USC or Georgia Tech, please help

<p>May 1st is approaching, we need to make decision on one of these two schools; USC or Georgia Tech. My son is interested in engineering program, majoring in Aerospace. Here are the factors</p>

<p>From money point of view:
My son is national merit finalist. USC gives half tuition off, plus other Engineering scholarship, student loan, and so on. Our total cost is about $23000. George Tech gives very little, our total cost to attend Georgia Tech is about $27000.</p>

<p>From school rating:
Georgia Tech (Georgia Institute of Technology )
National 35
Engineering Programs 5
Aerospace 2</p>

<p>USC (Univ. of Southern California)
National 27
Engineering Programs 29
Aerospace 16</p>

<p>We visited USC, but not Georgia Tech. My son is 55% on Georgia Tech and 45% on USC. Any opinion or inside information on Georgia Tech or USC will be very helpful. We feel like this is a life time choice, hope to make a right choice for my son’s future. Please help.</p>

<p>This is a repost. Yesterday’s post has some rating error. This may affect the opinions.</p>

<p>Another consideration: We live in Oregon. Southern California is closer, better alumni network. From Oregon to Atlanta is at least 8 hours flight. However, Atlanta is closer to NASA, may have a better job opportunity.</p>

<p>huhu: I have posted a similar response on the UVA board (UVA v USC thread), but I have changed some of that response due to your son's interest.</p>

<p>We are from VA, and S applied to USC but not UVA. Nothing against UVA because it is a great school, but S just didn't see himself there. (Also, nothing against GT because it also is a great school, but as a disclaimer I have to admit I have UGA relatives, and there's a "little" rivalry there.) S had also spent part of a summer in Southern California and really liked it. He has narrowed his final list down to just a few schools, and one of them is USC. (USC also offered him scholarship money.)</p>

<p>Before visiting, I honestly had a bias against USC, thinking that it was a partying, rich kids, we-worship-football school. After visiting USC and meeting students, faculty, and admissions officers, I realize now that I was TOTALLY wrong. Yes, there are some of those types at USC (just like at all schools), but most students are not like that.</p>

<p>I'll try and not repeat info that you have received from USC. (I must mention here, however, the great Renaissance Scholarship that USC gives for students with diverse interests. Last year's winner was majoring in Engineering (not sure which one) and Opera. Where else would you find this but at USC!) Here are a few of our observations about USC:</p>

<ol>
<li>You already know that USC offers a wide variety of majors and minors, including over 150 majors and 120 minors. It has the College of Letters, Arts, and Sciences. It also has 17 profession schools, including Engineering, Cinematic Art, Fine Arts, Music, Business, Architecture, Law, and Medicine, just to name a few.</li>
</ol>

<p>More importantly, however, USC encourages double majors and also encourages interdisciplinary studies and cooperation between schools. For example, for last fall's "Demo Game Day," students from three schools worked together on teams to create video games. USC</a> Viterbi School of Engineering : Viterbi Game Day Builds USC Stature as National Center for Interactive Arts Students came from the Viterbi School of Engineering, the Roski School of Fine Arts, and the School of Cinematic Arts. These were students "from computer science, interactive media, fine arts, animation, and composers from the School of Music."</p>

<ol>
<li>USC is a vibrant campus with some unique buildings. For example, the Bovard Auditorium is a beautiful facility that hosts very diverse events from Ladysmith Black Mambazo to Tom Brockaw. For photos, see Bovard</a> Auditorium - University of Southern California </li>
</ol>

<p>When we visited in February, the flowers were blooming. (We left VA in a snowstorm.) The campus is not too big and students walk, use "long boards" (skateboards), or ride bikes called "beach cruisers" everywhere. These cruisers are the exact opposite of mountain bikes. They have no gears, have baskets on the front, and come in great colors like pink, purple, lime green, etc. I think it would be hard to get too stressed out at USC with the longboards and pink cruisers sailing by you, surrounded by flowers blooming.</p>

<p>Some people talk about the "high crime" area around USC, but it did not seem too dangerous to us. Yes, it is an urban area. Yes, you would not walk around by yourself at 2 am off campus wearing your Ipod. But no campus is totally safe, and common sense goes a long way. (Note GT is in a similar-type neighborhood in Atlanta.)</p>

<ol>
<li>The student body is diverse and very nice. Eleven percent are first-generation college. We met many students and all of them were friendly. I went to an annual hip-hop dance showcase which had some amazing dancers. Even the dancers who were less than amazing received applause from the very enthusiastic and supportive audience. I talked to some students in the audience who were eager to share their we-love-USC stories. One was from Canada and the other from Northern California.</li>
</ol>

<p>USC has students from all over the world with different backgrounds and ethnicities. The students were wearing all kinds of outfits. We saw prepsters, mini-skirts with cowboys boots, lots of USC shirts, long shorts, short shorts, and everything in between. There was not one main look.</p>

