<p>
[quote]
show me how affirmtative action harms white people (or any other type of people) in any significant way
[/quote]
Sure. For every underqualified URM that gets in, a white person suffers. But, actually, affirmative action HELPS white women and hurts african americans. so if you want to go about rewarding white women, affirmative action is the way to go.</p>
<p>and once again, your speech about CT is ridiculous as well. not only would he be disgusted at your representation of him (he has tried to end affirmative action, as you admitted) it is, again, a single case. do you honestly think you can support a claim with <em>one</em> example of someone prominant. that's like arguing that dropping out of college is great because, hey, bill gates did it. and besides, if we're going to play this game, ebony magazine ran a feature that asked the most succesful black men how they got where they did and not one said or even mentioned affirmative action. they mentioned hard work and perseverance. and, you can't say they generally do. look at my study that i presented a couple times in this debate.
In fact, you should read the first chapter in Larry Elder's book. it will make you smarter. there is not one scintilla of evidence that affirmative action has helped blacks as a whole. in fact, "[that assertion is ] False, say Stephan and Abigail Thernstrom in "America in Black and White": " ... The growth of the black middle class long predates the adoption of race-conscious social policies. In some ways, indeed, the black middle class was expanding more rapidly before 1970 than after. ... Many of the advances black Americans have made since the Great Depression occurred before anything that can be termed affirmative action existed.""</p>
<p>here's some more from larry, but you really should read the first chapter of his book.
Black economist and ex-Federal Reserve Board member Arthur Brimmer studied the extent to which blacks owed their jobs to affirmative action. His conclusion: "I would say that most blacks I know did not get [their jobs] because of affirmative action, but it's impossible [to determine the exact number]."</p>
<p>Similarly, Ella Edmondson Bell, who teaches organizational studies at the MIT Business school, says that most blacks get hired through "determination [and] perseverance."</p>
<p>Jonathan Leonard, who teaches economics at University of California at Berkeley, said of affirmative action, "There's been some small effect, but certainly not worth all the rhetoric directed at it."</p>
<p>But hasn't affirmative action expanded the number of opportunities for blacks? Not really. Farrell Bloch, author of Anti-discrimination Law And Minority Employment, notes that affirmative action mostly rearranged the employment furniture. Pre-affirmative action, blacks tended to work for companies with fewer than 100 employees. Post-affirmative action, blacks tended to work for larger companies. Why? Big companies were under the gun to recruit blacks. Where did they get them? From smaller companies, or from workers who otherwise would have worked for smaller companies.</p>
<p>Affirmative action is also a big factor behind the higher than average drop-out rate among blacks in colleges and universities. In the California UC system, only 7.2% of minorities admitted under "special criteria" (code for affirmative action) graduated in four years, and less than 50% in six years. "White or other" students graduated at rates of 34.1% and 77.6%, respectively. This is the sports equivalent of athletes who could perform at the AA level, struggling at AAA ball. And those who could perform well at AAA, failing in the major leagues.</p>
<p>Now, how did black leaders go from rightfully demanding equal opportunity, to demanding equal results? After all, nowhere in the writings of Martin Luther King does one find the expression "affirmative action". In Ending Affirmative Action, Terry Eastland writes that former national Urban League head, Whitney Young, sought race based preferences. But his board resisted. The president of the Urban League in Pittsburgh said that if blacks push for race based preferences, the public would react with the following question: "What in blazes are these guys up to? They tell us for years that we must buy [non-discrimination] and then they say, 'it isn't what we want.'" A New York Urban League member flatly objected to a policy of "the business of employing Negroes 'because they are Negroes.'"</p>
<p>Today, South African President Nelson Mandela speaks out against "a culture of entitlement" and warns of "false prophets who seek to perpetuate the apartheid divisions and imbalances of the past, by presenting affirmative action as a program intended to advantage some and disadvantage others on the basis of race and color." </p>
<p>A recent article in "Destiny" magazine, the black conservative monthly, shows that the black-white income gap narrowed well before affirmative action took hold. In 1959, among intact families outside the south, a black family earned 78% of what a white family earned. Ten years later, black families earned 91% of that of a white family. In 1950, black college educated women earned 91% of the income of their white counterparts. By 1970, the earnings of black college educated women exceeded that of their white counterparts by 25%.</p>
<p>"Ebony" magazine ran a series called "If I Were Young Today," in which older black achievers gave advice to black youth. Their advice was straightforward, their optimism striking. Work hard, get an education, don't blame others, your time is now. The great civil rights and union leader A. Phillip Randolph said, "[Black] youth must offer the future the same things that white youth offer and they must have the faith that there is no basic racial difference in potential for achievement -moral, intellectual, or spiritual. The future holds great opportunity for those who are prepared to meet and face the challenge of this age of science, technology and industrialism and social, economic and political change."</p>
<p>Oh, the year of this "Ebony series"? 1963.</p>
<p>Notice anything? Mr. Randolph forgot to mention "affirmative action." Maybe he found it too..."divisive"</p>
<p>and about your last post: why is it idealistic? sounds to me like you should be working toward that -- something i support -- than something as controversial as affirmative action.</p>