, which is why UCB is often considered Int’lly to be a better school than Stanford (which wouldn’t be the case for w/in the US).</p>

<p>
[quote]
You mean the Mildcats?

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<p>How many conference championships in FB have the Bears won in the past 10 or so years?</p>

<p>
[quote]
I am from the Chicago area and attended one of better high schools in the area, if not one of the top two or three. Virtually no one from my high school went to Northwestern straight from high school, although a number did end up transferring to the school after being disappointed somewhere else.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Huh? While there certainly are those students who want to “get away” from home – NU always has a significant no. of students from New Trier HS (which is pretty much in its backyard) and is generally considered the best HS in Illinois.</p>