<p>S went to two club sport activites (there are over 600 student organizations), and the students were very welcoming. </p>

<p>He also met a aerospace engineering student who was on USC's Design/Build/Fly team and who invited him to the team's lab where he met other members of the team. They explained how the team designs, builds, and flies (hopefully) a plane that will compete in a national competition based on mandated specs. (The team icompeted this past weekend, 4/18/08, in Wichita, KS, and came in around 10th out of 50 or 60 teams.)</p>

<ol>
<li><p>USC has almost a $4 billion endowment. Though this is not at the same level as Harvard or Stanford, last year USC raised over $450 million. Recently, USC received $25 million, the largest ever made by an African American to a U.S. institution of higher learning. (The donor made the gift in honor of her husband, a "49 Marshall School grad.) Even people who never went to USC seem to give it money. Why? Because it is easy to fall in love with USC and to believe in what USC is accomplishing. The Viterbi has received several major gifts in the past several years.</p></li>
<li><p>USC works closely with industry to help place students. For example, at the Demo Game Day I mentioned above the best of the best attended:</p></li>
</ol>

<p>
[quote]

Industry representation included Applied Minds, THQ, EA LA, EA Mobile, Activision, Northrup Grummann, Disney Interactive Studios, Digital Domain, Emsense, Disney VR Studios, Sony Online Entertainment, Sony Computer Enteratinmane of America, Steamboat Ventures, Blizzard, Google, Insomniac Games, Naughtdog Games, iSportGames, and Creative Artists Agency.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>One of the nice aerospace students we met told us that her department had a "Shadow Day" where students shadowed industry people around for the day. For her company, she selected a major player in the aviation industry. At the end of her day, her host asked her to come back in the summer for an internship because he was so impressed with her. </p>

<ol>
<li><p>Though USC has around 16,000 undergraduates, the Viterbi School and the people there go out of their way to make you feel part of a much smaller group. They have activities for the engineering students and crazy contests which involve building concrete canoes and walking on water. (And yes, I mean literally!) They are also interested in all aspects of their engineering students, not just the math and science parts. For example, this past January the actor Alan Alda spent a day at the Viterbi School talking to the students about public speaking.</p></li>
<li><p>I don't know if your S is interested, but USC has honor dorms. I don't know about GT.</p></li>
<li><p>I know it sounds crazy, but I have to list the USC Marching Band. Those of you who have watched and heard them play (especially "TUSK") will agree.</p></li>
</ol>

<p>We also found the admission people to be nice, helpful, and concerned. These included those in the main USC Undergraduate Admissions Office (especially Director Timothy Brunold who also makes a great emcee) and those in the Viterbi Admissions Office (especially Director Matthew O'Pray). The Viterbi faculty and students were the same.</p>

<p>What also impressed me about USC is that unlike some schools that dwell on the past, USC focuses on the future. I see USC going nowhere but up in the coming years. I think that even if S selects a different school for his undergraduate studies (he's still deciding, and there's only a few days left before May 1st), he will come back to USC for a graduate degree. Hope this helps. Best of luck in your decision.</p>

<p>Go to USC, and I'll wave to you when they come to play UCLA at the Rose Bowl next December. My season tickets are in section 26 ;)</p>

<p>Clearly Tech is better than USC in aerospace, but do the other things that phorid mention outweigh that? Also take a look at where the aerospace industry is located. Lots of it on the west coast.</p>

<p>Phorid: where in Virginia? My son was a May graduate of USC, and we lived in Fairfax County at the time. BTW, very elegant writeup. I loved the USC campus--green, immaculate, compact. It was a delight sitting on the steps of the bookstore watching the diverse parade of obviously happy students walk, bicycle, and skateboard by.</p>

<p>phorid, thank you very much for your long and detail opinion. It definitely helps us a lot. My son read it too.</p>

<p>Please keep talking. Any serious engineering student, parents over there? We like to hear your opinion.</p>

<p>
[quote]
You already know that USC offers a wide variety of majors and minors, including over 150 majors and 120 minors

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Well, to be fair, USC's large number of majors has more to do with USC's marketing scheme than substance. This is not the first time I heard someone talking about that large number; I guess their marketing is working really well....
USC</a> Catalogue: Undergraduate Education: Undergraduate Degree Programs : Degree Programs
As an engineer with a chemE degree, I think having 6 different majors in that department when all it is is just different specializations/concentrations is ridiculous. Pretty much all chemE departments in other schools have several specializations but they just don't count the way USC does--they have only <em>one</em> ChemE major. </p>

<p>Other than that, I don't know enough about aerospace to comment.</p>

<p>USC - smaller classes and better graduation rate</p>

<p>Hands down USC. Not only is it cheaper in your situation, but it has a more rounded program, and its location is vastly superior.</p>

<p>I'm not sure that you realize that Southern California has an very large aerospace industry. Boeing, Lockheed Martin, NASA, and other aerospace companies all recruit at USC.</p>

