<p>Hello! This is my first post... I've been a lurker for some time and I finally decided to join mostly because I've been debating this question a lot lately and I don't know what to do! </p>
<p>I got my financial aid package from UVA today and saw that I got an amazing deal... all I would really have to worry about is 5,050 in loans (unsubsidized stafford)... everything else is covered by grants, BUT I also have an incredible full ride scholarship to the University of Richmond that also gives a 3000 grant for summer research (the only thing this scholarship doesn't cover is books... everything else is covered). Money is an issue, which is why I was so happy to see my financial aid package from UVA, but I don't know what to do. I like both schools, but I wonder if it is worth it to get into debt for UVA and Echols or if it is better to simply take my Richmond Scholars Scholarship.</p>
<p>Any advice, help, info about why one school is better than the other would be awesome. I would like to go to law school so if one might give me a better chance, let me know as well. </p>
<p>Well if strictly talking about law school, UVa would better prepare you for that as it has a very good law program and its own Law School is very high ranked. Anyways, I don’t think that would be much of a debt to accumulate if you really have a preference for UVa, but if you’re equal going both ways, then you might want to just consider what you’re doing. And if that is law school, I would think UVa is better, but then again, I don’t know much about Richmond.</p>
<p>If you are definitely thinking that you will go to law school, I’d take the full ride from Richmond. Going to UVa won’t make that much of a difference. But given that law firms are laying off, and that competition for good jobs after law school is fierce, UVa might be a better choice if you aren’t certain about law school.</p>
<p>I’m from the Richmond area and I think you would find Charlottesville is a much better college environment.</p>
<p>avantgarde20, I am just a mom but here is my 2 cents worth… My daughter is interested in doing the same thing (law). What are you interested in studying for undergrad? You may want to consider which school has the best program in that. Both schools are great and Richmond has a good ranking and is a nice school (and I am sure you know that they will allow you into the law school without the lsat as long as you have the gpa if you go there). If you plan to have to spend money on grad school, you may want to save money on undergrad. I do know someone who went to UVA and got a full ride to a law school. I think it depends on you and what you want for the next four years. You have to look at what both schools offer and decide which is better for you and if you feel UVA is worth the extra cost to you. Did you visit both schools and get a feel for them? Good luck with your choice.</p>
<p>Our son was accepted to both UVa and the U. of Richmond, so I want to keep this thread alive! My wife and I graduated from UVa way back in 1978, so we know and like the school very well. It certainly has a great, national reputation – more than Richmond, I believe. On the other hand, it’s big, and has little useful advising or meaningful contact with your professors. UVA is beautiful (especially the Lawn), but I have to say Richmond seems more beautiful in general. I prefer C’ville to the city of Richmond, but the city of Richmond is pretty good. The U. of Richmond has a fine reputation academically. It’s a personal matter, but I think our son might be happier there, given its small size and tighter personal relationships. And if you have a free ride at Richmond, it really is important to figure out where you will be happiest.</p>
<p>Virginiaman-Confused about your statement that UVa “has little useful advising or meaningful contact with your professors.” Son has not found that to be the case. Both of these are great school so cannot go wrong. My guess would be that UVa is more diverse.</p>
<p>Sevmom, re advising, that was my experience ages ago, but it was recently echoed by an acquaintance whose son is an Echols Scholar there currently – he said he is disappointed with the advising or lack thereof.</p>
<p>What a coincidence! i had just replied to your thread virginiaman at the UR forum. Thanks for the advice everyone. Please keep it coming… I finally managed to narrow it down to UVA and Richmond after giving up six other schools and it is proving difficult to make one big final decision. Personally, I would be happy at either school. The UR offer is very tempting because it would also cover two semesters abroad (and I really do want to travel abroad), but I can’t help but wonder if the prestige UVA has might be a bad thing to give up; is the prestige of a school really that important in law school admissions? I have found that it isn’t, but then there are some that say it is… I guess it is just hard to give up the idea of a free education.</p>
<p>I don’t know enough about Richmond to voice an opinion re: choice of schools, but I do need to voice another opinion re: the comment that UVa provides little meaningful contact with professors. D is a 4th year in McIntire. Her experience with professors has been overwhelmingly positive. In fact, in my opinion, it has been perhaps the most amazing part of her UVa experience. Daily email communication, office hours, lunches, dinners, students out to pizza after class, cook outs at professors homes…that has been constant and standard throughout her four years. As an alum from another large public university, I have been honestly awed by D’s connections and bond with her professors. Her stories have amazed me.</p>
<p>Don’t give it up! My god, free travel abroad? UVA is not that much better than U Richmond! It is not a joke school, it really is very good. Not only that, the scholarship you won is a very exclusive scholarship. That would be an incredible feather in your cap.</p>
<p>“UVA is not that much better than U Richmond!”</p>
<p>This is clearly a joke. UofR is a regional school with regional grad programs not known outside of Virginia and perhaps D.C. UVA is a nationally known university with top graduate programs. U of R IS a good school, but is not in the same league of UVA and its peers (Georgetown, UC Berkeley, UCLA, Duke, W&M, etc).</p>
