<p>Having gone through disciplinary action with DS in sophomore year over a seemingly innocuous incident (different circumstances, excessive penalties), I have to agree with scansmom in post #58 that OP may not have all the facts. Something is missing from this story.</p>
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<p>I concur. But we are just speculating. No one has any idea of what will happen 4+ years hence.</p>
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<p>Professional schools ask about ALL disciplinary actions; ditto some employers. For sure, the explanation is simple and the transgression minimal, but IMO, if a local attorney can make it ‘go away’, there will be nothing to that needs to be explained 4 years hence.</p>
<p>Several thoughts. I do not think that an 18-yr-old is an “adult,” even if they are in the eyes of the law. They still need parental input. Be glad that your D (finally) came to you with this story. It is a good thing that she will confide in you. The punishment seems rather severe to me if the “crime” is as presented, but it is also possible that the school has had a problem with suicides and/or accidents, and so has this very strict policy. It is also possible that they have this strict policy on the basis of legal advice, so that people are less likely to be successful in suing them in the case of an accident or suicide. (In fact, I think this is likely.)</p>
<p>I would want to see the paperwork, and make sure that it spells out the innocuous nature of the offense. I would also want to make sure that both you and your D understand the precise terms of her probation. (I’m assuming that all of them got the same penalty?)</p>
<p>I would also point out to your D that her friend was monumentally stupid in a) taking pictures of something that you can be SURE they knew was a no-no, and b) posting them to Facebook, and c) not having her Facebook settings restrict photos to friends. Point out to your D that such pictures can come back to haunt people. Kids have been suspended from HS on the basis of photos of prom after parties. Employers are fully capable of doing a simple search. There is a lot to be said for PRIVACY and DISCRETION.</p>
<p>My S recently told me that in the spring of his senior year in HS, he and a bunch of his friends ran naked down the middle of Main Street in our very small town in the middle of the night. Apparently, although there was no traffic, someone saw them and called the police, and a couple of the stragglers almost got caught and had to spend an uncomfortable time hiding in the bushes. Naked, because they had also not had the wit to carry at least a pair of shorts with them, unlike everyone else. The other kids had to run back and get their clothes for them after the police gave up and left. It was about a mile in each direction. (A lot of them were track/cross country athletes. MaineLonghorn will get a kick out of this, since she knows the kids and the setting!) Now, this was IMHO a dumb but harmless prank, but just think if they had been caught and charged with indecent exposure or something like that. At least they didn’t take pictures! The things kids will do… :rolleyes:</p>
<p>Consolation, I agree that most 18 year olds still could use a lot of parental help. I am just stating the legal situation. As a parent, I would want to get all of the information on this matter if I am paying for the student and would insist on it. If the chiid were on his own, I would offer assistance and advice just the same, and even if s/he were older, but I still would want to get information other than what my child tells me. You need as much information as possible before you can come up with any opinion. So information is key to this. Who knows how much of this the kid has gotten right? After you get as much of the story as possible, you can decide what you want to do and work with the child, and work with him/her you must, because s/he is an adult in the eyes fo the law and consent will be neded to be involved. </p>
<p>The thing that would bother me about this whole thing is that there is also the possibility that what happened was far more serious with some issues involved that you may want addressed. You don’t know just getting the story from one person. You don’t know what the kid has omitted, down played or lied about. There might be something that truly needs intervention.</p>
<p>ITA, cpt, it sounds like more info is needed about this incident. I just think that the OP should keep it low key, if possible, to encourage future confidences.</p>
<p>I just noticed the OP’s screen name. Is the student at Brigham Young? The rules there (and the penalties) might be a bit different than at a more mainstream school, and the repercussions could be different post-college as well, if the student is LDS.</p>
<p>Or I could be way off base…just speculating.</p>
<p>she already stated not BYU…said was large NE campus</p>
