<p>Sorry about adding yet another comparison thread. Im just completely torn between these schools. I plan to major in biochemistry. </p>
<p>I know a lot about the undergraduate opportunities at University of Pennsylvania, especially the Vagelos Scholars Program MLS thing which I got a letter about. Im trying to look at UPenn without the program though, seeing as theres a large chance I wont be able to keep up with it and drop out after freshman year. As far as the undergraduate opportunities at the other schools, I dont know much about UCLA and even less about UC Berkeley. Ive been to UCLAs campus and liked it a lot. I plan on visiting Berkeleys campus next week. I doubt Ill be able to visit UPenns campus. </p>
<p>My parents have about 100k saved up for school, anything more will be covered by student loans which I will eventually pay back. We are in an unfortunate position where our income bracket is such that we received no financial aid. We live in California, so itll be about 33k a year for the UC system and 55k if I were to go to Penn. My parents are strongly in favor of Berkeley, mostly because of the cost if I were to go to UPenn.</p>
<p>According to them, if I were to go to Berkeley theyd be able to afford study abroad programs etc. whereas if I go to UPenn they wont so I wont be going anywhere. But I think this is mostly just bribery to try and get me to go to the less costly school. </p>
<p>I got invited to the Traditions thing at Cornell and was also accepted to UCSB, UCSD (both with small scholarships), University of Rochester (20k/year), Loyola Chicago (17k/year), Fordham Lincoln Center (full ride), Trinity (full ride), and NYU. So if anyone has anything to say about the merit of those schools it would also be appreciated! UCLA, Penn and Berkeley are just my top three right now. If NYU had given me scholarship money I would go there in a heartbeat (the student life, culture, study abroad all matches me perfectly. I really wanted to go to a school in New York), but since they havent Im afraid I cant afford to consider it. </p>
<p>Penn is the best school out of all of these…by far. Did you receive any financial aid at all? The thing with the UC’s is that there are so many students; there is no way the professors can even remember each student’s name. At Penn, the classes are way smaller and if you’re in Vagelos, they’ll be even smaller. That is an extremely selective and prestigious program! Congrats! :)</p>
<p>My brother was put into this situation when he was a freshman as well. He had already SIRed to UC Berkeley when he was taken off the waitlist at Penn, so he was able to sample both universities a little bit.</p>
<p>From his purely anecdotal evidence, Penn’s dorms are much better than Berkeley’s, and the atmosphere at both colleges are about the same (extremely academically competitive). However, one thing you have to consider is that Penn is located on the East Coast, and this represents its own sets of pros and cons. My brother was able to undertake internships, research opportunities, and apply for jobs that he would not have been able to at Berkeley. The East Coast is much more densely compacted than California. You could potentially end up working and living in New York like you wanted to if you went to Penn. My brother visited the Big Apple numerous times just for fun. Berkeley is also a much larger school with much larger class sizes than Penn. Penn’s campus is very small compared to Berkeley’s.</p>
<p>However, Berkeley is by far the cheaper school in your case. Penn matched my brother’s tuition at Berkeley, so cost was not a factor him, so maybe you should petition your case for financial aid as in the above posts. And when push comes to shove, the differences in ranking and prestige between both universities are extremely slight. A degree from either institution will carry plenty of weight.</p>
<p>If it was not already apparent, in the end my brother chose Penn because he valued prestige. Personally, I would have chose Penn as well, but for different reasons. Choose Berkeley if you really can’t afford the tuition, either way you will be at a great university!</p>
<p>Congratulations, sbaum 1994, on all your wonderful acceptances! I am a current freshman who left the MLS program half-way through the first semester and have changed from biochem to molecular biology (and added classics, too). MLS is an amazing opportunity that I do not regret taking, at all. Biochemistry at Penn (even outside of MLS) is physics and chemistry focused, just so you know, whereas molecular biology is more biology and chemistry focused. The director of Vagelos MLS is also the dept chair of biochemistry (womp). You very well might stick with biochem, but you just as well could change your mind in college–that’s partially why it’s so fun! You should choose a school that you and your parents agree that you can afford but also one where you can obtain a good education regardless of your major. </p>
<p>That being said, I agree with your potential classmate above in that Penn has a more intimate classroom setting and more opportunities unless you are super motivated and ambitious as you would need to put more effort into befriending professors at the UCs. However, Berkeley’s chemistry is top-notch and better than Penn’s in some ways if you are dedicated.</p>
<p>Also, I have a friend at U of R and he loves it. He turned down Cornell for the more urban feel, smaller classrooms, and less-competitive spirit at Rochester. If they are giving you good aid, maybe you should look more into it! Their sciences are highly regarded and their med school is very good. Undergrads have access to graduate studies. Plus, Rochester offers a very loose curriculum and you can take classes that you want to take.</p>
<p>This is just a minor point, but it’s worth noting that study abroad costs the same as a normal semester/year at Penn, so that probably shouldn’t factor into your decision.</p>
<p>Thank you so much for all your replies! I really really appreciate it. Anything else anyone would like to say is most welcome.</p>
<p>I want to go to a big school where I can take advantage of all the opportunities there. I am definitely reconsidering Rochester. My heart is with Penn but I know I’ll be happy no matter where I decide. </p>
<p>I’ve also convinced my parents that we can get aid and that it is worth a shot. Just because we aren’t low income doesn’t mean we can’t get aid! So I’m setting up an appointment with a financial aid adviser.</p>
<p>For Penn study abroad you pay your regular tuition to Penn so the only additional factor would be the travel expense.</p>
<p>Also, you need to consider the fact that many UC students do not graduate in 4 years adding to your overall cost of attendance.</p>
<p>And, coming from California, my daughter loves Philadelphia, loves Penn, and she says the weather is not so bad. She also said Penn is not as competitive, nor as party, as its reputation. She was also accepted to UCLA and UC-Irvine and chose Penn over those and hasn’t regretted it.</p>
<p>She’s not biochem though - English major at CAS - “College of Arts and Crafts” :)</p>