<p>And btw, the prestige of your undergrad is extremely important when trying to get into a top law school. Just take a look at UVA’s incoming 2011 law school class and see where the majority of its students are coming from. </p>
<p>Either way, you are making out well. For undergrad, it won’t make that much of a difference. With that being said, I would choose Richmond. You could apply to their Pre-Law Honors, which would guarantee you a spot at their Law School (68th in the Nation and rising), and you wouldn’t have to take the LSATs. Look into the programs more, but with finances being an issue and Richmond offering you a full ride, PLUS the opportunity to go abroad, PLUS extra money for financial research over the summer, you can’t go wrong. I can’t even find a website for UVa Pre-Law but I would still check out the website below for Richmond:</p>
<p>wahoomb…that makes no sense. They also took only one from Middlebury and one from Brandeis but three from Liberty. So much for national prestige.</p>
<p>Wahoomb has made an interesting and useful contribution. It seems to me that if you want to go to UVa’s law school you are probably better off going to UVa undergrad. Those are pretty dramatic statistics, even accounting for UVa’s greater size. I suppose that the disparity is due not only to UVa students scoring higher on standardized tests like the LSAT (Avantgarde will do equally well on that at either school), but also due to what I hear that it’s hard to make A’s at Richmond. And I would add that it’s a tough market for lawyers these days, and going to UVa Law rather than Richmond Law would certainly be the better choice. On the other hand, Avantgarde20 is likely to be a star student at Richmond and thus stand out more in applications to law school, so he might well get into UVa Law coming from there. And if that’s the case, and Richmond is more to his liking given the merit scholarship and smaller college, then he could follow his heart. But it’s obviously a personal decision.</p>
<p>How far are Middlebury and Brandeis from UVA? The fact that UofR which is only an hour away from UVA and it only sends 1 student to UVA law (the best law school in the state of VA and a top law school–ranked No. 10), tells you something. 54 UVA undergrads are going to be 1Ls at UVA law, that’s how many are enrolling not how many got accepted (many more got accepted, they’re probably choosing to go to schools like Harvard and Columbia). The OP needs to look how many students U of R sends to top law schools. If they have that information, use it to your advantage. </p>
<p>Btw, this is how UC Berkeley Law (ranked 6th in the nation) used to deal with where their applicants went to undergrad. If there was a student coming from UVA, his/her GPA would get extra points, if the student went to American, his/her GPA would be lowered. They no longer do this (or so they say), but it just goes to show that where you go for undergrad, is very important if you want to go to a T-14. </p>
<p>OP: Good luck making your decision, I’m not trying to persuade, but I’m just giving you some facts that you should consider before making a decision.</p>
<p>avantgarde20, first off, congratulations on your accomplishments; all of your hard work has paid off wonderfully! I am a UR grad, so my two cents is going to be biased, but I am also a 40 something mom who values the fact that you would be going to a very fine university for absolutely nothing and with the opportunity to study abroad for basically nothing. I wouldn’t be able to turn that down personally. Richmond has some dynamic professors in what you want to study and, as referred to in an earlier post, it is a tight knit school with so much personal attention. I loved my four years there and it has only gotten better since I left. Have you had an opportunity to visit? Beautiful place and the facilities are amazing.</p>
<p>The school isn’t UVA, but in many ways that is a good thing, as it offers other attributes that only a small LAC can. In my opinion, there isn’t that much difference between the two schools to turn away that much money/opportunity. Obviously it’s ultimately up to you, but if you think of yourself 20 years from now…with your law degree from anywhere (and I don’t believe you will have any problem getting into a great law school with an undergrad degree from UR)… having spent time abroad- which you might not be able to afford with law school costs…and having no undergrad debt, it is a pretty nice picture! Good luck to you and again congratulations! :)</p>
<p>Wow, thanks everyone for the awesome responses. It is giving me a lot to think about, even though I think my decision is slowly settling itself. </p>
<p>Virginiaman: it is hard to make As at Richmond, but, thankfully, it isn’t impossible and with the right amount of work and effort, it is actually very feasible (I was lucky enough to meet quite a few Richmond Scholars who have done it!). Thank you for your input. It’s nice to hear from someone in a similar position. lol. </p>
<p>Wahoomb, thanks for the tip: I’m going to contact UR about their stats as far as Law School, and thanks for the link. You obviously know a lot and you’re definitely helping me make a far more informed decision. Again, if you have anything else to add, please do. Your posts are teaching me a lot. =) </p>
<p>KandKsmom: yay, a UR grad! This balances the information in the thread. I spent a month there back in 07 for Gov. School, and then I’ve visited again not too long ago. It is very beautiful and the people are friendly. I have thought about the whole ‘no debt’ thing a lot. It really is a nice picture. Richmond is also becoming very appealing due to the fact that I want to study international relations and psychology and they’re offering me enough grants and opportunities to do a lot of research in both areas. =) Thanks for your input.</p>
<p>avantgarde, one last thing about UR. If you do end up going there, please make sure you take a class from Dr. John Treadway (History/International Relations) and if possible from Dr. Ed Ayers, president of UR. Treadway is a tremendous professor; a real gem. </p>
<p>Dr. Ayers is one of the nation’s leading scholars and a professor (yes, a university professor that teaches undergrads!) in the history of the American South. UVA’s loss was UR’s gain with that hiring.</p>