<p>* Race has everything to do with. Class and race are sooo intimately related that one most certaintly affects the other. The problems of race and class are compounded on minorities.</p>
<p>Read "Savage Inequalities" by Jonathan Kozol *</p>
<p>I stand by my statements that skin colour does not affect your ability to take standardized tests. The quality of your secondary education might make a difference but not the colour of your skin. I'm a black student, I have 1550 SATs and 800/800/780 SAT IIs. So there.</p>
<p>race makes a big part of the socio part of socioeconomic
and statistically, it also makes a difference
schools (at least penn) try to be need blind for admissions, but in order for socioeconomic discrimination they would require financial information, which is only required if you apply for optional financial aid</p>
<p>If so, that most likely means that you come from a relatively wealthy family (because you're living in Canada). If so, you're not whom AA is meant to help. You're the exception.</p>
<p>There is the obvious correlation that everyone here sees between socioeconomic status and testing, etc, but there is (which should be very apparent as well) a correlation between race and socioeconomic status. I.e., the quality of secondary education, which affects performance of tests, is affected by class and race</p>
<p>but i support affirmative action (read previous posts)</p>
<p>eichef u hit the nail on the head - many african immigrants are the cream of the crop of their countries, and come to the United States "on a mission" so to speak. Its a very small, self-selected group of people, and they usually must be very well connected to score an american visa/green card.</p>
<p>my parents were refugees, but they enjoyed the help of the united nations high commission for refugees to get them american educations - my father had already been educated in the soviet union and in ethiopia, and my mother in ethiopia as well - the only reason the US would permit them entry was BECAUSE of their educations.</p>
<p>EiChief, I am pretty offended by ur statements. What you're saying is that black people can't do as well on SATs because of what? If you said poor people can't do well on SATs because they don't have the same quality of education, then I would agree with you. </p>
<p>Even ethioman has a 1550 on his SATs. So clearly, race does not affect the ability to do well on SATs.</p>
<p>Here: I'll outline it simply for you.</p>
<p>Poor people do badly on SATs (premise 1)
Most black people are poor. (premise 2)</p>
<p>Therefore,
being black must affect SAT score (incorrect conclusion)</p>
<p>yes but this guy is the exception, not the rule. and me, personally, i dont think eithopians immigrants are the same as african-americans. they're both black, and that's pretty much where the similarities end.</p>
<p>Obviously blacks need a boost (EVEN IF THAT BOOST HAS BEEN SHOWN TO HURT THEM LATER IN LIFE AND HELP NO ONE ELSE BUT WHITE WOMEN) because, umm, they're black?</p>
<p>sarcasm is only effective when people understand what you're talking about. How does it help white women? Who is choosing when they want equality?</p>
<p>not only black people get affirmative action, but people are only mad that black people are getting it. no ones ranting against native americans or latinos. interesting...</p>
<p>Davidrune and filmy: both of the answers to your questions (and your incredibly wrong inferences, filmy) can be found by looking back on the earlier pages of this thread.</p>
<p>stoned pandas, whatever lol, you got me, but we can still agree that most of the angry tantrums on this board were directed towards blacks. i dont think this is racism though, everyone just invests everything into this damn system and flips out if they think they might not get into whatever top university. just go with the flow fools, once you get to college youll see how wrong you are. read a hope in the unseen, its pretty enlightening.</p>
<p>"just go with the flow fools, once you get to college youll see how wrong you are."</p>
<p>i assure you that there are many in college who do not support race-based affirmative action.</p>
<p>I haven't read that book, but reading the reviews on amazon.com i came accross an interesting review:</p>
<p>Every American with any responsibility for educa- tion of any kind should read this book, and every employer. Most of all, white people who think racism is over, that blacks get all the breaks, should read this book. It is a powerful story of one young man, backed by a mother and other family with strong wills and belief in education, over- came the profound disadvantages that apply to most inner-city minority children and made it to a selective, Ivy League School. The young man has the qualities needed to succeed at Brown, but he must work incredibly hard, harder than most people are willing to do, to overcome the damage done to him by his poor schooling and **his surrounding anti-intellectual, anti-educational achievement subculture. **I see this as a searing indictment of the neglect of public schools that serve, or rather disserve, black children, as well as the decades-long neglect that has led to the anti-achievement values of so many of those children. Cedric Jennings is an example of hope, but overall, the story is depressing, and tells the reader that without true and massive commitment to schools, and to children, setting aside petty power squabbles, more generations of children will be lost to America. The chapters describing Cedric's experiences in high school, the days filled with sheer physical fear of other students who viewed him with contempt because he was smart and made good grades, who tried to drag him down to their level, are enough to cause this reader, a graduate of a middle-class, academically-oriented high school 30 yrs ago, where violence in the school day was just unheard of, to read in deep despair. This book is an all too-clear exposition of the depth of the division between middle-class white and poor black that has developed in the last few decades. I hope that state legislative and congressional leadership will read this and ponder its meaning.</p>
<p>THAT is what you have to fix. And you don't fix that by placing people in an environment that isn't suited for them, based not on the color of their skin, but by the content of their character.</p>
<p>i heart panda... anyways, the book pretty much follows the kid after he gets in due to aa and sees how he does, what he has to do, and the attitudes of his classmates towards him, its interesting. but yeah, at least we know theres a diversity of opinions at penn and other schools. :)
everyones entitled to believe whatever they want to believe, and i respectfully disagree. peace out, im going to the beach. (im on vacation, where else would a trust fund baby go?)</p>
<p>Why should you slap me? Am I challenging your ideas? Yeah, the logic does fall apart, but I don't blame you for having it.</p>
<p>I wish I could go to the beach, but this trust fund baby lives in Los Angeles and we're currently in our 2 weeks of winter so it's either go o the movies or chill or take your dad to the hospital at 6 in the morning, like I had to do today!</p>
<p>aww no, pandas dad get better. (presumably he's sick?) what am i still doing here... and this trust fund baby is moving out to LA as soon as she's done with this whole "school" business. rodeo drive and beverly hills seem particularly appealing to me.</p>