I’m not at all vaccine hesitant and I like seeing what is happening out there. I don’t want people to keep it shoved under a rug. When it’s out there it can be looked at and improved. If there truly are post vax cases showing up at medical facilities at greater than expected numbers, something’s off. This isn’t the same as self-reporting via VAERS.
Perhaps a batch was bad - if so - others who received that batch should know about it and get a different one.
Perhaps it’s time for boosters, and if so, plenty of us want to know.
Things happen. Sometimes it’s purely the odds, but other times, esp if the odds aren’t holding up somewhere, there’s another reason and problem solving can help vs pretending it isn’t happening.
Presumably, you are concerned about the breakthrough case slides in that link.
A question is, within the <60 and >=60 age groups, did more medically vulnerable or more exposed (e.g. health care workers) people get vaccinated first in Israel? If so, that could be a reason that earlier vaccine recipients are having more breakthrough cases.
@TomSrOfBoston you are 100% correct. I read somewhere that “good” flu vaccines may be at best 50% effective, yet these 90% effective COVID vaccines aren’t good enough for some?
Also agree with you re: the breakthrough cases. When a member of the press or a celebrity or a government official who is vaccinated comes down with COVID, it makes the news. It’s not always mentioned that the symptoms are mild or that the person isn’t hospitalized. The exception is emphasized, and then is treated as the rule.
Looking at Israel’s data, not self-reported, Pfizer’s effective rate for getting symptomatic Covid has dropped to 40% with a confidence interval ranging from 8.7 to 61.2, so still really rough data, but their tracking cases vs month of last shot shows a bit of a correlation.
The good news is the VE for hospitalization and severe is still 88% and 91.4% respectively.
But personally, I can see why people, myself included, are eyeing boosters.
I wish they would break down a little more by age TBH, but I’m glad they’re providing data.
@TomSrOfBoston Thank you for pointing out that I might have a bias influencing my posts.
I try to be objective and make sure I’m getting high quality information and look at the data and research behind the headlines. I try to be diligent about this particularly because I am unvaccinated and need to assess my risk all the time.
In sharing the anecdotes about local breakthrough infections, which look as though they could be consistent with the data published by the Israeli government, my goal was not to discourage vaccination but rather to inform the people here who I know are concerned about the need for boosters to keep them and their families safe.
And, oh, boy, I am fighting conspiracy theories constantly and it’s awkward and exhausting and I don’t want to be that way myself.
I’ve stated it before, I am currently putting off getting vaccinated because I try not to promote the market for experimentation in fetal tissue research and object to the fetal cell lines used particularly in the J and J vaccine, but I am also concerned about the cell lines used the testing of the MRNA vaccines. So that is clearly my bias and I’m sure everyone has had enough of me going on and on about it. But as of two or three weeks ago, my lab tests are still showing immunity as they have since March when I first became eligible for the vaccine.
To follow up, it looks like our state is including covid vaccines in the state immunization database. It seems to be accessible to medical professionals, community public health workers, and individuals, presumably for their own records. Lol.
I got curious to see if my doctor’s office has a record of my vax. Nope. It also says I’m overdue for an MMR booster. When we return from our Anniversary trip I’ll have to get on that and can show them my card from CVS so they can update their system. I’ve no idea if the state has record or not.
I think we are somewhat close in age. Have you had an MMR booster before? I only had one booster and that was thirty years ago…. I’m wondering if I am am due as well.
ETA: I just checked. Only two shots are necessary for MMR.
MMR booster? I don’t think I get those (although I had measles as a child and don’t think I’ve had an “R” shot since I was pregnant).
Mine is showing I need a Dtap booster, so have that on my list.
I received my covid shot through my health care provider clinic, so it is on my ‘record.’ I know if I receive vaccines at the Safeway pharmacy they are not recorded on my clinic chart but the nurses are happy to add them if I tell them (flu shot, shingles, etc.)
People have threatened their spouses with divorce for wanting to get vaccinated.
I don’t think every parent would be above withdrawing funding for college if their child were getting vaccinated against their will, 18 or not. And not every might be able to deal with going behind their parents back.
Once the kid’s college requires it, the parent can back down while saving face.
From a few articles I’ve read it seems that colleges mandating vaccines may provide a significant boost to vaccine uptake among students. Often the kids are reluctant but they admit that if remaining unvaccinated means not attending school, they’ll get vaccinated because their education is important.
Once all or almost all people in the vulnerable age groups, all the way down to middle aged, are vaccinated (which I imagine is pretty much the case in the North East/mid Atlantic now), the virus will move towards two groups: the unvaccinated young, who will only rarely be hospitalised, and the vulnerable old or those with underlying conditions who happen to be among those for whom the vaccine hasn’t worked perfectly, as happens with all vaccines, and who WILL get hospitalised.
At some point mathematics determine that almost everyone in hospital will be vaccinated. There isn’t anyone else left to be hospitalised! But they will not overwhelm hospitals. That is what is happening in areas with low vaccine uptakes among the vulnerable, where the virus faces few to no obstacles.
Data aren’t going to tell a definitive story without a solid scientific theory behind them. They’re often used, and misused, as poor substitute for more sound and fundamental scientific understanding to “convince” some people of certain “facts”, especially in this age of internet. Virology isn’t a fully-developed science. Epidemiology is even more primitive. The truth is there’s an awful lot we don’t know about COVID-19.
Controlling behavior, bullying and abuse existed before Covid, and it’s a thornier problem to address than that of vaccine-reluctance. And, sadly, both sides have weaponized the vaccine. I’ve seen incredible rancor and strife within families as a result.
Those on the tail end of any abuse have the right not to disclose their decisions to their abuser, of course. Sad but necessary. Though I agree that using the school’s requirement is the easiest way out of a difficult situation.