<p>California's</a> Ten Key Space Assets</p>

<p>It's not 8 hours from Oregon to Georgia. I think around 4-5 hours, if you are talking about a direct flight.</p>

<p>Search</a> - Engineering - Best Graduate Schools - Education - US News and World Report</p>

<p>USC and GA Tech are not far enough apart to justify the cost. Given that you are paying I think the extra 16K would be wise to save. He could buy a car! I think USC would be a fuller experience with a great chance to live in a wonderful city.</p>

<p>The linked information from UCLA, Ph.D. (Best Graduate Engineering Schools) and bicoastal07 (California's Ten Key Space Assets) provide a lot information. The Undergraduate Aerospace major ranking (GTech 2) and Engineering School ranking are the main factors that bothers us a lot. </p>

<p>Please keep talking, 4 days left, your input is greatly appreciated.</p>

<p>JPL in Pasadena, CA has a lot of work/research with NASA. Pasadena is a town over to LA.</p>

<p>The "overall" engineering ranking in post #12 is a joke. The low PA scores assessed by program directors and recruiters for USC should be enough to indicate this ranking is unreliable. But the rest of metrics works magically well for USC. Department rankings are much more accurate and people look at those, not overall ranking, as their rough gauge to pick graduate programs. That said, I've heard that GaTech is very graduate oriented. So maybe USC is a better choice after all.</p>

<p>Thank you for all the valuable input.
From the post so far, it seams that no one really care about the rating on Major and Engineering department. If my son is also interested in going to a good school for graduate degree, could we still ignore the high rating from GeTech (Engineering 4, Aerospace 2)? We totally agree that USC is good all-around, especially it is in west coast. Did we eliminate our son's further by not choosing the top engineering school?</p>

<p>Hi, I'am an engineering student here at Georgia Tech. I had to choose between UIUC and Tech. Tech's a great engineering school, if he's really passionate about his field then I'd recommend Tech. Tech probably has better research and co-op options, but again it's the harder of the two, quite rigorous. Go to Tech if you're up for the rigor, you won't regret it, Ranked 2 aerospace speaks volumes about its aerospace program.
On the other hand, USC has more majors and fields, if he still wants to explore around USC might be better.</p>

<p>
[quote]
If my son is also interested in going to a good school for graduate degree, could we still ignore the high rating from GeTech (Engineering 4, Aerospace 2)?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Yes. I've seen/heard/read students from UCI get into MIT, UPenn, CalTech, etc.. UCI ranks a lot lower than USC. I think as long as the ranking of your undergraduate is in the top 20 schools.</p>

<p>well, this posting is a month late, but here goes:</p>

<p>I graduated from Georgia Tech a few years ago and I now work for JPL. I am very surprised by the out-of-state tuition now ($27k?? that's almost like Ann Arbor!). Classes (at least for me) were very comprehensive, complete, and challenging. I had two excellent, excellent professors who somehow had faith enough in me (S. Ruffin and B. Braun), tell your kid to talk to them. :)</p>

<p>The one major difference I felt I had between GT and maybe another school is that ... I didn't have a normal college experience. :) studied a lot, didn't mature very socially, but I did get to do a lot of cool stuff -- fly on NASA's KC-135 "Vomit Comet" , visit Greece on a conference trip, intern for Boeing and JPL, do research which eventually got me a job at JPL.</p>

<p>Now, i'm contemplating a master's at USC (right now)...so I think, provided your son does well (and he probably will), he'll be fine at both. I mean, USC and GT? Both are top schools. I've heard that...USC is univ-of-spoiled children, hehe, but then again maybe the aero/astro program has really improved. </p>

<p>the only warning i give to those going to GT Aero: the success rate is very much like the aero industry. there is no second place. the work is extremely comprehensive, esp. for "kids" between 18-22. You will spend lots of time studying. You will get to know more about thermodynamics, structures, orbital mechanics, controls, spacecraft design, costing, hypersonics, Entry/Descent/Landing than you ever wanted to know. </p>

<p>but like the aero industry, lots of ppl fail out. it's not very forgiving. </p>

<p>GT AE BS 2006
been working at JPL on Mars Rover since graduation.</p>

<p>I am an engineer working in LA so I have quite a few coworkers that graduated from USC. I've also worked with engineers from Berkeley and Stanford (more from the former). The USC ones tend to have larger variance in terms of technical skills. Again, I am not talking about intelligence here as schools don't make one smarter (a bit of an oversimplification). I am referring to certain technique, methods, and knowledge that I expect they've learned or been exposed to before but they didn't seem to have them. That's not to say they are not good workers. They perform very well at work but 90% of our work doesn't require you to pull things you learned from school. :) The work for the poster above me, on the other hand, seems to be much more technical. Anyway, my point is the program at USC is likely not as rigorous as GaTech but you will probably have a more-balanced and less pressured life at USC.</p>