<p>coolcat08, definitely visit Penn if you can and, ultimately, decide which school feels best to YOU. You really can't go wrong either way.</p>
<p>And never forget the other important lesson of this thread: for the best Buffalo Wings, go to BUFFALO!</p>
<p>come visit Penn and let it work its magic on you ;)</p>
<p>Northwestern is a wonderful school, but the storied University of Pennsylvania it is not</p>
<p>Anyone who thinks Philly is a better city than Chicago is plain nuts.</p>
<p>If Chicago were on the East or West coast, it would be the BEST city in the US.</p>
<p>And I say this as a New Yorker who grew up in Pennsylvania.</p>
<p>I don't doubt that Chicago is a spectacular city. But once again, a spectacular city does not a spectacular college experience make.</p>
<p>Go see a Blues Brothers/Rocky double-feature, then decide. I think this is a no-brainer for Northwestern if the city's merits are the turning point. Big 10 vs. Ivy League? No contest. View of Lake Michigan vs. view of Camden? No contest.</p>
<p>Isn't the whole point of Rocky to show a depressed deindustrializing Philadelphia circa 1970s?</p>
<p>Philadelphia of the 2000s is not the Philadelphia of the 1970s. See the most recent (circa 2007) Rocky, "Rocky Balboa" for further proof. Rocky is running a nice gentrified Italian restaurant in a nice gentrified part of Philly, if I recall</p>
<p>And you can't see Camden. That's two rivers away, bro. Penn faces a river, and it will soon have a massive Penn Park facing that river. And yes, it will be awesome.</p>
<p>Big 10 vs. Ivy League? Agreed, no contest--in favor of the Ivy League. The most marvelous league/marketing move in collegiate history.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Philadelphia of the 2000s is not the Philadelphia of the 1970s.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Philly of the 2000s is going to lose more people than they did in the 1990s. Not sure about 1970s though.</p>
<p>"If Chicago were on the East or West coast, it would be the BEST city in the US."</p>
<p>Yeah, but it ISN'T on the East or West coast. Lake Michigan is nice, except for when those nasty little fish wash up and die all over the shoreline and stink all summer! The Atlantic Ocean offers a little more, except for when the used Hypodermic needles wash up.... Cities have flaws and locations have flaws (well, maybe not San Diego...) Northwestern isn't IN Chicago. Don't forget that. If someone wants a suburban school, it's the clear pick. If you want a vibrant, urban school, Penn is the pick. The view is of the Philadelphia skyline. Unless we are talking basketball, Ivy trumps Big Ten.</p>
<p>MWC,</p>
<p>Although Northwestern isn't "in" Chicago, it's bordered by it on the south. It's so close that it's unnecessary to be so annal about the distinction. This is like saying Pasadena isn't in Los Angeles. UChicago is in Chicago and while it's a lot closer to downtown Chicago, it's no easier to go to the nice neighborhoods in the Northside from there than from Northwestern. Besides, Evanston is a happening town with over 200 specialty shops and 110 restaurants.</p>
<p>I know, Sam. I lived in Chicago..... Evanston is not Chicago. Evanston is fine. It is "happening", but it is not Chicago and traffic is horrible to get there. Many students stay put in Evanston. I just think this is a silly argument because Penn IS in Philadelphia, for better or worse. I have a lot of familiarity with both cities. I think Chicago is a city that works better than Philadelphia does, but it really lacks the history. It also is a LOT colder, although both are bad climates in my opinion. I think midwesterners are friendlier and nicer than the people in the northeast- it's just a different environment. If you want a "real" city school, it's Penn.</p>
<p>Look, if someone's looking for a school that's truly incorporated in the fabric of the "happening" (to borrow MOWC's term) parts of its surrounding city forget Penn and Northwestern. Look at Berkeley, NYU, Harvard, BU, Cooper Union, Georgetown, etc. Walk out your door and find a host of opportunities that specifically cater to college students. </p>
<p>Philly offers great opportunities but the immediate environs of Penn are not where you'll find them. While getting to great off-campus places may take more than a simple leisurely stroll, they are easily reached, though, and that relative proximity is a plus for the school. </p>
<p>Northwestern's immediate environs offer much more in both variety and number, catering as much to local residents as to students. The Evanston of today, MOWC, is still very different from the one you once knew. This "suburb" with almost 100,000 people has dozens and dozens of restaurants and watering holes congregating in a downtown that borders campus. High-rises have sprouted over the past several years to the chagrin of many long-time private home residents. Students, though, are generally, and understandably, happy with the growth. The downtown that has been developed now dwarfs many independent small cities. </p>