<p>So I am guessing that the 8 years is the length of time the school keeps record of the disciplinary action, after graduation, and not a probation period which would be part of the sanctions or punishment…8 yrs would be in line with how long many other schools keeps these records on file after students graduate. But that has nothing to do with the disciplinary action and outcome which would be my more immediate concern.</p>
<p>We are all just stpeculating including the OP. Until she gets more inforamtion from other ssources than her student.</p>
<p>Two issues. First, being on probation will mean that a second violation may lead to suspension. Thus, one should take extra care to avoid potential risks such as being at places that may lead to alcohol violation etc. This happened to a son of a family friend. Secondly, it may be an issue if the student is interested in law school in which case the Dean of Student will be asked to fill a certificate of character and fitness. The student will also be asked on the application. Thus, one should have some sort of official record should an explanation be required. A poster has made a similar point, but perhaps more obliquely, in an earlier post.</p>
<p>LDS:
I’m curious. How will it benefit your daughter if you get involved?</p>
<p>Pasdad, I agree with you, good points. And I think that any parent who is paying for college has the right to demand from student that they request information on how to appeal, and that they share all information with parent.</p>
<p>i dont think you should worry… its nothing everyone makes mistakes…colleges understand that</p>
<p>The “8 years” ruling suggests your daughter might have run up against the Clery Act–this is a federal law that requires colleges to document crime on campus. Along with the scary stuff (murder, rape) they also have to track the number of incidences of liquor law violations by students and illegal substance abuse. Even if the “offending” students aren’t arrested or face criminal charges, if the college disciplines them they are required by law to note it in the student’s record and release it, on request, to potential employers and graduate schools for 8 years. So, for example, an RA catches a kid smoking a joint in his dorm–he gets brought up on college charges and the offense is on his record for 8 years.</p>
<p>Fond, I thought the Cleary Act only requires the institution to keep and maintain stats for 3 years, and to make the stats available to prospective students or employees of the institution, not to release to any prospective grad schools or employers.</p>
<p>I think you should defiantly appeal. And bring evidence that your daughter is a good person. Evidence such as grades, extra curriculars etc. My friends got a violation because she was out past curfew but they could appeal and get it off their records.</p>
<p>Looked at OP and skimmed rest of thread. From experience, I have this to say. Get your daughter to sign paperwork to release all records of this matter to you. Retain a lawyer to appeal. Strike one is usually no big deal, but strike two (and you don’t know when or how it can come) can be really damaging. We let strike one go, just like you are doing, and when a minor matter (strike 20 came) it had potential to really be damaging to our kid. We should have fought up front right from the start. This is NOT the college environment you remember from the 1970s-1980s. Colleges publish records online that never go away; so do local police departments. Take this seriously.</p>
<p>We have a family friend whose son “went up on the roof”, fell off, and died. He was a senior at a very selective university and NOT a conservative university. It was a matter of safety, not of conservatism on the part of the university. Needless to say, the liability for the university, not to mention the horrific tragedy our friends have born, says why these things may be taken so seriously. In my experience universities have orientations about what is and is not allowed, so kids know what they are doing to get themselves in trouble. All of that said, you could still look into some sort of reprieve, but I would not count on it if is was in fact a safety issue.</p>
<p>I am not sure that most schools would entertain an communication from an attorney. In fact many schools will state in their Judicial Site that no outside legal representation is allowed.
IMO the disciplinary record will not be seen by anyone outside the University…it’s very likely an internal record that is kept in case there are future transgressions, then the next disciplinary action would be more severe. As a matter of fact, there is no action at all here, right? If this happened last semester, one thing that she/you can do is log into her student profile and click on the different links, for example “view unofficial transcript”, “notes” “holds” etc. If there is no notation made about this on the academic record (which sounds like there wouldn’t be) that may bring you some relief.</p>
<p>I wonder if DD actually thought that this particular roof of a university building was a permissible place to be, a place that was open to the public or at least to any member of the student body.</p>