<p>Evanston still doesn't come close to "happening" like its adjoining neighbor to the south. But why are people on this thread arguing driving time? Why talk about the Loop? NU students head south and U Chicago students head north - pretty much equal distances, by the way - usually carless - to visit the north side music clubs, comedy clubs, and bars that are found in "happening" areas like Wicker Park, Bucktown, Wrigleyville, Lincoln Park, Old Town, etc. (certainly not the Loop). And they take the El. Noisy, antiquated, but cheap and reliable, i.e. student friendly. It will get you pretty much anywhere you want to get in Chicago door-to-door from stops adjacent to Northwestern's campus. Evanston may technically be a suburb, but the El threads through it just as it does the rest of Chicago. And the distance from NU to Wrigleyville, for example, is similar to travelling from Columbia to Soho or the East Village.</p>
<p>Students at both schools enjoy lots of city opportunities but both will require a little effort. Ease of access, in my opinion, favors Penn. Northwestern and Chicago, I believe, offer much broader and deeper off-campus choices, only rivaled by NYC.</p>
<p>"The Evanston of today, MOWC, is still very different from the one you once knew. This "suburb" with almost 100,000 people has dozens and dozens of restaurants and watering holes congregating in a downtown that borders campus. High-rises have sprouted over the past several years to the chagrin of many long-time private home residents. Students, though, are generally, and understandably, happy with the growth. The downtown that has been developed now dwarfs many independent small cities."</p>
<p>As someone who grew up in Philly, now lives in Chicago, and has a soft spot for both NU and UPenn (my 2 favorite colleges evah), I have to agree with Bala's assessment. I don't know when you last lived in Chicago, MOWC, but Evanston today is very different from the Evanston of 20 years ago, where what was available to students was merely a handful of mediocre restaurant and shopping venues that didn't cater to students.</p>
<p>I think it's six of one, half a dozen of the other with respect to access to what each city has to offer ... either way, students will have to exert some effort to get to the parts of the city that offer the cultural and recreational amenities. In that sense, it's not like an NYU where you walk outside and it's all right there -- each of these campuses has a bit of a collegiate bubble around it. In which case, it comes down to personal preference for Philly over Chicago. Because I grew up in Philly, I know what it does offer -- but I can also see to someone not familiar with both cities, Chicago is more appealing on the surface.</p>
<p>So, OP...you're going to Penn, right? :)</p>
<p>OP's screename is coolCAT08. ;) what's penn's mascot anyway?</p>
<p>I love Chicago but you are getting me interested in visiting
Philadelphia for the art museums and to see the park system. The
parks in Chicago are great and we also have the Cook County Forest
Preserves, even in the city. </p>
<p>Evanston is on the northern border of Chicago so how could it take ten minutes to drive to Chicago? From NU campus it would take fifteen minutes, when you know your way. But you would be taking the 'el' anyway. </p>
<p>There is every kind of food in Evanston and in Chicago both. People
in the Chicago area are fat for a reason.</p>
<p>Climate: This past winter had frequent snow. In general though, the
'lake effect' snow heads more toward Michigan/Indiana. Look at a map.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Don't forget that. If someone wants a suburban school, it's the clear pick. If you want a vibrant, urban school, Penn is the pick. The view is of the Philadelphia skyline. Unless we are talking basketball, Ivy trumps Big Ten.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Here's MomoWC w/ her anti-NU shill again.</p>
<p>1st off, Evanston is hardly the "typical" suburb - w/its high-rises, it's more of a small city.</p>
<p>2nd, Philly is a couple of hours away from any beachside activity - NU has its own beach (plus another one adjacent to the southern part of the campus).</p>
<p>3rd - having grown up on the East Coast, there's a reason why Philly ranks below other East Coast cities like NYC and Boston - not to mention cities on the West Coast like SF (making your "argument" pretty weak).</p>
<p>And oh, NU's lakefront has a nice view of the Chicago skyline. </p>
<p>Speaking of UoC (which is in Chicago proper) - it takes longer from Hyde Park (than Evanston) to get to many points of interest in Chicago (for example, Wrigley Field is 7.5 miles from NU and over 13 miles from UoC).</p>
<p>Plus, the best bars in Chicago - in Lincoln Park and on Halsted are also closer to NU.</p>
<p>The same thing applies to Columbia - while it is in NYC/Manhattan, it takes a 30+ min subway ride to get to the "real action".</p>
<p>I LIKE Evanston! I just don't consider it a "city", which is a plus to me about Northwestern. I am simply saying the environs of Penn and NU are not that comparable. I am NOT anti-Northwestern at all. I happen to think UChicago is the superior academic school, but that is a different topic and there are lots of reasons why someone would choose Northwestern over Chicago.</p>
<p>K&S, I have never gotten the feeling that MOWC is anti-Northwestern at all.</p>
<p>Lets settle this in the NCAA w. lax championship game at 6 p.m. CT on Sunday! It's Northwestern vs Penn.</p>
<p>^^ You're on!</p>